The Liverpool FC Thread XII
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Original post by AR_95
Yh it's true Arsenal struggle against the big teams, which is why we manage to win against you guys more often then not.
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1/10, find something to do m8
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by So Instinct
1/10, find something to do m8
Rate it what you want but it's true.
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Original post by AR_95
As is what I said lol.
The irony of being WUMmed by an Arsenal fan 
Original post by A Mysterious Lord
The irony of being WUMmed by an Arsenal fan
That would suggest the attempt at wumming wasn't a total failure.
Original post by So Instinct
That would suggest the attempt at wumming wasn't a total failure.
Probably wasn't if you're still going on about it
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Original post by AR_95
Lol ok.
Original post by Zürich
We've got Monaco?
No surprise that a Liverpool fan missed the draw though tbf, Europa wasnt on till later was it?
No surprise that a Liverpool fan missed the draw though tbf, Europa wasnt on till later was it?
I wouldn't completely underestimate them. Either way you have been knocked out at R16 for the last 4 years in a row. If you're lucky, you'll go out at the QF, woopdedoo.
Come back when you've won a Champions League trophy
Original post by Zerforax
Come back when you've won a Champions League trophy
oooooooooooooooooh
As far as exciting teams go I agree with City, I don't find anyone else that exciting this year. I think we're still exciting when we go gung-ho and Sturridge is in the team, bar that it's pretty flat. Also agree that Arsenal are hit and miss and that Chelsea haven't entertained me for quite a while. Anything with a shoddy defense and good attacking flair make for excellent entertainment, basically us last season.
And for the league I've never thought 'the season is over' or that top 4 is unattainable. I reckon it will be very tight and the teams will yoyo all the way until the end of the season but I don't feel like West Ham and possibly Southampton have enough about them to go the whole way and will drop enough points to drop to around 6th, though that could literally only be 1-5 points behind.
Manu aren't much different from us or Arsenal, their attacking verve has bailed them out somewhat but I think that will catch them up and they will drop a few points e.g. like todays result.
I just don't rate Tottenham, if Kane gets injured or hits a dry patch they will drop points for sure. They have conceded more goals so far than we have.
Arsenal are just inconsistent, there are few things in life that are guaranteed though and Wenger getting 4th has been one of those things. Cliche aside though still think they will get 4th even though the more they come fourth via scrapes and unconvincing late runs the more chance they have of eventually missing out one year, that's just the law of averages.
Down to Liverpool; we could easily miss out this year but I think we still have enough to get into the top 4 and I've always thought that. It doesn't need to be as depressing and doom and gloom as you guys often are on here. We are after all only 4 points off and had we not bottled it against Leicester would have been 2 off, it really puts it into perspective how bad the league is this year. Also remember that under BR we've kicked on in the second half of the season every year, I expect it to be no different this year.
Markovic: Said he would improve and show some quality when he was playing **** and quite a few people were already saying he's not good enough. But even back then we Strange Fruit and myself said it's silly to judge him already. He's been improving and having odd games of quality and will continue to do so, by the end of the year he will have played a decent roll in getting our team to where ever it is.
Balo: Weird one, I still have faith in him even if nobody else does. He's scapegoated often, he's not innocent but I think Sturridge returning will be quite beneficial for him.
He does press, perhaps not constantly throughout the game like Suarez did but Suarez often had Sturridge to help him out where as Balo presses alone which often ends up going unnoticed and rarely achieves much as he is just played around which is often when you see him stop pressing for a bit only to go and do it randomly again later on when a bit more impetus is injected into him from the manager or general play.
You may notice against Balo teams will push up, because he's not going to run in behind them as that's not his style of play and they will simply man mark him out of the game which is why you seem him quite often trying to beat a few men, Sturridge will help to counter this. Essentially with Sturridge he's a pacey forward and naturally opposing teams willl drop deeper to not allow Sturridge any space for him to utilise his pace and make those runs beyond the last man he did so often last year. This brings balo into the game and gets him more involved around the opposing penalty box which he's often not in due to coming short for the ball and with opposing teams defending high up the pitch. And if they don't defend deep they allow space for Sturridges runs which also plays into our hands and is what we saw somewhat against Tottenham earlier this season.
I don't think Balo will ever be that great though, he's not even the type of striker Brendan Rodgers typically would go for, the striker that fits our/his system is a pacey one who makes runs off the final defender. He's more of a plan B type of defender for us and thus I think in future he should be replaced with someone of the mold described and he should be a our 3rd choice. But for now he will hopefully hit some form with Sturridge and pass the time.
Suso: Not really too fussed, he'd gained an odd cult following at LFC by being alright every pre-season but he's never broken through due to Coutinho being better and as Jam said a while back the purchase of Marko more or less put the final nail in Suso's coffin. I did like him though and was hopeful for him but alas it never worked him out, wish him well regardless.
Lambert: Similar to Balo really, he is the type of player that plays well off somebody who is making runs. Play him properly and his return will improve it's really that simple. Liverpool have a constant knack of buying players and then trying to play them out of the position they played well in that actually warranted us buying the player. It's pretty irritating tbh.
Mignolet: It's a matter of fact that Mignolet is better than GK we are seeing to day. I accept he made mistakes but Mignolet had point saving games for us numerous times and generally speaking was decent, I find it hard to believe he has suddenly just become **** like people are actually trying to make out. There is one constant that stands out in the decline our Pepe Reina and Mignolet and that's out GK coach. Both keepers were decent and both have declined under him, the guy is employed to coach and improve our GK's and he's failed spectacularly.
I wouldn't sell Migs, I accept that he's not the perfect keeper for us and in truth he never was and never will be but he's a good 2nd keeper to have. Whether we can afford him as a 2nd keeper I'm not sure but in an ideal world I would stick with Mignolet until we can find someone who fits the mould.
LFC have a classic problem with their approach in the transfer market and that is the fact that we look for the possible deals instead of what is right for us; everyone and their dog knew that we needed a sweeper keeper like Lloris, but Mignolet became available and even though they knew he wan't the type keeper that fits our system LFC went ahead and bought him because the deal probably looked good at the time. This ties into the playing the player out of position thing, we're trying to change Migs and it's not a smooth transition, he's flapping at balls and now the world is getting on his back which isn't helping anyone. I also don't think BR's approach with him was the right one, he tried the stick approach with Mignolet in terms of dropping him before the Manu game and publicly announcing he's been poor and is being dropped "indefinitely" whereas I feel Mignolet need more of a softer approach similar to what you saw Steven Gerrard do after the last game which was actually very pleasing to see, which brings me nicely on to the Gerrard saga.
Garrard: It's sad to see him go, I've been watching football since 2004 and so have never known a Liverpool team without the man, he is Mr Liverpool and the last home game of the season is honestly going to be a tearjerker.
I wish he would have accepted a sub role but I feel like this move is probably best for all parties involved. We don't feel like we need to rely on him and that he has to play because in all honesty it became too often that he was a passenger in the game, he now extends his career and will probably be one of the best players in the MLS. Fair play too him.
Ideally he would have stayed but I wait for the day he returns to the club, he has so much to offer us off the pitch and you can see he has a positive presence and has the ability to galvanize players.
Not to undermine the gesture but the man deserves a statue or commemoration of some sort.
Brendan Rodgers. I'm neither here nor there about BR, a lot of the people that are berating him irritate me though, they often forget the man came into the job saying it's a new experience for him and that he will be learning on the job. This was all fine while he was winning but when he does eventually make mistakes they all get on his back and want him out, so fickle. He's been underwhelming in the transfer window but a lot of the transfers have made more business sense than team sense which often makes me think that the players he wants aren't being signed or the team isn't managing to get. I deffo don't feel like Balo was ever his signing, he himself said prior the deal he didn't want Balo and he wasn't the type of striker to fit the mould. Same goes for Lambert and Migs, they seemed more like calculated risks and business deals. They were bought with faith that BR is a good coach (which he is) so he could wave a magic wand and improve them to work with them, possibly selling them on in future.
I think it's safe to say BR isn't a great defensive coach and never has been, even in his past jobs his teams have never had great defensive record and often relied on a core of free flowing attacking football to achieve their positions in the league. When he was under Swansea they were often praised but not for keeping it tight at the back like a Mourinho or Benitez it was for their passing based attacking football style, Tikki Taka if you will.
Ultimately though I have time for BR and while I accept his shortcomings I reckon he might come good. Also I really enjoy the style of football he has worked into the team, the fast pace and high pressing, once Sturridge is back and settled I'm hoping for some entertaining games.
This transfer window:
I don't think there will be much activity and I don't feel like we need to panic buy anyone. You guys need to remember the finance side of things and throw a bit or realism into here, we have a lot of players on loan atm and we were flirting with FFP not too long ago. We're calling for a striker but unless we sell it feels unlikely we will get one, remember we have 6 first team strikers on the book with Sturridge, Balo, Lambert, Borini, Aspas, Origi and Ojo inbetween. Don't get me wrong I do want a striker, but not Berahino. Do we outright need one? It's arguable but with Sturridge returning I don't mind the idea of just giving him and Balo until the end of season. We need to sell Aspas and Borini and bring someone in by the start of next season though.
As for GK, pls get rid of Brad Jones, how the guy is even at LFC is a damn mystery. Migs will do for now but we should be looking to get in someone who fits. The annoying thing is Valdes sort of fitted this seasons criteria, get him on a free and he can compete with Migs and likely become first choice while Mignolet can have a break from the limelight until the end of the season when we can go and look for a permanent upgrade.
Not sure if we will bring a GK in this window, probs not, hope we don't panic buy or try to buy another player who doesn't fit the mould.
We need to look for a Gerrard replacement, we've been calling out for a DM for years now ever since Mascherano left. Lucas has been decent and much better than Gerrard in terms of offering possession but ultimately isn't good enough and should be 2nd fiddle to someone who we bring.
Then there was this whole Shaqiri thing which I don't get why people think is a big deal. First rumored link was started by either The Mirror or The Metro ffs, hardly anything solid. Secondly our problems won't be fixed via Shaqiri, I wouldn't have minded him as I wouldn't mind us overloading on strong attacking players but I don't actually care that we didn't get him and his contribution probably wouldn't have made a significant difference that say a DM would or possibly a prolific striker.
Also apparently Lucas was waving goodbye after the last game and has tweeted "thanks for everything". If this means he is leaving that is extremely worrying.
Anyway I've left enough of a load on you guys. That's probably me out for now I still cba with FF it's still pretty tedious and full of cretins. Peace.
Also inb4 ncl & tldr.
And for the league I've never thought 'the season is over' or that top 4 is unattainable. I reckon it will be very tight and the teams will yoyo all the way until the end of the season but I don't feel like West Ham and possibly Southampton have enough about them to go the whole way and will drop enough points to drop to around 6th, though that could literally only be 1-5 points behind.
Manu aren't much different from us or Arsenal, their attacking verve has bailed them out somewhat but I think that will catch them up and they will drop a few points e.g. like todays result.
I just don't rate Tottenham, if Kane gets injured or hits a dry patch they will drop points for sure. They have conceded more goals so far than we have.
Arsenal are just inconsistent, there are few things in life that are guaranteed though and Wenger getting 4th has been one of those things. Cliche aside though still think they will get 4th even though the more they come fourth via scrapes and unconvincing late runs the more chance they have of eventually missing out one year, that's just the law of averages.
Down to Liverpool; we could easily miss out this year but I think we still have enough to get into the top 4 and I've always thought that. It doesn't need to be as depressing and doom and gloom as you guys often are on here. We are after all only 4 points off and had we not bottled it against Leicester would have been 2 off, it really puts it into perspective how bad the league is this year. Also remember that under BR we've kicked on in the second half of the season every year, I expect it to be no different this year.
Markovic: Said he would improve and show some quality when he was playing **** and quite a few people were already saying he's not good enough. But even back then we Strange Fruit and myself said it's silly to judge him already. He's been improving and having odd games of quality and will continue to do so, by the end of the year he will have played a decent roll in getting our team to where ever it is.
Balo: Weird one, I still have faith in him even if nobody else does. He's scapegoated often, he's not innocent but I think Sturridge returning will be quite beneficial for him.
He does press, perhaps not constantly throughout the game like Suarez did but Suarez often had Sturridge to help him out where as Balo presses alone which often ends up going unnoticed and rarely achieves much as he is just played around which is often when you see him stop pressing for a bit only to go and do it randomly again later on when a bit more impetus is injected into him from the manager or general play.
You may notice against Balo teams will push up, because he's not going to run in behind them as that's not his style of play and they will simply man mark him out of the game which is why you seem him quite often trying to beat a few men, Sturridge will help to counter this. Essentially with Sturridge he's a pacey forward and naturally opposing teams willl drop deeper to not allow Sturridge any space for him to utilise his pace and make those runs beyond the last man he did so often last year. This brings balo into the game and gets him more involved around the opposing penalty box which he's often not in due to coming short for the ball and with opposing teams defending high up the pitch. And if they don't defend deep they allow space for Sturridges runs which also plays into our hands and is what we saw somewhat against Tottenham earlier this season.
I don't think Balo will ever be that great though, he's not even the type of striker Brendan Rodgers typically would go for, the striker that fits our/his system is a pacey one who makes runs off the final defender. He's more of a plan B type of defender for us and thus I think in future he should be replaced with someone of the mold described and he should be a our 3rd choice. But for now he will hopefully hit some form with Sturridge and pass the time.
Suso: Not really too fussed, he'd gained an odd cult following at LFC by being alright every pre-season but he's never broken through due to Coutinho being better and as Jam said a while back the purchase of Marko more or less put the final nail in Suso's coffin. I did like him though and was hopeful for him but alas it never worked him out, wish him well regardless.
Lambert: Similar to Balo really, he is the type of player that plays well off somebody who is making runs. Play him properly and his return will improve it's really that simple. Liverpool have a constant knack of buying players and then trying to play them out of the position they played well in that actually warranted us buying the player. It's pretty irritating tbh.
Mignolet: It's a matter of fact that Mignolet is better than GK we are seeing to day. I accept he made mistakes but Mignolet had point saving games for us numerous times and generally speaking was decent, I find it hard to believe he has suddenly just become **** like people are actually trying to make out. There is one constant that stands out in the decline our Pepe Reina and Mignolet and that's out GK coach. Both keepers were decent and both have declined under him, the guy is employed to coach and improve our GK's and he's failed spectacularly.
I wouldn't sell Migs, I accept that he's not the perfect keeper for us and in truth he never was and never will be but he's a good 2nd keeper to have. Whether we can afford him as a 2nd keeper I'm not sure but in an ideal world I would stick with Mignolet until we can find someone who fits the mould.
LFC have a classic problem with their approach in the transfer market and that is the fact that we look for the possible deals instead of what is right for us; everyone and their dog knew that we needed a sweeper keeper like Lloris, but Mignolet became available and even though they knew he wan't the type keeper that fits our system LFC went ahead and bought him because the deal probably looked good at the time. This ties into the playing the player out of position thing, we're trying to change Migs and it's not a smooth transition, he's flapping at balls and now the world is getting on his back which isn't helping anyone. I also don't think BR's approach with him was the right one, he tried the stick approach with Mignolet in terms of dropping him before the Manu game and publicly announcing he's been poor and is being dropped "indefinitely" whereas I feel Mignolet need more of a softer approach similar to what you saw Steven Gerrard do after the last game which was actually very pleasing to see, which brings me nicely on to the Gerrard saga.
Garrard: It's sad to see him go, I've been watching football since 2004 and so have never known a Liverpool team without the man, he is Mr Liverpool and the last home game of the season is honestly going to be a tearjerker.
I wish he would have accepted a sub role but I feel like this move is probably best for all parties involved. We don't feel like we need to rely on him and that he has to play because in all honesty it became too often that he was a passenger in the game, he now extends his career and will probably be one of the best players in the MLS. Fair play too him.
Ideally he would have stayed but I wait for the day he returns to the club, he has so much to offer us off the pitch and you can see he has a positive presence and has the ability to galvanize players.
Not to undermine the gesture but the man deserves a statue or commemoration of some sort.
Brendan Rodgers. I'm neither here nor there about BR, a lot of the people that are berating him irritate me though, they often forget the man came into the job saying it's a new experience for him and that he will be learning on the job. This was all fine while he was winning but when he does eventually make mistakes they all get on his back and want him out, so fickle. He's been underwhelming in the transfer window but a lot of the transfers have made more business sense than team sense which often makes me think that the players he wants aren't being signed or the team isn't managing to get. I deffo don't feel like Balo was ever his signing, he himself said prior the deal he didn't want Balo and he wasn't the type of striker to fit the mould. Same goes for Lambert and Migs, they seemed more like calculated risks and business deals. They were bought with faith that BR is a good coach (which he is) so he could wave a magic wand and improve them to work with them, possibly selling them on in future.
I think it's safe to say BR isn't a great defensive coach and never has been, even in his past jobs his teams have never had great defensive record and often relied on a core of free flowing attacking football to achieve their positions in the league. When he was under Swansea they were often praised but not for keeping it tight at the back like a Mourinho or Benitez it was for their passing based attacking football style, Tikki Taka if you will.
Ultimately though I have time for BR and while I accept his shortcomings I reckon he might come good. Also I really enjoy the style of football he has worked into the team, the fast pace and high pressing, once Sturridge is back and settled I'm hoping for some entertaining games.
This transfer window:
I don't think there will be much activity and I don't feel like we need to panic buy anyone. You guys need to remember the finance side of things and throw a bit or realism into here, we have a lot of players on loan atm and we were flirting with FFP not too long ago. We're calling for a striker but unless we sell it feels unlikely we will get one, remember we have 6 first team strikers on the book with Sturridge, Balo, Lambert, Borini, Aspas, Origi and Ojo inbetween. Don't get me wrong I do want a striker, but not Berahino. Do we outright need one? It's arguable but with Sturridge returning I don't mind the idea of just giving him and Balo until the end of season. We need to sell Aspas and Borini and bring someone in by the start of next season though.
As for GK, pls get rid of Brad Jones, how the guy is even at LFC is a damn mystery. Migs will do for now but we should be looking to get in someone who fits. The annoying thing is Valdes sort of fitted this seasons criteria, get him on a free and he can compete with Migs and likely become first choice while Mignolet can have a break from the limelight until the end of the season when we can go and look for a permanent upgrade.
Not sure if we will bring a GK in this window, probs not, hope we don't panic buy or try to buy another player who doesn't fit the mould.
We need to look for a Gerrard replacement, we've been calling out for a DM for years now ever since Mascherano left. Lucas has been decent and much better than Gerrard in terms of offering possession but ultimately isn't good enough and should be 2nd fiddle to someone who we bring.
Then there was this whole Shaqiri thing which I don't get why people think is a big deal. First rumored link was started by either The Mirror or The Metro ffs, hardly anything solid. Secondly our problems won't be fixed via Shaqiri, I wouldn't have minded him as I wouldn't mind us overloading on strong attacking players but I don't actually care that we didn't get him and his contribution probably wouldn't have made a significant difference that say a DM would or possibly a prolific striker.
Also apparently Lucas was waving goodbye after the last game and has tweeted "thanks for everything". If this means he is leaving that is extremely worrying.
Anyway I've left enough of a load on you guys. That's probably me out for now I still cba with FF it's still pretty tedious and full of cretins. Peace.
Also inb4 ncl & tldr.
(edited 9 years ago)
Goodnight sweet prince
Just saw a stat for "Van Gaal Vs Moyes" after 21 PL games. Same number of points (37), Moyes was 10 points off the top while Van Gaal is 12, yet Van Gaal is 4th while Moyes was 7th. I think this just shows how bad the top PL teams have been this year.
Original post by tomtjl
Just saw a stat for "Van Gaal Vs Moyes" after 21 PL games. Same number of points (37), Moyes was 10 points off the top while Van Gaal is 12, yet Van Gaal is 4th while Moyes was 7th. I think this just shows how bad the top PL teams have been this year.
let's just say it, united and van gaal have been lucky.
lucky that most rivals have been awful and that they have been gifted points with poor performances.
in any "typical" season with adequate refereeing (if such a thing exists), united wouldn't have been close to 7th, let alone 4th.
the fact is that with hundreds of millions to improve with, van gaal has actually done worse than moyes.
i find that funny.
Original post by Lúcio
let's just say it, united and van gaal have been lucky.
lucky that most rivals have been awful and that they have been gifted points with poor performances.
in any "typical" season with adequate refereeing (if such a thing exists), united wouldn't have been close to 7th, let alone 4th.
the fact is that with hundreds of millions to improve with, van gaal has actually done worse than moyes.
i find that funny.
lucky that most rivals have been awful and that they have been gifted points with poor performances.
in any "typical" season with adequate refereeing (if such a thing exists), united wouldn't have been close to 7th, let alone 4th.
the fact is that with hundreds of millions to improve with, van gaal has actually done worse than moyes.
i find that funny.
Oh I completely agree. There have been many performances when they've drawn when they deserve to lose, or won when they deserve to draw. Utd haven't been anything special this season and I don't expect them to make CL next season. Assuming we can keep Sturridge and Sterling fit, get in a short term (but talented) keeper and perhaps buy another striker, I'm thinking:
1. Chelsea
2. City
3. Arsenal
4. Liverpool
5. Southampton
6. Spurs
7. West Ham/Utd
8. West Ham/Utd
That's being optimistic and assuming both our performances pick up and Utd's continue but their luck runs out or they worsen. They've grinded out results so far but I can't see that continuing.
Lucas to Inter for £7m. Could it happen?
Original post by Mackay
Lucas to Inter for £7m. Could it happen?
Bloody well hope not, he's the one keeping us from losing games and we have no other good DM, we know Gerrard cannot do the job, not sure about Can, Allen isn't good enough either.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by tomtjl
Oh I completely agree. There have been many performances when they've drawn when they deserve to lose, or won when they deserve to draw. Utd haven't been anything special this season and I don't expect them to make CL next season. Assuming we can keep Sturridge and Sterling fit, get in a short term (but talented) keeper and perhaps buy another striker, I'm thinking:
1. Chelsea
2. City
3. Arsenal
4. Liverpool
5. Southampton
6. Spurs
7. West Ham/Utd
8. West Ham/Utd
That's being optimistic and assuming both our performances pick up and Utd's continue but their luck runs out or they worsen. They've grinded out results so far but I can't see that continuing.
1. Chelsea
2. City
3. Arsenal
4. Liverpool
5. Southampton
6. Spurs
7. West Ham/Utd
8. West Ham/Utd
That's being optimistic and assuming both our performances pick up and Utd's continue but their luck runs out or they worsen. They've grinded out results so far but I can't see that continuing.
LOL. Talk about delusional. You actually think United will get 7th or worse this season?
"There have been many performances when they've drawn when they deserve to lose, or won when they deserve to draw." - also very true for Liverpool, particularly in the first 15 or so games or the season.
Original post by The_Mighty_Bush
LOL. Talk about delusional. You actually think United will get 7th or worse this season?
"There have been many performances when they've drawn when they deserve to lose, or won when they deserve to draw." - also very true for Liverpool, particularly in the first 15 or so games or the season.
"There have been many performances when they've drawn when they deserve to lose, or won when they deserve to draw." - also very true for Liverpool, particularly in the first 15 or so games or the season.
The only undeserved points I can think of are QPR and Burnley (undeserved wins) and Leicester at home (undeserved draw). Liverpool pretty much got what they deserved in the rest of the games, 8th position in the league shows that. For the CL, the home win against Ludogorets comes to mind but thats all really.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by tomtjl
Just saw a stat for "Van Gaal Vs Moyes" after 21 PL games. Same number of points (37), Moyes was 10 points off the top while Van Gaal is 12, yet Van Gaal is 4th while Moyes was 7th. I think this just shows how bad the top PL teams have been this year.
3rd to 7th are all about 5 points worse off this season compared to the same time last year. Everything is relative though. If every team drew every game but you won 1 and won the title - that's good enough. Sometimes 100 points might not be enough (see La Liga).
I really want LVG to finish 5th or worse so he gets sacked. Instability and constant change is what will slow down the Man Utd machine.
Original post by Mackay
Lucas to Inter for £7m. Could it happen?
Could do if the player really wants it? Don't see what we do with 7mil though. It won't get us a similar replacement and we're already losing our most experienced midfield player in the summer.
Losing Gerrard and Lucas leaves us with Henderson, Can and Allen..
United won't finish 7th....
It's naive to think they will.
It's naive to think they will.
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