Is Scottish independence a 'good or bad' thing?

The censorship going on around the debate is shocking. SPT have been hit by hundreds of complaints for "banning" a wings over Scotland advertisement enticing people to the website. Yet pro union newspapers are allowed to entice people to go to their websites....you couldn't make this up.

Not content with blocking people from debating on the better together facebook page, I made one point backing it up with stats and was banned...ridiculous.

And now you have a blue card for trolling...making you less likely to fight your case...didn't think TSR would be like that...some power hungry unionist mod perhaps?

I just spent how long explaining the lack of independence Scotland would have if it joined the EU, why would I not think the same for all the 28 states No, the UK is not independent. We are part of an economic and political union. We are part of a weak federation. EU law is superior to UK law. Tell me what 'independent' country has that scenario? they don't, only states that are part of a federation or subjected to colonialism has that.

I oppose UKIP and support the EU, but I agree with them on the reality that the 28 EU states are part of a (con)federation and has lost sovereignty. It's just the political class has run scared of the electorate and so use words and phrases like 'union' and 'pooling of sovereignty'. To soften the reality, which is 'federation' and 'surrendering of sovereignty'. Yes we have a greater degree of autonomy within the EU (con)federation, compared to the US federation. But we are more California than we are USA, especially the 18 Eurozone members and who by the way, are on their to forming a fiscal union too.

If Califonia left the USA to join the EU their laws will be inferior to EU law, just like it is in the USA. Their policies in trade, commercial, agriculture, environment, monetary and fiscal affairs would be decided by the EU. They may wish to curb migration from Europe, but Brussels would strike them down. They would have swapped one federation for another one, albeit with greater autonomy.

Since the SNP are pro EU, they are at best offering the people of Scotland greater autonomy. I respect their right to accept or reject that of course.

Conspiracy theories left right and centre...


Posted from TSR Mobile

Theres no smoke screen...the options have been outlined clearly...funny how its already been outlined to you already but you say its a "smoke screen"...there can't be very much smoke. It would be stupid to bow down to the lies and talk about plan b when clearly plan a is the option that benefits all of us. Theres no reason why the others couldn't be used either...if yes scotland had came out with one of the other options...better together would have fear mongered with it just the same.

Heres and article on it http://www.heraldscotland.com/mobile/politics/referendum-news/one-year-on-will-better-together-change-their-tactics.21402294

There is more if you want me to give you it...I seen the actual letter that was leaked to wings over scotland.

There are a lot of valid reasons for denying scotland the £, one of the foremost reasons is because the £ would have to serve the interests of 2 divulging markets and the RUK would have to underpin Scottish banks, but Scotland couldn't do the same for rUK. Salmond is declaring that everyone is bluffing, people are asking which alternative ('Plan B') he would choose. He hasn't stated one.

There are a lot of valid reasons for denying scotland the £, one of the foremost reasons is because the £ would have to serve the interests of 2 divulging markets and the RUK would have to underpin Scottish banks, but Scotland couldn't do the same for rUK. Salmond is declaring that everyone is bluffing, people are asking which alternative ('Plan B') he would choose. He hasn't stated one.

Theres no smoke screen...the options have been outlined clearly...funny how its already been outlined to you already but you say its a "smoke screen"...there can't be very much smoke. It would be stupid to bow down to the lies and talk about plan b when clearly plan a is the option that benefits all of us. Theres no reason why the others couldn't be used either...if yes scotland had came out with one of the other options...better together would have fear mongered with it just the same.

Heres and article on it http://www.heraldscotland.com/mobile/politics/referendum-news/one-year-on-will-better-together-change-their-tactics.21402294

There is more if you want me to give you it...I seen the actual letter that was leaked to wings over scotland.

Plan b, c, d and e have been outlined by the yes campaign. What has Salmond got to do with this? The yes campaign includes more than just him...patrick harvie, margo mcdonald etc etc.

Actually, a currency union would mean Scotland is responsible for its share of any financial crisis...wherever the bank is based...so 8.4% of any bailouts.

Don't forget part 2 of the fishy duo, please link me to the Yes/SNP plan B.

Read the white paper...its online but surley you already know how to get as you have read both sides of this argument?

Chapter 3 finance and economy page 110...I have it infront of me. It lists 4 possible options...straight from the horses mouth for ye!

Yes I have read it.

Please post EXACTLY what is says Scotland will do if there is no Sterling zone.

Still flabergasted at that comment from you. I'm probably going to refrain from debating with you as you are clearly not up to speed.

RBS isn't a scottish bank mate...its a name, it could be called R bank of south africa... it wouldn't mean its a south african bank.

Well why did you ask for a source that outlines currency option? pretty stupid to ask if you already knew! So that other people browsing this thread would see both sides.

It says specifically "It would of course be open to people in Scotland to choose a different arrangement in the future"

The paper outlines 4 options, it selected the one that it thinks is best for both parties and details why. Then says... the other 4 options are still there.... what more do you want? a list detailing priority? Yes, that is what most people want.get a grip. Lets ask everyone to prioritize... lets ask every politician but what if.. what if that one cant happen... what if that one cant... and that one.... ridiculous.

Aye but me...and the majority of scots don't believe it. Most of us see it for what it is...an attempt to bully the yes campaign into choosing a stupid option when they know fine well its the one that would happen.


Posted from TSR Mobile

I see that having no evidence to back up your claim that I asked you to justify above you have decided to try and insult me.

In the event of independence, RBS, which is headquartered in Edinburgh, would be Scottish (But still operate in rUK as well) and therefore in the event of a bailout then rUK would bailout a Scottish bank. What I using above is called a hypothetical scenario.