anyone appeal successfully after being rejected?
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Original post by Iamet
I personally think that my ps is quite good. And i let few of my frds in cambridge to help me to look through it. They said there are no problems at all. And i ve got an offer from imperial so i guess there are no problems. Now i am trying to appeal to see whether there r a second chance
Imperial is an amazing University - in many ways better than Cambridge. Being in London is a HUGE advantage and certain departments are the best in UK/world leading. What do you want to do after Uni?
Original post by fluteflute
You clearly don't know about the Cambridge (and Oxford) undergraduate admissions procedure. You are making incorrect inferences (the system is completely different from the US). Listen to the people here who know a lot about the Cambridge (and Oxford) undergraduate admissions process.
I used to work for a company specialising in supporting people in their Oxbridge applications and have a 100% success rate in the, admittedly handful, group of people I have tutored into Oxford and 1 into Cambridge.
I also remember from my own application to Oxford, and indeed, was in the Oxbridge set at school - out of the 9 of us in the set, 6 went to Oxbridge, 2 to Ivy Leagues, 1 didn’t apply and went to art college instead.
I’m not claiming to be an expert by any means - I am not an Oxbridge tutor, but I do have some knowledge, and am not some arrogant undergraduate student jump up making comments on TSR. I, by my own admission, didn't say I was an expert on Cambridge, but I find the suggestion it is so different from every other world class university rather difficult to swallow. There might be some tutors who only look at academic success, but they are in the minority, and the intitial point scoring system that most universities operate will ensure you dont get an interview anyway, without a good extra curricular picture.
Original post by Iamet
I was rejected by cambridge yesterday, without any interview. And i wonder whether there are any procedural error because i got 4 As in AS level, with the average ums of 98.7. So is it common for people who have a result like me being rejected without any interview? And what should i do?
I know how you feel I was in the same boat last year. Maybe you applied to a really competitive college and they couldn't interview all eligible applicants. The best thing to do is move on. There are loads of other amazing unis, after all whose to say you would have gotten a place after interview. Or alternatively reapply but to a less competitive college like Homerton or Girton next year but I would advise against appealing as you are unlikely to be successful. If you are that desperate take my advice and reapply.
Original post by icouldntthinkofone
I assure you that they do care about extra-curriculars. Yes, they care about academic ability and potential - the latter being key. They have buckets of students applying with amazing grades, high UMS etc. I have been involved in recruiting for a world leading university (although admittedly not Cambridge) and how do you distinguish between candidates when they all show so much of the a-aforementioned? Exceptional potential can be displayed in a number of other ways - and indeed I was talking with a guy last week who was of Indian heritage about why the top 1/2 students were always Caucasian American/European on his courses, and the rest of the top 8 were almost always Asian. This guy had an MBA from Harvard, Masters from Stanford and undergrad at Uni of Virginia (ie smart cookie). He was saying it’s the ability to think outside the box, not just be academically smart - this is normally demonstrated through other activities, not purely grades.
So for example, the fact you play musical instruments will make you a more interesting, better rounded individual, and Im sure that would have benefitted your application somewhat. You must agree, surely? Or is Cambridge really different from the other Ivy Leagues, Oxford, Imperial/LSE etc (it does have a rep as being more academic than others)...
So for example, the fact you play musical instruments will make you a more interesting, better rounded individual, and Im sure that would have benefitted your application somewhat. You must agree, surely? Or is Cambridge really different from the other Ivy Leagues, Oxford, Imperial/LSE etc (it does have a rep as being more academic than others)...
I'm getting this information from the multiple people I have spoken to (access officers, admissions tutors) whilst helping at many access events. The university says ECs are not important. And yes, the UK system is very different to the US system where you need to have done lots of sport etc to get into a good university.
Original post by Iamet
Physics chemistry biology Maths
All of them.
But actually my situation is a bit special as i am an international applicant from hong kong, i am doing hkdse which is another education system recognized by cambridge
But of coz i have done AS as well
All of them.
But actually my situation is a bit special as i am an international applicant from hong kong, i am doing hkdse which is another education system recognized by cambridge
But of coz i have done AS as well
That explains it. The international competition is incredibly fierce. The other applicants have probably won numerous national/international competitions combined with insanely good references and hundreds of GCSEs and AS... you only did four ASs which could have had something to do with it.
Original post by Topaz_eyes
I'm getting this information from the multiple people I have spoken to (access officers, admissions tutors) whilst helping at many access events. The university says ECs are not important. And yes, the UK system is very different to the US system where you need to have done lots of sport etc to get into a good university.
Hmmm, surprising. Have you spoken to many people at Oxford/Imperial? That contradicts my experience with those unis I must say. What is it you study? I wonder if for subjects like Physics that is more true than say Economics or Management etc.
Original post by icouldntthinkofone
Hmmm, surprising. Have you spoken to many people at Oxford/Imperial? That contradicts my experience with those unis I must say. What is it you study? I wonder if for subjects like Physics that is more true than say Economics or Management etc.
I am a fourth year Physics student. I know nothing about Imperial, and a bit about Oxford from helping at joint Oxbridge access events. As far as I can tell, Oxford has a similar stance to Cambridge, but with more emphasis on GCSEs and less on AS levels (as they don't ask for your UMS).
Original post by Topaz_eyes
I am a fourth year Physics student. I know nothing about Imperial, and a bit about Oxford from helping at joint Oxbridge access events. As far as I can tell, Oxford has a similar stance to Cambridge, but with more emphasis on GCSEs and less on AS levels (as they don't ask for your UMS).
They look at GCSEs in any meaningful way?
Times have changed? They liked to see nothing below a B in my day - mainly As and A stars, but werent too fussed. Section 10, AS, extra curricular and then interview were what mattered...
Original post by Iamet
Thanks for your advice. But i am wondering whether having the ums average like 98.7 is just a bare minimum? As it is stated that the average ums of successful applicant is nearly 95
You'd be surprised at the number of students who also get such ums marks........cos a quite a few do and people with grades like A's and predictions like A*'s do get rejected.
As others have said, it's surprising you got outright rejected without even an interview with those sorts of grades, so there must have been some really big thing that they didn't like about your PS or the rest of your application that made them think you couldn't cut it. Asking for feedback is a good idea, but I don't think appealing would really get you anywhere - as I understand it that's only where they've based your rejection on stuff that's factually incorrect, which probably isn't the case.
Incidentally, OP you said you're from Hong Kong - did you give any indication that you wouldn't be available to go to the UK in December? As I understand it Cambridge are generally very strict about interviews and if you can't get to the UK (and they can't offer any alternative) then that might be why they've rejected you.
Long story short, asking for feedback is your best option.
Incidentally, OP you said you're from Hong Kong - did you give any indication that you wouldn't be available to go to the UK in December? As I understand it Cambridge are generally very strict about interviews and if you can't get to the UK (and they can't offer any alternative) then that might be why they've rejected you.
Long story short, asking for feedback is your best option.
Original post by icouldntthinkofone
Hmmm, surprising. Have you spoken to many people at Oxford/Imperial? That contradicts my experience with those unis I must say. What is it you study? I wonder if for subjects like Physics that is more true than say Economics or Management etc.
I can say without any doubt that Oxford do not care one single bit about extra curricular activities that have nothing to do with academia. They honestly do not want to know how good you are at rugby or flute playing, they want to know how smart you are, how you think and how you come to conclusions on discussions related to the subject you are applying for.
Reading around your subject and showing true passion in an intellectual way, count for so much, once grades, tests and essays have been judged. I do not have first hand knowledge of the US system, but I can easily imagine that because of the strong sports scholarship system in place there, that they probably do consider EC's more.
To the OP, As others have suggested it is probably best to move on and focus your efforts on gaining successful entry to other universities that you applied to. For each place on that course you are competing with 3 other applicants, so your application would have to be amazing in every way to stand a good chance of interview, especially as Queens do not run any tests to support an applicants marks.
Original post by icouldntthinkofone
I used to work for a company specialising in supporting people in their Oxbridge applications and have a 100% success rate in the, admittedly handful, group of people I have tutored into Oxford and 1 into Cambridge.
I also remember from my own application to Oxford, and indeed, was in the Oxbridge set at school - out of the 9 of us in the set, 6 went to Oxbridge, 2 to Ivy Leagues, 1 didn’t apply and went to art college instead.
I’m not claiming to be an expert by any means - I am not an Oxbridge tutor, but I do have some knowledge, and am not some arrogant undergraduate student jump up making comments on TSR. I, by my own admission, didn't say I was an expert on Cambridge, but I find the suggestion it is so different from every other world class university rather difficult to swallow. There might be some tutors who only look at academic success, but they are in the minority, and the intitial point scoring system that most universities operate will ensure you dont get an interview anyway, without a good extra curricular picture.
I also remember from my own application to Oxford, and indeed, was in the Oxbridge set at school - out of the 9 of us in the set, 6 went to Oxbridge, 2 to Ivy Leagues, 1 didn’t apply and went to art college instead.
I’m not claiming to be an expert by any means - I am not an Oxbridge tutor, but I do have some knowledge, and am not some arrogant undergraduate student jump up making comments on TSR. I, by my own admission, didn't say I was an expert on Cambridge, but I find the suggestion it is so different from every other world class university rather difficult to swallow. There might be some tutors who only look at academic success, but they are in the minority, and the intitial point scoring system that most universities operate will ensure you dont get an interview anyway, without a good extra curricular picture.
You may have some knowledge, but when what you say clashes with the half a dozen people here who have either been through the system, or are actually going through the system, then it's time for you to reconsider. You admit you're not an expert on Cambridge - but some of us here are.
Of course tutors are humans, and humans will never make decisions 100% based on academia, but Cambridge most certainly does not include extra-curricular activities (i.e. sport, music or other elements unrelated to the course the applicant is applying for) as an even vaguely important part of the process, and they would be completely insulted by the suggestion they would use them formally in a points system.
Original post by icouldntthinkofone
Hmmm, surprising.
Your intervention in this thread has been less than helpful. Not only do you lack the necessary knowledge (which is evident from every post you have made) but you have admitted you have no useful knowledge. Yet you repeatedly extrapolate from your claimed experience elsewhere that what you have been told by knowledgeable people in this thread can't possibly be true and, now, is surprising. This does your analytical thinking skills no credit at all. Your user name is well chosen, it seems.
The (extremely well-known) fact is that neither Oxford nor Cambridge pay the slightest attention to irrelevant extracurricular activities when judging candidates. If you continue to not believe let me refer you to what they, themselves, say on the matter:
Oxford
http://www.ox.ac.uk/admissions/undergraduate_courses/applying_to_oxford/interviews/interview_videos.html
Are extra-curricular activities taken in to account?
Please remember that tutors make their decisions based on your academic abilities and potential alone: extra-curricular activities do not form part of the selection criteria in any subject. However, they may ask a question or two about your extra-curricular activities, particularly at the start of the interview, as you are settling in. They may ask you why you enjoy a particular activity and what you have learnt from it. They may also be interested in how you have balanced your time between studies and other activities.
Please remember that tutors make their decisions based on your academic abilities and potential alone: extra-curricular activities do not form part of the selection criteria in any subject. However, they may ask a question or two about your extra-curricular activities, particularly at the start of the interview, as you are settling in. They may ask you why you enjoy a particular activity and what you have learnt from it. They may also be interested in how you have balanced your time between studies and other activities.
Cambridge
http://www.study.cam.ac.uk/undergraduate/info/policy.html
Detailed selection criteria vary from subject to subject but in all we are looking for:
academic ability and potential;
motivation and suitability for the chosen course;
commitment and self-discipline.
Every applicant is considered individually in an holistic assessment using all the information available to us:
their academic record, including GCSE and AS (or equivalent) grades and marks and A Level (or equivalent) grades or predictions†, this record being considered in the context of the quality (but not type) of schools/colleges at which it was achieved;
the school/college reference;
the personal statement;
submitted work, where requested;
test results, where a written test forms part of the assessment;
performance at interview, if interviewed.
Ultimately, all admissions decisions are based on academic criteria, and excellence in an extra-curricular activity will never ‘compensate’ for lower academic potential.
academic ability and potential;
motivation and suitability for the chosen course;
commitment and self-discipline.
Every applicant is considered individually in an holistic assessment using all the information available to us:
their academic record, including GCSE and AS (or equivalent) grades and marks and A Level (or equivalent) grades or predictions†, this record being considered in the context of the quality (but not type) of schools/colleges at which it was achieved;
the school/college reference;
the personal statement;
submitted work, where requested;
test results, where a written test forms part of the assessment;
performance at interview, if interviewed.
Ultimately, all admissions decisions are based on academic criteria, and excellence in an extra-curricular activity will never ‘compensate’ for lower academic potential.
Original post by Iamet
Physics chemistry biology Maths
All of them.
But actually my situation is a bit special as i am an international applicant from hong kong, i am doing hkdse which is another education system recognized by cambridge
But of coz i have done AS as well
All of them.
But actually my situation is a bit special as i am an international applicant from hong kong, i am doing hkdse which is another education system recognized by cambridge
But of coz i have done AS as well
Cambridge interviews everybody who has a plausible chance of an offer-80% or more of applicants. They state repeatedly that ECs are not important-they are never a cause of rejection. Whilst they reject plenty of able candidates after interview rejections before interview are usually for wrong subjects offered or poor UMS.
There is no way that a UMS average of 98.7 in four science/maths subjects does not indicate a realistic chance of an offer.
This implies either an error- they are rare but they do happen. Or it means in some way you have failed to complete all the application processes correctly. This could be to do with interview, important emails going into your junk folder, poor English scores and so on. I do think you should send an email to the admissions tutor saying "Given that I had a UMS average in four sciences of 98.7% I was disappointed to get a pre-interview rejection. I would be most grateful if you could explain the reason for this". If its an error they will soon find out.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by icouldntthinkofone
I used to work for a company specialising in supporting people in their Oxbridge applications and have a 100% success rate in the, admittedly handful, group of people I have tutored into Oxford and 1 into Cambridge.
I also remember from my own application to Oxford, and indeed, was in the Oxbridge set at school - out of the 9 of us in the set, 6 went to Oxbridge, 2 to Ivy Leagues, 1 didn’t apply and went to art college instead.
I’m not claiming to be an expert by any means - I am not an Oxbridge tutor, but I do have some knowledge, and am not some arrogant undergraduate student jump up making comments on TSR. I, by my own admission, didn't say I was an expert on Cambridge, but I find the suggestion it is so different from every other world class university rather difficult to swallow. There might be some tutors who only look at academic success, but they are in the minority, and the intitial point scoring system that most universities operate will ensure you dont get an interview anyway, without a good extra curricular picture.
I also remember from my own application to Oxford, and indeed, was in the Oxbridge set at school - out of the 9 of us in the set, 6 went to Oxbridge, 2 to Ivy Leagues, 1 didn’t apply and went to art college instead.
I’m not claiming to be an expert by any means - I am not an Oxbridge tutor, but I do have some knowledge, and am not some arrogant undergraduate student jump up making comments on TSR. I, by my own admission, didn't say I was an expert on Cambridge, but I find the suggestion it is so different from every other world class university rather difficult to swallow. There might be some tutors who only look at academic success, but they are in the minority, and the intitial point scoring system that most universities operate will ensure you dont get an interview anyway, without a good extra curricular picture.
I'm at Oxford but I strongly considered Cambridge so know a bit about it. I was told by multiple admissions tutors that extra curricular activities count for nothing (unless they are directly related to your subject). All they care about is academic performance.
Original post by Iamet
I was rejected by cambridge yesterday, without any interview. And i wonder whether there are any procedural error because i got 4 As in AS level, with the average ums of 98.7. So is it common for people who have a result like me being rejected without any interview? And what should i do?
E-mail them and ask for feedback.
Original post by Iamet
I was rejected by cambridge yesterday, without any interview. And i wonder whether there are any procedural error because i got 4 As in AS level, with the average ums of 98.7. So is it common for people who have a result like me being rejected without any interview? And what should i do?
According to the official Cambridge guide to the Winter Pool, all candidates (apart from those applying for Maths or Medicine) with an average UMS of 93% across their three best AS subjects MUST be pooled:
http://www.admin.cam.ac.uk/offices/admissions/handbook/appendices/winterpoolofficers.pdf
This suggests that it is well worth your while contacting Queen's to see why you were rejected outright.
BTW, I remember a candidate from last year who was rejected without interview. He and his head teacher appealed and the college realised they had made a mistake and reinstated him for interview. He didn't succeed, but it shows that errors happen and can be corrected.
Original post by Iamet
Phy natsci at queens' college
What were your individual UMS marks in each subject/paper? What were your GCSEs like? Did you have to submit written work?
If it was a case of that you had got at least 95 in each paper/unit and still got rejected I would be very surprised unless you wrote a poor personal statement, poor reference etc.
Also I can vouch that the admissions tutors do not give a monkey's uncle about your ECs. If you don't excel academically and I mean consistently getting high marks not just scraping grades, chances are you won't get called to interview as you would most likely struggle with the work if you got an offer.
Without seeing individual ums scores I can't say for sure but with a 98% average, something doesn't seem right.
Without seeing individual ums scores I can't say for sure but with a 98% average, something doesn't seem right.
Original post by james22
E-mail them and ask for feedback.
This.
Otherwise you will be continually wondering. Despite the advice everyone is giving here, none of us are the tutors that made the decision, so it's all speculation. For the real answer, you need to speak to them directly.
Once Cambridge have replied to your email, you will then know whether it's worth appealing or not.
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