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The Arsenal Thread XIX
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Original post by 419
Remember Arsene Who?
I was initially thinking Martinez but I've actually gone lukewarm over him. Remi Garde is available and many have touted him hire to Arsene. People have been raving about the work of Steve Bould these last 2 years, why not give him a go? Him and Martin Keown would do wonders.
.
Remember Arsene Who?
I was initially thinking Martinez but I've actually gone lukewarm over him. Remi Garde is available and many have touted him hire to Arsene. People have been raving about the work of Steve Bould these last 2 years, why not give him a go? Him and Martin Keown would do wonders.
.
We're just on the upswing part of the Emirates era after nearly a decade of keeping out head down, it's only right that Wenger gets a few years with the club he has built up without having to see his players stolen from him through lack of resources. We're not that far away at all really. If you consider that the 2011 team he built was dismantled in front of Arsene's eyes, he's done very well to get us back to that level in 3 years based on an entirely new team almost. We'll get more than 79 points next season too, we always improve when the team is settled after all.
It's sort of become an article of faith that Wenger doesnt do tactics or cant beat the big teams but that's not true. We get done against a very specific type of opposition, one that plays on the break and with pace, and Wenger is certainly aware of that too.I can remember other tactical flaws that we've had over the years that Wenger fixed given the time and looking at the players we're linked with, Aurier, DMs etc, pacey wingers, it's clear we're going after the right solutions.
De Boer is a great manager however, he would be the only obvious candidate in my eyes. Martinez, Garde etc have not done anywhere near enough to be taking Arsene's job.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by 419
x
Have to agree to disagree, Pell is a similar manager to wenger, so if he can win the prem during this era, it means wenger potentially can. It proves that we lack a title challenging squad.
Simple fact is:
With the best squad you can win without much tactical nous. (Pellegrini)
With an inferior squad you can't win without much tactical nous. (Mourinho, Wenger, Rodgers)
We are the latter, so need better tactics or a better squad.
With the best squad you can win without much tactical nous. (Pellegrini)
With an inferior squad you can't win without much tactical nous. (Mourinho, Wenger, Rodgers)
We are the latter, so need better tactics or a better squad.
How much influence does Arsene have on scouting talent overseas? When Wenger leaves I don't want Arsenal to stop bringing in unknown players to produce worldies, also want the new manager to be less stringent on finances but not heavily reliant on them either.
I'm all for Arsene seeing out his career here though, as long as he is consistent yet improving the team overall, i.e not letting big names leave the squad.
I'm all for Arsene seeing out his career here though, as long as he is consistent yet improving the team overall, i.e not letting big names leave the squad.
Original post by Pete_91
Simple fact is:
With the best squad you can win without much tactical nous. (Pellegrini)
With an inferior squad you can't win without much tactical nous. (Mourinho, Wenger, Rodgers)
We are the latter, so need better tactics or a better squad.
With the best squad you can win without much tactical nous. (Pellegrini)
With an inferior squad you can't win without much tactical nous. (Mourinho, Wenger, Rodgers)
We are the latter, so need better tactics or a better squad.
Mourinho tactics is to grind out result which didn't work out this season. As for Rodgers, I think he's good no doubt but lpool's success this season is more down to luck+cirumstances. We'll see how good lpool really is next season.
Original post by sevchenko
I agree with what you say essentially but I'm more inclined to so what Wenger does for the rest of new contract. Wenger biggest strength is the consistency he offers. The big question from me is can the new manager, regardless of who he is, offer the same consistency Wenger does?
The absolute minimum for a club like Arsenal is champions league qualification, even then it's been a poor season. Failure to get CL football with the players and resources at a club like Arsenal has to result in the sack I'm afraid.
The absolute minimum for a club like Arsenal is champions league qualification, even then it's been a poor season. Failure to get CL football with the players and resources at a club like Arsenal has to result in the sack I'm afraid.
The new manager won't offer consistency not the Wenger SAF consistency. Whoever replaces Arsene, I'll be surprised if he stays for longer than 6-8 years. Once Arsene leaves, we need to accept it for what it is.
Original post by Setsuna
Have to agree to disagree, Pell is a similar manager to wenger, so if he can win the prem during this era, it means wenger potentially can. It proves that we lack a title challenging squad.
Don't get me wrong, I definitely think Wenger can win it but, he just needs to do a few things in the market. Mainly sign a striker replace Sagna and find an Arteta alternative. Squad size, we're set for a challenge as long as the medical issue is sorted out (if there is one). I expect a stronger challenge next season.
Original post by Zürich
We're just on the upswing part of the Emirates era after nearly a decade of keeping out head down, it's only right that Wenger gets a few years with the club he has built up without having to see his players stolen from him through lack of resources. We're not that far away at all really. If you consider that the 2011 team he built was dismantled in front of Arsene's eyes, he's done very well to get us back to that level in 3 years based on an entirely new team almost. We'll get more than 79 points next season too, we always improve when the team is settled after all.
It's sort of become an article of faith that Wenger doesnt do tactics or cant beat the big teams but that's not true. We get done against a very specific type of opposition, one that plays on the break and with pace, and Wenger is certainly aware of that too.I can remember other tactical flaws that we've had over the years that Wenger fixed given the time and looking at the players we're linked with, Aurier, DMs etc, pacey wingers, it's clear we're going after the right solutions.
De Boer is a great manager however, he would be the only obvious candidate in my eyes. Martinez, Garde etc have not done anywhere near enough to be taking Arsene's job.
It's sort of become an article of faith that Wenger doesnt do tactics or cant beat the big teams but that's not true. We get done against a very specific type of opposition, one that plays on the break and with pace, and Wenger is certainly aware of that too.I can remember other tactical flaws that we've had over the years that Wenger fixed given the time and looking at the players we're linked with, Aurier, DMs etc, pacey wingers, it's clear we're going after the right solutions.
De Boer is a great manager however, he would be the only obvious candidate in my eyes. Martinez, Garde etc have not done anywhere near enough to be taking Arsene's job.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying he doesn't do tactics, I know that's just a ridiculous thing to say. People only think the likes of mourinho and SImeone 'that set up their team to be solid and organised' do any form of tactics. Ironic as well given their tactics are probably the most basic in football. I was actually watching our last victory at OT earlier today. I can remember been **** scared going to that game- hadn't won a game all season and everyone thought we'd lose MASSIVELY. One of the greatest post-invincible performance that was. Got me feeling that Cesc nostalgia again.
Anyway, my issue with Arsene is his steadfast trust in his players and not making adaptation especially in the Liverpool game. It's not the invisible teams and when Arteta is the elderly voice on the pitch, you're ****ed and there needs to be more instruction from the sidelines. Like Scholes said all we needed to do was weather the storm for a bit. It was baffling seeing us park the bus really well against bus and then not do it against chelsea the next week.
Original post by Pete_91
Simple fact is:
With the best squad you can win without much tactical nous. (Pellegrini)
With an inferior squad you can't win without much tactical nous. (Mourinho, Wenger, Rodgers)
We are the latter, so need better tactics or a better squad.
With the best squad you can win without much tactical nous. (Pellegrini)
With an inferior squad you can't win without much tactical nous. (Mourinho, Wenger, Rodgers)
We are the latter, so need better tactics or a better squad.
Pellegrini is a seriously undervalued manager. He does tactics. Look at Malaga last season. Got cheated out of a CL final place. I think people undervalue just how shambolic City as a squad are. Look at what Toure's saying lately. Mancini seriously ****ed that **** up.
Benzema rumours are picking up, no doubt its due to the cryptic as **** message on french TV by Wenger;
"Karim (Benzema) could play his last game for Real Madrid today, I'm sure he'll play in Premier League one day."
"Karim (Benzema) could play his last game for Real Madrid today, I'm sure he'll play in Premier League one day."
Original post by Complex Simplicity
Not like they signed the worlds most expensive player or got rid of a toxic manager for one who is both exceptional and gets on well with people.
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Meh Madrid won the CL. But tbh they spent 150M including the most expensive player in the world, got 1 point more than they got last season in the league, came 1 position lower than they came in the league, won a cup final they were in last season and won the Bayern game.
Mourinho would have probably done the same thing with that squad + Bale and selling Ozil tbh.
Original post by Kim-Jong-Illest
How much influence does Arsene have on scouting talent overseas? When Wenger leaves I don't want Arsenal to stop bringing in unknown players to produce worldies, also want the new manager to be less stringent on finances but not heavily reliant on them either.
I'm all for Arsene seeing out his career here though, as long as he is consistent yet improving the team overall, i.e not letting big names leave the squad.
I'm all for Arsene seeing out his career here though, as long as he is consistent yet improving the team overall, i.e not letting big names leave the squad.
The so called ITK say he had zero say in Jonker's appointment. So that's that but it's silly to say we should stop brining in unknown name. There's no problem with brining in unknown names is when they're not complemented by bringing established players that creates problems.
Original post by jam278
Meh Madrid won the CL. But tbh they spent 150M including the most expensive player in the world, got 1 point more than they got last season in the league, came 1 position lower than they came in the league, won a cup final they were in last season and won the Bayern game.
Mourinho would have probably done the same thing with that squad + Bale tbh.
Mourinho would have probably done the same thing with that squad + Bale tbh.
Would've won the league. No way would he have lost twice to THIS Barca team. Or to Atleti at home.
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Original post by FKLW
Would've won the league. No way would he have lost twice to THIS Barca team. Or to Atleti at home.
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That and the fact that he was whipping Barca left right and centre in his last season.
He'd have done the same thing and tbh beating the smaller teams wouldn't have been a problem like it is at Chelsea with Ronaldo, Bale and friends.
Original post by jam278
Meh Madrid won the CL. But tbh they spent 150M including the most expensive player in the world, got 1 point more than they got last season in the league, came 1 position lower than they came in the league, won a cup final they were in last season and won the Bayern game.
Mourinho would have probably done the same thing with that squad + Bale and selling Ozil tbh.
Mourinho would have probably done the same thing with that squad + Bale and selling Ozil tbh.
What did Mourinho do and how much did he spend. You chelae fan seriously can't deal with any criticism of mourinho even after Ancelotti did what he failed to do in his first go, you come up with some silly claims.
Original post by Kim-Jong-Illest
Benzema rumours are picking up, no doubt its due to the cryptic as **** message on french TV by Wenger;
"Karim (Benzema) could play his last game for Real Madrid today, I'm sure he'll play in Premier League one day."
"Karim (Benzema) could play his last game for Real Madrid today, I'm sure he'll play in Premier League one day."
Wenger speaks more freely about a player when they're unlikely to join. Who heard anything about Ozil, Monreal, Cazorla etc before they signed? Not a peep. Very little information actually leaks out of Arsenal compared with most clubs, probably because Wenger himself is in control of almost everything and keeps his cards close to his chest.
Also, I'd much prefer Mandzukic to Benzema. Maybe even Bony.
Original post by 419
What did Mourinho do and how much did he spend. You chelae fan seriously can't deal with any criticism of mourinho even after Ancelotti did what he failed to do in his first go, you come up with some silly claims.
What did Mourinho do and how much did he spend. You chelae fan seriously can't deal with any criticism of mourinho even after Ancelotti did what he failed to do in his first go, you come up with some silly claims.
Lol, Mourinho did spend a lot but don't be blinkered look how much Ancelotti spent this season, why are you using ad hominem and slander as well?
Mourinho wouldn't have lost twice to Barcelona in the league and he wouldn't have lost at home to Atlético with that Real squad.
Coming from a guy who likes Ancelotti, the league performance was poor game from him. Out of the three seasons Mourinho was there he only once got a lower points total than what Ancelotti got and had a worse team. Unless you think Ozil>Bale? Won't be surprised if you do though.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by jam278
Meh Madrid won the CL. But tbh they spent 150M including the most expensive player in the world, got 1 point more than they got last season in the league, came 1 position lower than they came in the league, won a cup final they were in last season and won the Bayern game.
Mourinho would have probably done the same thing with that squad + Bale and selling Ozil tbh.
Mourinho would have probably done the same thing with that squad + Bale and selling Ozil tbh.
Possibly but again, everyone and I mean everyone hated him in spain. I think he had to leave tbh, he'd used up all of his goodwill and now it would be very hard for him to do anything. He lost the dressing room, lost the media, lost even the president. Ex presidents were saying that they'd rather a cleaner manager madrid than mourinho continue, he was hated. He has the talent but something went seriously wrong in madrid.
Original post by Zürich
Wenger speaks more freely about a player when they're unlikely to join. Who heard anything about Ozil, Monreal, Cazorla etc before they signed? Not a peep. Very little information actually leaks out of Arsenal compared with most clubs, probably because Wenger himself is in control of almost everything and keeps his cards close to his chest.
Also, I'd much prefer Mandzukic to Benzema. Maybe even Bony.
Also, I'd much prefer Mandzukic to Benzema. Maybe even Bony.
Why the last part?
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Original post by Zürich
Wenger speaks more freely about a player when they're unlikely to join. Who heard anything about Ozil, Monreal, Cazorla etc before they signed? Not a peep. Very little information actually leaks out of Arsenal compared with most clubs, probably because Wenger himself is in control of almost everything and keeps his cards close to his chest.
Also, I'd much prefer Mandzukic to Benzema. Maybe even Bony.
Also, I'd much prefer Mandzukic to Benzema. Maybe even Bony.
This. Benzeama has pretty much failed to meet his talent and will never live up to it.
Original post by jam278
Lol, Mourinho did spend a lot but don't be blinkered look how much Ancelotti spent this season, why are you using ad hominem and slander as well?
Mourinho wouldn't have lost twice to Barcelona in the league and he wouldn't have lost at home to Atlético with that Real squad.
Coming from a guy who likes Ancelotti, the league performance was poor game from him. Out of the three seasons Mourinho was there he only once got a lower points total than what Ancelotti got and had a worse team. Unless you think Ozil>Bale? Won't be surprised if you do though.
Mourinho wouldn't have lost twice to Barcelona in the league and he wouldn't have lost at home to Atlético with that Real squad.
Coming from a guy who likes Ancelotti, the league performance was poor game from him. Out of the three seasons Mourinho was there he only once got a lower points total than what Ancelotti got and had a worse team. Unless you think Ozil>Bale? Won't be surprised if you do though.
Original post by 419
What did Mourinho do and how much did he spend. You chelae fan seriously can't deal with any criticism of mourinho even after Ancelotti did what he failed to do in his first go, you come up with some silly claims.
What did Mourinho do and how much did he spend. You chelae fan seriously can't deal with any criticism of mourinho even after Ancelotti did what he failed to do in his first go, you come up with some silly claims.
'It's always the same with Mourinho. When things are going well, it's the result of his good work, but the players are to blame when things are going badly. He already lost the dressing room at Real Madrid because of that and I can see the same happen at Chelsea'' Johan Cruijff.
Cruijff has absolutely ruined Mourinho on many occasions tbh, Johann has got an even more vicious tongue than Jose when he wishes.
Original post by Complex Simplicity
Possibly but again, everyone and I mean everyone hated him in spain. I think he had to leave tbh, he'd used up all of his goodwill and now it would be very hard for him to do anything. He lost the dressing room, lost the media, lost even the president. Ex presidents were saying that they'd rather a cleaner manager madrid than mourinho continue, he was hated. He has the talent but something went seriously wrong in madrid.
That's true he pissed off the whole of spain. He had to leave because he lost the dressing room though but tbh they'd probably just blow it off. They weren't divided as a dressing room when they got their **** together in the second half of the season. He only completely lost the dressing room after the defeat to Dortmund. They were probably willing to let him go on if they'd won la decima.
Lets be honest here, they could have sacked him right after the Villanova poke but they let him stay on, they won the league and the likes of Casillas were saying he's the best manager in the world, they're a fickle club with fickle players.
Big debate going on over benzema and balotelli as much as I see what do you lot reckon?
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