The Israel/Palestine Conflict Mk. IV

Even if it happened, the circumstances won't be clear.

There are a lot of amateur analysts saying the smoke rising looks like a failed rocket launch etc.

I've given up believing anything that comes out of Gaza as it's totally controlled by Hamas and they have lied repeatedly. Hence the legendary 'pallywood' productions.

Hamas' main weapon against Israel is public relations, not rockets.

Rockets act as the necessary act to produce the deaths Hamas need.

it's all over the news.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/middle-east-unrest/innocent-gone-israeli-strike-gaza-kills-four-children-n157301

After killing 213 Gazans including innocent kids:

Can't pretend I follow this, but on BBC news they were saying Netanyahu's response to complaints about airstrikes/civilian deaths is..

"Hamas attack us first, any civilian causalities from our retaliation is their fault."

...I didn't think you could really use that as a defence for killing civilians? I'm not familiar on rules of warfare, or what would be said at international criminal courts say, but it seems weak.

The Egyptians had proposed a ceasefire, endorsed by both the UN and the Arab League.

Seeing as Hamas has rejected both ceasefires, while Israel accepted both of them, I think its clear who we should blame more deaths on. Its already a double war crime to shoot rockets at Israeli civilians, while hiding behind Palestinian civilians.

They are not intentionally targeting civilians, but military targets where civilians have to be. If someone is firing rockets at you then you have to strike back. Britain did much worse than this in WW2 and nobody bats an eyelid about that.

I think this point ends all debate. If your enemy rejects a ceasefire then you have complete justification for striking back at them.

I've seen videos of them shooting from the back gardens of civilian homes and from schools. Even a UN-run school.

Channel4 news which is very anti-Israel, did a piece after the 2009 conflict. They interviewed a palestinian (identity concealed for fear of retribution) who said they came to his house to use his grounds to fire rockets, as it was advantageously placed.

He argued with them not to, because retaliatory strikes would destroy his home - so they knee-capped him for complaining. Shot both his knees out.

This article does not confirm anything beyond the fact that they died. It could have been a Hamas rocket falling in Gaza, as several dozens have.

"It looked as if the shells were chasing them," pffft. Bearing in mind its a Hamas spokesman saying this. I'd believe what the family says but it states they weren't there at the time.

Israel also fires rockets at itself.

Says who? you?

Israel also fires rockets at itself.

They are not intentionally targeting civilians, but military targets where civilians have to be. If someone is firing rockets at you then you have to strike back. Britain did much worse than this in WW2 and nobody bats an eyelid about that.

I'm not saying Israel is perfect, but Hamas does much worse.

If no eyelids are batted at Britain's war crimes, then that is to be blamed on the people, and Britain's war crimes are not to be dismissed. As it happens eyelids are batted very frequently at Britain's criminal past in increasingly common disillusioned historical circles. On an equally relevant note, Britain has much of the blame for Israel's current criminality, for Britain had a role to play in the creation of this bestial and inhuman demon that is now Israel. Interesting, though, that you had to shove that bit about Britain's criminal past into your post as a last resort to justifying Israel's current crimes.

Whether they are intentionally or not intentionally targetting innocents is debatable. It is also irrelevant, as it is a well-known fact that the Gaza strip is one of the most densely populated places on the Earth, and that there is no possible escape for the civilians hopelessly barricaded in there. It is also irrelevant as civilians are being killed every day, and their blood is on Israel's hands, and judging from there being no sign of desistance, that fact doesn't seem to perturb them very much. The only thing that perturbs them is the world's outcry. If communication was not so advanced now, as it wasn't back in 1948 when they committed atrocities and got away with it, Israel would not feel the need to apologise nor explain its criminal conduct, as it didn't back in 1948.