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The Israel/Palestine Conflict Mk. IV
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Original post by UniOfLife
Sorry, were no children killed in the invasions of Afghanistan or Iraq? I must have missed that.
And no, the other side in this conflict is Hamas. And yes, they very definitely are terrorists.
And no, the other side in this conflict is Hamas. And yes, they very definitely are terrorists.
Yes, it just further proves my point that being a western democratic country does not exempt you from being terrorists. The USA are the most shameful terrorists in the world.
Even Jews around the world are protesting Israel's slaughter of gaza
Original post by felamaslen
So the fact that once they've provoked Israel into attacking, they don't mind killing IDF soldiers, somehow justifies their endless campaign against peace during the calm years in between Israeli strikes? Never mind the fact that they're a bunch of totalitarian fascists...
In a war, you attack military bases and soldiers.
It depends what you mean by stepping it up a gear. I would be inclined to say that the civilian casualties have been simply too high, but I'm the sort of person who would never be able to authorise any kind of military operation which involves the unintentional killing of civilians. All I know is that there will be violence while Hamas are around.
So Israel has been disproportionate?
And once they achieve that, they will demand an end to the Jewish state too.
And after they get that, they will start attacking America. Once they get that, they will want the world. And once they get that, they will want another planet. And once they get that, they will want the solar system....
I say Hamas targets civilians. The IDF does not target civilians. If it did, every Gazan would be dead.
So you agree that Israel is displaying "unimaginable restraint" as per the comments of this man?
Which Knesset member called for the genocide of Palestinians? If that is real, he should be fired and possibly jailed.
It wasn't a he, it was a she. Why did you assume it was a "he"?
Rejecting the creation of a state is a bit different to calling for the destruction of one which already exists. I also reject the creation of a Palestinian state, if it's going to be a tyranny (which it would be).
The end result is the same. There is no state. How are the Charters of HAMAS and Likud any different?
It only stands for something in Arabic.
It's transliterated.
Original post by tsr1269
The question is: Should the land be given back to the Canaanites?
Do you know any Cannaanites who want the land? If so, I see no reason for them not to share with the Jewish people and the Arab people.
All it takes to fulfil that quote is Israel to stop attacking the Palestinians. That quote by Einstein does not require the Palestinians to lay down their arms.
It would be greatly helpful if both layed down their arms. Israel is not likely to lay down their arms without Hamas lying down their rockets, and Hamas is not likely to lay down their arms without Israel doing the same, hmm?
Do you think if the Jews took up armed struggle against Nazi Germany, we would start supporting Nazi Germany?
The Jews did take up an armed struggle against Nazi Germany along with the Allied forces, yet the Grand Mufti supported Nazi Germany, sadly.
Are you from Palestine? Just curious.
I am replying to your misconceptions, not your personal opinions on the matter.
To be fair, I could have worded it a little differently. I hope you were not insulted or offended?
Thanks. I am no longer offended. Thank you for the interesting discussion. I apologize if I have offended you in any way. It is not my intention to offend.
Original post by #That'sNotMe
Haven't read last few pages so not sure if been posted.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2701043/The-shocking-moment-Palestinian-civilian-shot-dead-Israeli-sniper-lying-defenceless-floor-earlier-hit.html
I know it's the DM but there's a video there proving it. How anyone can support these terrorists I don't know. It also puts paid to people that say "Israel don't target civilians" considering they shot a man in his hip and as he lay there on the ground blood dripping out shot at his chest again.
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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2701043/The-shocking-moment-Palestinian-civilian-shot-dead-Israeli-sniper-lying-defenceless-floor-earlier-hit.html
I know it's the DM but there's a video there proving it. How anyone can support these terrorists I don't know. It also puts paid to people that say "Israel don't target civilians" considering they shot a man in his hip and as he lay there on the ground blood dripping out shot at his chest again.
Posted from TSR Mobile
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Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by tsr1269
I suppose you are in favour of unlimited South American and Asian immigration?
.
I suppose you are in favour of unlimited South American and Asian immigration?
.
I am in favor of liberal South American and Asian immigration. I am married to a wonderful South American man, by the way.
As for unlimited, I am not in favor of killers and drugdealers and gangsters immigrating to the USA.
Original post by Agapelove
No, many Americans do not think the above.
Many do not agree with what Israel is doing. As an American, I do not agree with Israel attacking Gaza. I think they should concentrate on the Iron Dome and keeping their defenses up, but that they should not attack Gaza either with missiles or drones or ground troops or any other weapon.
The ties of Israel with the USA have to do mainly with the following:
1. Family ties. Before the holocaust, many Jewish families made the USA their home. During and after the holocaust, many Jewish refugees also immigrated to the USA, while many of their relatives immigrated to Israel.
2. Holocaust horror. While the USA is guilty of turning Jewish immigrants away when they tried to come to the USA, after the American soldiers saw the Nazi concentration camps, the USA in general became dedicated to protecting the Jewish people.
3. Allies. Like the UK, Israel is an ally to the USA.
However, again many Americans do not see Israel as being the 'good guys' in this case, and are dismayed that Israel is killing people in Gaza. Again, as an American I believe that Israel should not be attacking and killing people. As a Christian, I believe they should be obeying Jesus' commands to love their enemies. However, sad to say the USA in general does not obey Jesus' commands to love their enemies, so how can I expect Israel to do what the USA does not do?
The USA should lead by example yet sadly and horrifically, the USA is guilty of killing thousands of babies, children, and adults in Japan, as well as killing civilians in other countries.
Many do not agree with what Israel is doing. As an American, I do not agree with Israel attacking Gaza. I think they should concentrate on the Iron Dome and keeping their defenses up, but that they should not attack Gaza either with missiles or drones or ground troops or any other weapon.
The ties of Israel with the USA have to do mainly with the following:
1. Family ties. Before the holocaust, many Jewish families made the USA their home. During and after the holocaust, many Jewish refugees also immigrated to the USA, while many of their relatives immigrated to Israel.
2. Holocaust horror. While the USA is guilty of turning Jewish immigrants away when they tried to come to the USA, after the American soldiers saw the Nazi concentration camps, the USA in general became dedicated to protecting the Jewish people.
3. Allies. Like the UK, Israel is an ally to the USA.
However, again many Americans do not see Israel as being the 'good guys' in this case, and are dismayed that Israel is killing people in Gaza. Again, as an American I believe that Israel should not be attacking and killing people. As a Christian, I believe they should be obeying Jesus' commands to love their enemies. However, sad to say the USA in general does not obey Jesus' commands to love their enemies, so how can I expect Israel to do what the USA does not do?
The USA should lead by example yet sadly and horrifically, the USA is guilty of killing thousands of babies, children, and adults in Japan, as well as killing civilians in other countries.
Whether the populace agrees with something or not is irrelevant if they don't do enough to change the attitudes and policies of their government.
This isn't a new perspective. It's the anti-semetic argument, that any objection to what the state of Israel is doing is anti-semetic. The fatal flaw of this argument is the assumption that jews and the state of Israel are interlinked. Israel nor protects the interests of the Jewish people as a whole, or represents their views. See the prominence of Jews everywhere in the protests against this massacre.
Original post by Jordooooom
Yes, it just further proves my point that being a western democratic country does not exempt you from being terrorists. The USA are the most shameful terrorists in the world.
Even Jews around the world are protesting Israel's slaughter of gaza
Even Jews around the world are protesting Israel's slaughter of gaza
Er well my point was that the BBC perhaps ought to be biased in favour of Israel so I'm not sure where your point fits in with that but whatever.
And yes, there are Jews around the world protesting against Israel's actions. Even Jews inside Israel.
Where are the people protesting against Hamas's rocket attacks or use of human shields?
Original post by Dhibla
This isn't a new perspective. It's the anti-semetic argument, that any objection to what the state of Israel is doing is anti-semetic. The fatal flaw of this argument is the assumption that jews and the state of Israel are interlinked. Israel nor protects the interests of the Jewish people as a whole, or represents their views. See the prominence of Jews everywhere in the protests against this massacre.
It may not be antisemitic in theory but consider:
(1) there have been more protests against Israel than against Syria or ISIS etc
(2) there have been anti-Israel protests that have included obviously antisemitic chants such as "gas the Jews" (http://www.vox.com/2014/7/21/5923145/gaza-anti-semitism-europe)
(3) in Paris, for example, a supposedly anti-Israel protest attacked Jewish synagogues
It may not be antisemitic in theory to protest against Israel but for many it actually is.
Original post by yo radical one
I'm actually pretty pissed; I would have much preferred Mila Kunis to Scarlett
Spoiler
Of course...says someone who is vigorously defending israel by posting lengthy posts.
Just be honest...how much?
Original post by Agapelove
Islam stole Jerusalem from the Byzantium Empire, which stole Jerusalem from the Romans who destroyed it. A whole lot of stealing and destruction going on there.
Reminds me of this clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-evIyrrjTTY
Reminds me of this clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-evIyrrjTTY
So why don't the Jews ask the Romans for land given the fact that they were kicked out of their homes by them?
Great question.
There are no Jewish prophecies about the Jewish people returning to Germany, but there are Jewish prophecies accounted in the Tanakh about the Jewish people returning to the land where King David walked (Israel).
There are no Jewish prophecies about the Jewish people returning to Germany, but there are Jewish prophecies accounted in the Tanakh about the Jewish people returning to the land where King David walked (Israel).
But half of all Israeli's don't believe in the Jewish scriptures. You can't use as justification what 0.14% of the world believes in.
The Arabs have the holocaust to thank for that. Sadly, the Grand Mufti of Palestine was in league with Hitler.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pjk34r7OSkM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pjk34r7OSkM
So the Arabs were anti-Jewish or pro-Hitler?
Life is full of ironies.
Again, it's not new that Jewish people are against other Jewish people.
I wonder if the Jewish people who are against the nation of Israel were against the regeneration of Israel during the time of King Cyrus the Great of Persia?
Again, it's not new that Jewish people are against other Jewish people.
I wonder if the Jewish people who are against the nation of Israel were against the regeneration of Israel during the time of King Cyrus the Great of Persia?
They lived under his empire yes. What does that have to do with anything?
Original post by Agapelove
Do you know any Cannaanites who want the land? If so, I see no reason for them not to share with the Jewish people and the Arab people.
And what proportion of land will you give to them?
It would be greatly helpful if both layed down their arms. Israel is not likely to lay down their arms without Hamas lying down their rockets, and Hamas is not likely to lay down their arms without Israel doing the same, hmm?
Chicken and egg, right?
The Jews did take up an armed struggle against Nazi Germany along with the Allied forces, yet the Grand Mufti supported Nazi Germany, sadly.
Are you from Palestine? Just curious.
Are you from Palestine? Just curious.
With all due respect, that wasn't the question. Allow me to clarify:
If the UK/US wasn't involved in WW2 and the Jews had risen up against Hitler, would we have supported the Jews or Germany's "right to self-defense"?
Thanks. I am no longer offended. Thank you for the interesting discussion. I apologize if I have offended you in any way. It is not my intention to offend.
No, thank you for engaging in the discussion. It's been a pleasure.
Original post by Agapelove
I am in favor of liberal South American and Asian immigration. I am married to a wonderful South American man, by the way.
As for unlimited, I am not in favor of killers and drugdealers and gangsters immigrating to the USA.
As for unlimited, I am not in favor of killers and drugdealers and gangsters immigrating to the USA.
Fantastic news. And what would you define as "liberal"? Do you put a number on it?
Original post by yo radical one
Alright link me up
This link has the video
www.memri.org/report/en/0/0/0/0/0/0/8076.htm
I didn't want to go onto any Hamas website or anything.
Other sources.
http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Protective-Edge/Hamas-tells-social-media-activists-to-always-call-the-dead-innocent-civilians-364154
www.idfblog.com/blog/2014/07/21/hamas-teaches-gazas-facebook-users-secret-spinning-terror/
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/hamas-gives-gazans-guidelines-reporting-israeli-attacks-social-media-1457466
Original post by Jordooooom
You watched a small segment one night and you're basing your judgement off that?
No, I've watched BBC coverage of Israel and Palestine over many years.
You are aware that they have been criticised by many for clearly being biased towards Israel? What do you think all these protests have been about?
I think you should educate yourself before quoting me
I think you should educate yourself before quoting me
And if you educated yourself, you would be aware that they have been criticised for allegedly being biased against Israel, as well as being in favour.
Have you looked into the hostile media effect? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hostile_media_effect
In 1982, the first major study of this phenomenon (hostile media effect) was undertaken; pro-Palestinian students and pro-Israeli students at Stanford University were shown the same news filmstrips pertaining to the then-recent Sabra and Shatila massacre of Palestinian refugees by Christian Lebanese militia fighters abetted by the Israeli army in Beirut during the Lebanese Civil War. On a number of objective measures, both sides found that these identical news clips were slanted in favor of the other side. Pro-Israeli students reported seeing more anti-Israel references and fewer favorable references to Israel in the news report and pro-Palestinian students reported seeing more anti-Palestinian references, and so on. Both sides said a neutral observer would have a more negative view of their side from viewing the clips, and that the media would have excused the other side where it blamed their side.
"The incursion and bombardment of Gaza is not about destroying Hamas. It is not about stopping rocket fire into Israel, it is not about achieving peace. The Israeli decision to rain death and destruction on Gaza, to use lethal weapons of the modern battlefield on a largely defenceless civilian population, is the final phase in a decades-long campaign to ethnically-cleanse Palestinians.Israel uses sophisticated attack jets and naval vessels to bomb densely-crowded refugee camps, schools, apartment blocks, mosques, and slums to attack a population that has no air force, no air defence, no navy, no heavy weapons, no artillery units, no mechanized armour, no command in control, no army… and calls it a war. It is not a war, it is murder. When Israelis in the occupied territories now claim that they have to defend themselves, they are defending themselves in the sense that any military occupier has to defend itself against the population they are crushing. You can’t defend yourself when you’re militarily occupying someone else’s land. That’s not defence. Call it what you like, it’s not defence."
Lufthansa, Air France and KLM have decided to stop servicing Tel Aviv.
This is in addition to the FAA's ban.
This is in addition to the FAA's ban.
The sad thing is our tax money gives a lot of money to Israel yearly we are virtually giving our money for them to buy rockets to kill innocent civilians likewise the same can be said in Iraq and Afghanistan our tax money was wasted and sad to say you can never bring back an innocent person. Israel makes surplus after surplus yet USA and UK especially give them billions we are in deficit shouldn't we fix our problems first before giving to a rich nation
[video="youtube;s1QnKKBXym8"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1QnKKBXym8[/video]
If they are defending themselves why did they shoot this man, who was in no position a threat to the Israeli soldiers??
How can people support the apartheid barbaric Israel?
If they are defending themselves why did they shoot this man, who was in no position a threat to the Israeli soldiers??
How can people support the apartheid barbaric Israel?
Original post by UniOfLife
I really think you're missing the point - perhaps deliberately.
Let me give an analogy. If the police arrest many more black people than white people despite it being obvious that the level of criminality between the two parties is at least comparable then this indicates that the police are institutionally racist. It doesn't indicate that black people are more criminal.
The same thing goes here. That Israel has more resolutions passed against it than anyone else despite it being obviously no worse (and in fact significantly less bad) than the others tells us that the UN has an institutional problem with regard to Israel. It does not tell us that Israel is much worse. Capisce?
Let me give an analogy. If the police arrest many more black people than white people despite it being obvious that the level of criminality between the two parties is at least comparable then this indicates that the police are institutionally racist. It doesn't indicate that black people are more criminal.
The same thing goes here. That Israel has more resolutions passed against it than anyone else despite it being obviously no worse (and in fact significantly less bad) than the others tells us that the UN has an institutional problem with regard to Israel. It does not tell us that Israel is much worse. Capisce?
So you're now arguing that the UN has it out for Israel? How absurd
Adding Air Canada to that list.
I'm sure most of these Palestinians will be missing their organs. Jews are big on organ harvesting. Killing gentile and making billions from their organs.
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