The Student Room Group

Doctor Who - Discussion Thread III (no untagged future spoilers)

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Original post by GeekChicc
Nine was my favourite too! :biggrin:

Why is everyone over analysing the show? It's only supposed to be entertainment and it certainly entertained me.


Yes!! Nine was the best!! And Russell T. Davis. Tis a shame their both hardly mentioned.
Original post by MusicIsMyPoison
I think the saddest part for me was the there was no interaction between Ten and Rose as well as Eleven because it may be the last time we see them on screen and it's quite upsetting that we didn't get to see them on screen one last time.


I was kind of upset about this too, BUT I thought it was almost as cool seeing the little hints between them. For example, whilst Ten couldn't see Rose, she could see him, and the little flashes of hurt and wanting were brilliant. And Ten's mention of 'Bad Wolf Girl' was good, too. I'm left to wonder if he ever went to find the aforementioned Bad Wolf Girl again.

But yeah, maybe Tentoo and Rose would've been nice.
Original post by Toppy
I'm hearing Capaldi made an appearance in the episode and I must have completely missed it. When did he appear?


I can't remember the exact point, but it was towards the end - it was only a very brief moment and we really only saw his eyes and forehead.
Original post by pierreboobvier
I was kind of upset about this too, BUT I thought it was almost as cool seeing the little hints between them. For example, whilst Ten couldn't see Rose, she could see him, and the little flashes of hurt and wanting were brilliant. And Ten's mention of 'Bad Wolf Girl' was good, too. I'm left to wonder if he ever went to find the aforementioned Bad Wolf Girl again.

But yeah, maybe Tentoo and Rose would've been nice.


There was something about the way both doctors said "Bad Wolf Girl?!" in a slightly shocked voice that was ominous, I suddenly started wondering if they knew something that John Hurt didn't and that Moment was playing a dirty game of some kind - it was sinister, almost not as if they just recognised the incident from their 'pasts'. That surprised, sinister note was left kind of hanging and unfulfilled.

I think we are going to get some elaborate plots coming up about how Gallifrey can be freed from it's 'frozen in time' status. That will be 13's job.
I don't understand why some of are you are confused by the time lock thing - it's not that hard to grasp that the Doctor forgets he was able to save Gallifrey, and perhaps the hurt that he destroyed it is what gives him the drive to save it when the opportunity arises.

As for the other, older Doctors knowing to appear - well Clara exists in all of the Doctor's timestream, perhaps she had something to do with it...
It really annoys me that we didn't find out how the Doctor and Clara escaped from the Doctor's timestream. It was all completely forgotten about. :facepalm: Sigh.
Original post by snowyowl
I don't understand why some of are you are confused by the time lock thing - it's not that hard to grasp that the Doctor forgets he was able to save Gallifrey, and perhaps the hurt that he destroyed it is what gives him the drive to save it when the opportunity arises.

As for the other, older Doctors knowing to appear - well Clara exists in all of the Doctor's timestream, perhaps she had something to do with it...


I don't think people are confused by it, rather they (we) are disappointed that the writers made no attempt whatsoever to justify what was otherwise just an incredibly convenient set of get-arounds. We're supposed to believe that this time-lock, which can't ever be entered, can suddenly and conveniently be entered thanks to the vague and unspecified capabilities of this sentient bomb, and that each Doctor happily forgets everything right back until the arbitrary point just before he met his past/future selves. It's not understanding what happened that is the problem, it's just that the writing seems lazy - "we'll get around that thing that had previously been an absolute constraint that couldn't be got around, and we'll make him conveniently forget everything so we don't have to explain any continuity errors".
Only things were that there was no interaction of Rose/bad wolf and 10 and 11. Therefore I didn't feel there was complete closure. Also I'm not sure if saving Gallifrey was the best of things, as the doctor had said before, the time war changed the Timelords and how they weren't as peaceful so it was best they didn't survive. So mixed messages there.

Apart from that it was great, loved the humour and delivery of the whole thing :biggrin:
Reply 2728
I thought it was fantastic - I know some people felt that it would have made the doctor a more interesting character had he killed all the daleks and all the Gallifreyans, but we have to remember that it is a family show. We probably all started watching when we were kids back in 2005, and now we've grown up and expect the show to grow with us. Which I think it has, but they do have to think about who they cater to as an audience.

I loved the ending, with all the doctors, it was amazing! They were right when they talked about how it would change direction for Doctor Who :smile:

I loved the humour as well, with the whole timey wimey thing :biggrin:
Reply 2729
Thought John Hurt was brilliant as the Doctor, Joanna Page less so as Queen Elizabeth I (more Miranda Richardson than Judi Dench), that was the only bit of bad casting in it though the rest (Tennant, Smith, Hurt, Coleman, Redgrave etc.) were very strong. Thought footage of the actual Time War itself was quite sparse (no Master, no Nightmare Child, no Dalek Emperor, no Cruciform etc.), I was also under the impression that the Doctor fought on the front line as well as using the Moment to end the war.

Moffat still did a good job on it though and has made a bold move in changing the narrative and history of the revived series. It was definitely an episode for the fans.

Two final questions:
1) How did the Doctor and Clara escape the Doctor's time stream from the series finale? Thought River Song said it would be impossible and that they'd be trapped.
2) What causes the regeneration of John Hurt's Doctor? Was it quite simply old age in his current incarnation like Hartnell?

(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by catyyy
I thought it was fantastic - I know some people felt that it would have made the doctor a more interesting character had he killed all the daleks and all the Gallifreyans, but we have to remember that it is a family show.


But we have to remember...that this was the basis for the character since the re-birth of the show - we're led to beleive that he did end the time war in a ball of fire. Only the last episode has changed that. Or has it only been a kids show since yesterday?
Original post by Hugs31
Thought John Hurt was brilliant as the Doctor, Joanna Page less so as Queen Elizabeth I (more Miranda Richardson than Judi Dench), that was the only bit of bad casting in it though the rest (Tennant, Smith, Hurt, Coleman, Redgrave etc.) were very strong. Thought footage of the actual Time War itself was quite sparse (no Master, no Nightmare Child, no Dalek Emperor, no Crucible etc.), I was also under the impression that the Doctor fought on the front line as well as using the Moment to end the war.

Moffat still did a good job on it though and has made a bold move in changing the narrative and history of the revived series. It was definitely an episode for the fans.

Two final questions:
1) How did the Doctor and Clara escape the Doctor's time stream from the series finale? Thought River Song said it would be impossible and that they'd be trapped.
2) What causes the regeneration of John Hurt's Doctor? Was it quite simply old age in his current incarnation like Hartnell?



Actually yeah, the one thing I would have changed is the fact that the Time War footage was pretty short. It would have been good to see a master cameo. Also to have seen some TIme Lord offensives to show it was a perpetual war rather then just the Daleks beating the Time Lords.

I'm hoping to see more Time War, either as flashbacks as the Doctor searches for Galifrey (or after he finds it and encounters some of the Time Lords who were changed by the war) - or as a prequel miniseries with Paul MgGann.
It was a bit disappointing tbh
Original post by Farseer
But we have to remember...that this was the basis for the character since the re-birth of the show - we're led to beleive that he did end the time war in a ball of fire. Only the last episode has changed that. Or has it only been a kids show since yesterday?


I don't think it changes the most important part of it - that he was willing to destroy all the Time Lords and all the Daleks. The only reason he didn't is that he was given another option by Bad Wolf girl letting future doctors into the time lock.

So it changes nothing about his character as he would have pressed the button. It just gives the writers a goldmine of new storylines - a search for Galifrey and possible encounters with war-scarred Time Lords.
there's one thing i didn't understand from the 50th, didn't david tennants doctor already find galafrey in his last episode where he regenerated and sent them back into the time lock because he thought they were too dangerous, that all makes sense but why now as matt smiths doctor is he trying to find galafrey again?
Original post by paddyman4
I don't think it changes the most important part of it - that he was willing to destroy all the Time Lords and all the Daleks. The only reason he didn't is that he was given another option by Bad Wolf girl letting future doctors into the time lock.

So it changes nothing about his character as he would have pressed the button. It just gives the writers a goldmine of new storylines - a search for Galifrey and possible encounters with war-scarred Time Lords.


Seeing your entire race burn and knowing that you caused it, I assume would have an effect on a person, I would have thought. Turn's out he ''forgot'' that he didn't do it and also imagined(?) that he did do it too - the 10th doctor (eccelston) said 'I watched it happen, I made it happen''. So from this point on the 12th doctor who for some reason didn't get his memory mixed up because of the time sync or something or other - and goes off to search for Gallifrey, conscience clear.

There are plenty of ways to introduce new storylines without re-working the histroy of events so far.

Original post by Sapphire123
there's one thing i didn't understand from the 50th, didn't david tennants doctor already find galafrey in his last episode where he regenerated and sent them back into the time lock because he thought they were too dangerous, that all makes sense but why now as matt smiths doctor is he trying to find galafrey again?


No, no - you're supposed to cheer at the cameo appearences. Thanks.

I think I'm done here, though. I'm glad that some of you enjoyed the episode - but for me, it was disappointing and following a weak season (with a couple of really good episodes), I think I'm done with the show.
(edited 10 years ago)
I have to say I'm fairly disappointed. I liked the idea that the Doctor did something terrible. I always had it in my head that he was just a normal soldier who was presented with this horrible opportunity and had to take it. It's what made Eccleston's Doctor so good. Last of the Time Lords etc.

I thought Tennant was excellent and definitely outshone Smith. I think for a lot of people, Tennant will always be the Doctor.

Seeing Capaldi was a nice touch, and Tom Baker at the end was brilliant. I'm not sure if it would have been overkill or not, but if he just came up to Smith and said 'Would you like a jelly baby?' I think I would have died!

I just really really wish Eccleston was in it, even as a cameo at the end when Hurt regenerated with the 'weight of the world' look in his eyes.

And what happened with the Zygons??

It was entertaining but it could have been a lot better.
Was I the only one who saw Eccleston more than once? He was there in the 13 doctors scene, and you could see his features appearing in the Hurt regeneration scene. It would have been nicer if there had been just a few seconds of him post-regeneration.

I have a question that I haven't spotted yet on this thread.

Why didn't 9 recognise Rose in the beginning of 'Rose' (the episode!), when he'd already spent a long time interacting with 'the Moment' who had taken her form? Fair enough, you can just say that he was lying when he met her, but it's very odd to suggest now that he'd seen Rose's/Bad Wolf's face before he met her, when this had no impact on him. I need to re-watch the episode as I watched with friends and may have missed things, but I didn't understand that. I guess it might be governed by the whole 'everyone forgetting' thing - when the Doctor forgets that he actually saved Gallifrey, maybe he forgets interacting with the Moment...?
His memory of the incident is forgotten and the 9th Doctor still thinks that he Burned gallifrey.
Original post by St. Brynjar
I have to say I'm fairly disappointed. I liked the idea that the Doctor did something terrible. I always had it in my head that he was just a normal soldier who was presented with this horrible opportunity and had to take it. It's what made Eccleston's Doctor so good. Last of the Time Lords etc.

I thought Tennant was excellent and definitely outshone Smith. I think for a lot of people, Tennant will always be the Doctor.

Seeing Capaldi was a nice touch, and Tom Baker at the end was brilliant. I'm not sure if it would have been overkill or not, but if he just came up to Smith and said 'Would you like a jelly baby?' I think I would have died!

I just really really wish Eccleston was in it, even as a cameo at the end when Hurt regenerated with the 'weight of the world' look in his eyes.

And what happened with the Zygons??

It was entertaining but it could have been a lot better.


The Doctor did he killed a billion billion daleks watch Tennant in Journey's End as the 10th Doctor and see how bad he suggests that is.

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