Criticism of Israel is not anti-semitic?

OP

Original post by samba

What do you think about the absolutely retarded 20% vat for non resident citizens?!?!?!?! hihi citizens, join the army for 2 years, go away and pay taxes elsewhere, then come and pay retarded rates if you want to visit.Emigrate and suffer.

I haven't heard about that, what is this tax? I'd like to know more

Reply 22

Original post by young_guns

Interesting; an "axe to grind". What axe is that?

That would depend on the wielder of the axe.

Reply 23

OP

Original post by Good bloke

That would depend on the wielder of the axe.

But specifically... what axe are we talking about? And what grinding?

Just throw some examples out there

By the way, whatever the meaning of semitic / semite, you presumably don't deny that anti-semitic specifically means anti-Jewish?

Reply 24

Original post by young_guns

But specifically... what axe are we talking about? And what grinding?

Just throw some examples out there

Well, someone who felt strongly that criticising Israel is an anti-semitic act, for instance, might argue that dictionaries don't normally place the most common usage first in their listing, or might ignore the other definitions of the word altogether, or might go further and pretend that the word has only one definition .

Reply 25

n00

14

meh

Original post by sugar-n-spice

But hey, you just want to jump on the thing which relates to the Jews, I wonder why that could be...

Reply 26

the bear

20

Original post by queen-bee

What is a Semite? Could arabs also be considered to be Semite?

Arabs can be Semites. Many Israeli citizens are Arabs.

Reply 27

Original post by young_guns

By the way, whatever the meaning of semitic / semite, you presumably don't deny that anti-semitic specifically means anti-Jewish?

It certainly can do. However, I was discussing (and quoted) the definition of "semitic", specifically.

Reply 28

OP

Original post by Good bloke

It certainly can do..

It "can do"? It does.

I've always found it interesting when pro-Palestine advocates insist on having a debate about the meaning of the words semitic / anti-semitic etc when the subject comes up.

It's almost as though they wanted to avoid discussing the substantive issue...

Reply 29

OP

Original post by Good bloke

Well, someone who felt strongly that criticising Israel is an anti-semitic act

Who is this "someone"? I've actually never met anyone who claims that any and all criticism of Israel is inherently and automatically anti-semitic.

I have, on the other hand, seen criticism of Israel that is undoubtedly based on anti-semitic beliefs.

Reply 30

Original post by young_guns

It "can do"? It does.

I've always found it interesting when pro-Palestine advocates insist on having a debate about the meaning of the words semitic / anti-semitic etc when the subject comes up.

It's almost as though they wanted to avoid discussing the substantive issue...

Well, I take no sides in that argument but the issue is, surely, that the state of Israel was imposed by the UN on an area of land that held a large number of non-Jews who resented it, and their friends elsewhere agreed with them. While holding a legal right to exist, derived from the UN, the Israeli state has been singularly insensitive in its means of dealing with the inhabitants of lands it has invaded while defending itself from aggressive and futile attempts to restore ownership of Israeli territory to Arab control. And the whole situation continues to be exacerbated by wilful intransigence and aggression on both sides.

All arguments born out of superstitious beliefs are doomed to go the same way, as was illustrated by Jonathan Swift in "Gulliver's Travels".

Reply 31

Original post by young_guns

Who is this "someone"?

I don't have an individual in mind. I was making a general point.

Reply 32

felamaslen

15

To be fair, much of the criticism aimed at Israel is not aimed at its enemies, whose human rights abuses are far worse, whose conduct in war is far worse, and who have openly called for genocide against the Jews (Nasser, Al-Husseini, Hamas, Hezbollah etc. have all done so). So while criticism of Israel is obviously not axiomatically antisemitic, I don't think many people claim that. Rather, they claim that the actual criticism of Israel which does occur is often unfair, and they use antisemitism to explain why people levy this unfair criticism.

I actually don't think the unfair criticism is due to antisemitism. I think it is because Israel is so obviously a democracy, while its enemies so obviously are not, and there is a certain type of person, especially in the Western world, who likes to judge democracies very differently to non-democracies. To them, non-democracies, because they are poor (due to their lack of freedom), are "victims", while the democracies, who are rich (due to their freedom), are "oppressors". This goes well with a certain kind of left-wing mindset, though it is totally incorrect.

Reply 33

queen-bee