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Deadly gun attack in Paris: Global reactions & discussion

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Original post by Good bloke
Don't be silly! The Moslems on TSR will tell you that to be a Moslem you have to believe only a few things - the five Pillars of Islam. If you subscribe to them you are a Moslem. Going further, being extreme in other beliefs, doesn't negate that. They will, according to Islam, be punished in the afterlife for their sins.


I find that hard to believe but I garentuee you that any educated western muslim would 100% condem theose nutty islamists..

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Original post by elhm1800
Pretty sure you mean *rational. Dont worry about it.

Oops, thanks!
Original post by Thuggee
no it doesnt, where does it? in the 7th century when islam originated, what we class as 'extreme' was perfectly normal.

anyone that wants to make poltiical statments can find examples in islamic tradition for most things - mohamed killed people that didnt agree with him, so did all the islamic caliphs, war is part and parcel of islamic history so much so its narrated about regually. so they havent made anything up, they are simply quoting. equally all of their proposed goals and actions are driven by doctine that comes from the standard sources, and they recruit people using the same. its idiotic to suggest becuase a muslim is politicised they are no longer muslim. what about the millions of muslims that demand a palestinan state - are they now non practicing muslims?:rolleyes:


You sound as extreme in your beliefs as the islamists! I think you'll find that the millions of muslims (and non muslims) who want a palastinian state dont agree with killing innocent people- something the zionists have no issue with.

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Original post by elhm1800
I find that hard to believe but I garentuee you that any educated western muslim would 100% condem theose nutty islamists..


You continue to spout nonsense. You cannot make such a guarantee. The perpetrators themselves are French-born and educated for instance. And Anjem Choudary, British-born and educated, has tweeted in support of them:

http://www.vocativ.com/culture/religion/charlie-hebdo-terror-attack-paris-islam/
Original post by elhm1800
You sound as extreme in your beliefs as the islamists! I think you'll find that the millions of muslims (and non muslims) who want a palastinian state dont agree with killing innocent people- something the zionists have no issue with.

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no their issue is allowing israel to have a state - the killing of people is secondary to them, otherwise why would they invoke war with israel and support a terrosit group into power? this a political matter that islamists link to islam, theroefre all muslims follow the agenda. its not about loss of life - if it were the same muslims would have risen up against saddam hussein or IS now - but they havent.
Original post by elhm1800


These attackers aren't rational if they kill 12 people for not liking a cartoon.
Original post by Good bloke
You continue to spout nonsense. You cannot make such a guarantee. The perpetrators themselves are French-born and educated for instance. And Anjem Choudary, British-born and educated, has tweeted in support of them:

http://www.vocativ.com/culture/religion/charlie-hebdo-terror-attack-paris-islam/


No need to be rude...we're all adults here(most of us).
Not sure if u live in the uk but over here Anjem Choudary is the biggest joke this country's got when wanting to hear British muslims' opinions. He is nothing more than a dangerous farce and he is definitely not educated and is definitely condemned by every educated muslim.

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Original post by DiddyDec
These attackers aren't rational if they kill 12 people for not liking a cartoon.


Well done! 1 doggy biscuit for you...
No sheizer sherlock we all agree on that. They do not represent normal educated people who believe in a religion.

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Original post by elhm1800
Well then they're not muslims then are they..

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Is a fundamentalist Christian still a Christian?
Original post by elhm1800
He is nothing more than a dangerous farce and he is definitely not educated and is definitely condemned by every educated muslim.


I wasn't being rude, and if you make specious arguments I am perfectly entitled to say so.

Once again you seek to speak for all Moslems. Anjem Choudary is a Western-born and educated Moslem, part of the group that you, a few minutes ago 100% guaranteed could not hold such views, and others are of his view - no matter what you say. You seem to have adopted the no true Scotsman line, which, as we all know, is a ridiculous argument.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by elhm1800
Well done! 1 doggy biscuit for you...
No sheizer sherlock we all agree on that. They do not represent normal educated people who believe in a religion.

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You are the one that tried to apply rational thought to these nutjobs.
Original post by Kagutsuchi
Is a fundamentalist Christian still a Christian?


Yes. A fundamental Muslim is a Muslim. A fundamental Christian is a Christian.
It's where the media and others label the Muslim fundamental when the real case is that the Muslim is wrongly educated and misled on Islamic teaching. The Quran tells us a Muslim who does not pray is not a Muslim. To be a Muslim you have to behave like a Muslim and the terrorists do not behave in the way a Muslim is meant to behave and due to this and the Quran they are not Muslims.

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Original post by elhm1800
I find that hard to believe but I garentuee you that any educated western muslim would 100% condem theose nutty islamists..

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The issue isn't lack or absence of education, but rather the matter of interpretation of scripture and intolerance.
Original post by HarryBarney
Yes. A fundamental Muslim is a Muslim. A fundamental Christian is a Christian.
It's where the media and others label the Muslim fundamental when the real case is that the Muslim is wrongly educated and misled on Islamic teaching. The Quran tells us a Muslim who does not pray is not a Muslim. To be a Muslim you have to behave like a Muslim and the terrorists do not behave in the way a Muslim is meant to behave and due to this and the Quran they are not Muslims.

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I was posing the question to elhm in order for him to understand that a fundamentalist Christian is still a Christian, just as a fundamentalist Muslim is still a Muslim.

By the way, you can't really say they aren't Muslims. Their actions are borne from their interpretation of the scripture - what makes your interpretation more valid than theirs?

Also, I don't see what praying has to do with this. I'd bet my first hard earned pound sterling that these Muslims do pray.
(edited 9 years ago)
Reply 654
Political parties will organise a demonstration for national unity. But the Front National will be excluded..
Original post by Good bloke
I wasn't being rude, and if you make specious arguments I am perfectly entitled to say so.

Once again you seek to speak for all Moslems. Anjem Choudary is a Western-born and educated Moslem, part of the group that you, a few minutes ago 100% guaranteed could not hold such views, and others are of his view - no matter what you say. You seem to have adopted the no true Scotsman line, which, as we all know, is a ridiculous argument.


Anjem Choudary if you had bothered to look up anything about him is known to criticise the west like there's no tomorrow. He wants to live in a sharia state - whatever the hell that is- and leave the west. He is NOT I repeat NOT an example to use when trying to see what an educated muslim thinks about the world.

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Original post by HarryBarney
To be a Muslim you have to behave like a Muslim and the terrorists do not behave in the way a Muslim is meant to behave and due to this and the Quran they are not Muslims.


Well, no. If this were true every Moslem who committed any sin at all would not be a Moslem. This would, surely, leave Islam as a very small religion indeed, surely?

Are you claiming that all Moslems are sin-free, or is it the case that only the sin of terrorism loses you your status as a Moslem? Isn't it the case that Allah decides who is a good Moslem, and isn't it a sin under Islam to second guess Allah's judgements?
Original post by elhm1800
He is NOT I repeat NOT an example to use when trying to see what an educated muslim thinks about the world.


On the contrary. He is educated; he is a Moslem; he was born in the UK. He is the very definition of the subject of your cast-iron guarantee that no western-born and educated Moslem could think as he does.

You should google "no true Scotsman fallacy" and see where you are going wrong before you respond in this way again. You do your credibility no favours by persisting.
Original post by Good bloke
Well, no. If this were true every Moslem who committed any sin at all would not be a Moslem. This would, surely, leave Islam as a very small religion indeed, surely?

Are you claiming that all Moslems are sin-free, or is it the case that only the sin of terrorism loses you your status as a Moslem? Isn't it the case that Allah decides who is a good Moslem, and isn't it a sin under Islam to second guess Allah's judgements?


I didn't say having sins would make someone not a Muslim. There are certain things that a Muslim can do which can make him no longer a Muslim according to the quran. Such as praying. If a Muslim doesn't pray according to the Quran they are not Muslim.

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As if passports were just left behind in their cars :rolleyes: do people actually believe this stuff?

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