Why aren't murder ''jokes'' as bad or worse than rape ones?

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We trivialize murder in comments here and there every single day. ''I'm gonna kill this or that'', ''my mum's gonna kill me'', ''my wife's gonna kill me if she finds out'' etc.

Imagine some thick ''celeb'' twitting these 2 comments:

'' The England team got murdered tonight'' = not a single eye would bat.
'' The England team got raped tonight'' = entire internet and media blow up.

So do we live in a murder culture? Do we see murder as acceptable ? Do we encourage it by trivializing it all the time? Since murder jokes or references are completely ignored while anything rape related raises all hell.

rape is more common than murder.

the samurai would commonly kill themselves out of shame of defeat.

in prison rape is used as a weapon to shame rivals.

you can die but you will always be remembered as the guy/girl who got raped.

rape is to do with shame and desecration.

death has often been associated with purification.

Reply 41

MostUncivilised

Original post by fojodef

rape is to do with shame and desecration.

death has often been associated with purification.

In spite of all the comparisons and rationalisations on this thread, I would rather be raped than murdered. By a long shot.

Which means the question remains, why are rape jokes worse than murder jokes when murder is worse than rape?

Reply 42

consumed by stuff

Original post by MostUncivilised

In spite of all the comparisons and rationalisations on this thread, I would rather be raped than murdered By a long shot.

Which means the question remains, why are rape jokes worse than murder jokes when murder is worse than rape?

i don't want to know what kinda gay that is.

Reply 43

fojodef

Original post by MostUncivilised

maybe its just cause im in working class circles. but most people i know would rather fight to the death than be raped.

rape is often used as a weapon in war. theres a "you cant protect your women" thing about it. which is why when you here some cases in ****ed up countries like africa and india where large massacres have happened theres been numerous cases of parents and husbands killing their wives/daughters to save them from the mass gang rape that awaits them.

indeed rape can be so traumatising it essentially kills the victim anyway by destroying them mentally and leaving them in catatonic state.
.

Reply 44

username1402889

Rape is not insignificantly the product of systematic linguistic practices within a given community (i.e. how the female subject, gender and sexuality are conceptualised). Murder happens for a whole range of reasons which, in the Western world, are usually isolated or criminal. To invoke the word rape in banal instances, such as the result of a football team, is at potential fault for two reasons: (i) it normalises rapes in common linguistic practice, albeit subtly; (ii) it effects psychological harm in rape or sexual abuse victims. To do the same to murder, is marginally culpable for the latter, although two things are relevant: victims of murder are, obviously dead; there are, in the Western world, significantly less instances of murder than rape.

(edited 9 years ago)

Reply 45

username1402889

Original post by MostUncivilised

As above.

Reply 46

MostUncivilised

Original post by fojodef

maybe its just cause im in working class circles. but most people i know would rather fight to the death than be raped.

indeed rape can be so traumatising it essentially kills the victim anyway by destroying them mentally and leaving them in catatonic state.

I think that's slightly overstating it. Rape can indeed be traumatic, but ultimately, I would much rather a guy ****ed me against my will, with all the pain that would entail, and psychological cleaning up afterwards, than have my entire life ended.

Reply 47

Original Name

I find murder to be an honourable crime in comparison to torture/ rape. The worst part of murder is actually for the murderer, that they are able to take a human life and be okay with it, and for the victim's family, who have to deal with the extreme sorrow of knowing someone they love has had their life forcibly taken from them. But at least it's over for the victim. Rape is different, it degrades and destroys the victim, male or female. For the duration of the rape the victim is a slave, less than human, no longer allowed the courtesy of a voice to say no. Not everyone will inevitably be raped but everyone will inevitably die, and there is no shame in death. We say there is no shame in rape either, and the victim shouldn't feel shame, but doubtlessly they will, because we are proud animals, and rape is one of the worst violations of that.

Reply 48

consumed by stuff

There is a serios lack of rape jokes on this thread i must say.

Reply 49

fojodef

Original post by MostUncivilised

That's ludicrous, and frankly despite the fighting words, most people wouldn't if they were actually in that situation. Most people would prefer to live for another 60 or 70 years, even with the trauma of being raped, rather than be killed and have their life end there.

I think that's slightly overstating it. Rape can indeed be traumatic, but ultimately, I would much rather a guy ****ed me against my will, with all the pain that would entail, and psychological cleaning up afterwards, than have my entire life ended.

each to their own.

me personally im one of the ludicrous guys. i'd favour a clean death over a life of shame. indeed i knew a man who had been raped as an adult and he killed himself. i've also heard similar stories from others.

Reply 50

MostUncivilised

Original post by consumed by stuff

i don't want to know what kinda gay that is.

That doesn't even make sense.

You would rather be raped and then killed, rather than just being raped and then live the rest of your 70 years or so of life, dealing with it and for the most part getting on with your life and forgetting about it

Reply 51

consumed by stuff

Original post by MostUncivilised

it was lost on you.

Reply 52

MostUncivilised

Original post by fojodef

i'd favour a clean death over a life of shame.

You say that now but I bet you would choose differently if actually faced with that choice

The attitude you claim promotes the idea that it is some kind of shame on the rape victim

Reply 53

brownsugar-xx

Original post by Original Name

Yeah I agree with this. There's just something incredibly disturbing about someone forcing themselves into your body while you thrash around, screaming and crying for them to stop. I imagine someone might quote me and say 'well replace the body part with a knife and its the same' but its not.

Posted from TSR Mobile

Reply 54

Jordooooom

Original post by MostUncivilised

You say that now but I bet you would choose differently if actually faced with that choice

The attitude you claim promotes the idea that it is some kind of shame on the rape victim

If a straight male was raped by another man then there would be a far greater deal of shame than if it was a female or homosexual victim.

Reply 55

Jammy Duel

Original post by Jordooooom

If a straight male was raped by another man then there would be a far greater deal of shame than if it was a female or homosexual victim.

Why? Is that not mostly down to the continuing stigmatising of man on man really?

Posted from TSR Mobile

Reply 56

manchesterunited15

Original post by Jammy Duel

Why? Is that not mostly down to the continuing stigmatising of man on man really?

Posted from TSR Mobile

It's due to the matriarchy victim-blaming men.

#yesallmen

Reply 57

tazarooni89

Original post by ckingalt

Rape is a crime in which the victims continue to suffer through shame and humiliation long after the assault occurs. The added stigma towards rape jokes, is a result of a "social conscience", which seeks to discourage any behavior that potentially contributes to that enduring humiliation and shame.

Murder victims require no such protection.

What about the friends and family of murder victims? It's arguably much worse for them than the murder victim himself, who neither knows nor cares about it any longer.

Reply 58

ruthlessv

Original post by ckingalt

Excuse me, i am a murder victim and i denounce and reject that.

You sir are a disgusting human being and do not understand my struggle.

Reply 59

fojodef

Original post by MostUncivilised

You say that now but I bet you would choose differently if actually faced with that choice

The attitude you claim promotes the idea that it is some kind of shame on the rape victim

there is. thats kind of the point. although with women its not so bad.
in fact ive seen some girls who have behaved like slags n when its gone public theyve said they didnt consent.

but certainly for men there is a state of ignominy about it.

n i've seen guys end up in prison, hospital or dead because they had a fight over some pride/shame based issue like the spilling of a drink or some bull ****.

if i had people depending on me like some retarded relative or if i had children maybe id think twice. but at the moment if i was to die nothings gonna be affected other than family n friends being upset.