"far left" party Syriza looks to have won Greek elections.
Scroll to see replies
Greece is never going to be anything other than a basket case. It's just like Indonesia and the Philippines geographically - hundreds of tiny islands which makes infrastructure and bureacracy impossible. Everything costs a fortune to do - due mostly to geography.
No matter what they do, it will be a disaster.
No matter what they do, it will be a disaster.
Original post by democracyforum
If they are anything like Nick Clegg, I wouldn't worry at all.
They will break all their election promises.
They will break all their election promises.
It looks like they're set for a big win, rather than being the smaller party in a coalition government. So I think that's unlikely.
I'm wondering what impact it might have on other countries in the Eurozone. Spain, another country with a lot of debt, has also seen a left wing party grow in support. Podemos is doing well in the polls there and it was only founded in 2014.
Original post by Messiah Complex
And they will as well and that why Merkel and co are in a state of despair over the entire situation.
From my understanding of it, if they walk out of the Euro and setup a new currency, it would be too weak to stand on its own anyway and become valueless over night, making a debt repayment even more impossible and that coupled with a crashing economy would be a true end game for Greece. If they can't repay and they default, that screws over the weaker european economies. If we ever reach a solution with Greece and they can return to stability, we should severely limit further lending to them
Original post by marco14196
From my understanding of it, if they walk out of the Euro and setup a new currency, it would be too weak to stand on its own anyway and become valueless over night, making a debt repayment even more impossible and that coupled with a crashing economy would be a true end game for Greece. If they can't repay and they default, that screws over the weaker european economies. If we ever reach a solution with Greece and they can return to stability, we should severely limit further lending to them
Greece can't stand on its own now. It would be in no worse a situation regardless. It either faces up to the fact that there are going to be tough times and takes that hit and does try to go it alone or it continues to be kept alive by the Eurozone and play into the hands of Merkel. As has already been stated, you cant be more bankrupt than bankrupt.
Oh, and we should be embracing this far left party fighting up against the corrupt oligarchs in Greece. A party full of young that kept out the threat of Golden Dawn and is full of a younger generation more likely to hold more accepting and progressive values.
Original post by Clip
Greece is never going to be anything other than a basket case. It's just like Indonesia and the Philippines geographically - hundreds of tiny islands which makes infrastructure and bureacracy impossible. Everything costs a fortune to do - due mostly to geography.
No matter what they do, it will be a disaster.
No matter what they do, it will be a disaster.
The bitterness and lack of knowledge is astounding.
Excellent news. The Greeks have had enough of rightwing policies that have crippled their country. Hopefully, the growing leftist movement in Spain, Italy and even Britain will become even more prominent and collaborate both with Syriza and the Latin American coalition against the free market dogma that still permeates much of our society.
Rubbish news. Syriza has no hard plans. They want to take on more debt to fund welfare. This is a ridiculous move and will only make things worse in the long run.
Plus do you really think they can successfully renegotiate their bailout conditions with the IMF? I certainly believe not.
False hopes and promises.
The situation in greece is only get worse with this left-wing govt in power.
Plus do you really think they can successfully renegotiate their bailout conditions with the IMF? I certainly believe not.
False hopes and promises.
The situation in greece is only get worse with this left-wing govt in power.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Messiah Complex
The bitterness and lack of knowledge is astounding.
You're right.
By far the easiest and cheapest state to administer is one made up of thousands of islands, hundreds of which are inhabited and many of which only accessible by sea or helicopter.
I see no possible problems with running such a country. Anything to the contrary is bitterness and lacking in knowledge.
Original post by Clip
You're right.
By far the easiest and cheapest state to administer is one made up of thousands of islands, hundreds of which are inhabited and many of which only accessible by sea or helicopter.
I see no possible problems with running such a country. Anything to the contrary is bitterness and lacking in knowledge.
By far the easiest and cheapest state to administer is one made up of thousands of islands, hundreds of which are inhabited and many of which only accessible by sea or helicopter.
I see no possible problems with running such a country. Anything to the contrary is bitterness and lacking in knowledge.
It was more in regard to the comment of:
Greece is never going to be anything other than a basket case
That is a naive statement. The only basket cases are those that believed political union of countries so economically and culturally different was ever a good thing - the fat cats in Brussels.
Original post by Messiah Complex
It was more in regard to the comment of:
Greece is never going to be anything other than a basket case
That is a naive statement. The only basket cases are those that believed political union of countries so economically and culturally different was ever a good thing - the fat cats in Brussels.
Greece is never going to be anything other than a basket case
That is a naive statement. The only basket cases are those that believed political union of countries so economically and culturally different was ever a good thing - the fat cats in Brussels.
That's something that can (theoretically) be changed. The physical geography of Greece cannot.
Look at the similar countries - Philippines is impoverished. Indonesia is outstandingly wealthy in natural resources, yet can't get itself together. Greece is always going to have the same problems. There is also a problem in their national psyche that they still think they're relevant to the world because of what Ancient Greeks and Classical Hellenism did for the world - during a time when geography was irrelevant due to the society being restricted in the main to City-States.
When you can't reliably count the number of people in your country or raise revenue, or provide services to them - your country is going to suck.
Original post by Clip
That's something that can (theoretically) be changed. The physical geography of Greece cannot.
Look at the similar countries - Philippines is impoverished. Indonesia is outstandingly wealthy in natural resources, yet can't get itself together. Greece is always going to have the same problems. There is also a problem in their national psyche that they still think they're relevant to the world because of what Ancient Greeks and Classical Hellenism did for the world - during a time when geography was irrelevant due to the society being restricted in the main to City-States.
When you can't reliably count the number of people in your country or raise revenue, or provide services to them - your country is going to suck.
Look at the similar countries - Philippines is impoverished. Indonesia is outstandingly wealthy in natural resources, yet can't get itself together. Greece is always going to have the same problems. There is also a problem in their national psyche that they still think they're relevant to the world because of what Ancient Greeks and Classical Hellenism did for the world - during a time when geography was irrelevant due to the society being restricted in the main to City-States.
When you can't reliably count the number of people in your country or raise revenue, or provide services to them - your country is going to suck.
This is black and white thinking, geography is probably less of a limiting factor today than it ever was. Even with globalisation it is not pre-ordained that Greece should be a basket-case.
Tbh the Romans thought much the same about us.
Greece could always sell the vast majority of its islands to other countries or billionaires in order to raise some cash.
They've joined up with the right wing Independent Greek party. Pretty odd partners.
I live in Greece and am really mad and worried about what happened yesterday.
The previous government was actually doing a good job of slowly improving the situation and was following the only way out - yes, it may have negatively affected people's lives due to increased taxation but this year there was actually a positive increase in Greece's economy. And until the debt is at least somewhat paid off, Greece will never get out of the crisis.
Syriza, on the other hand, has yet to propose any actual strategy. The only reason people voted for them is that "people on 400 euro wages should not be taxed". I have talked to many Greeks about this and they all refused to listen to reason. The naivety of the population absolutely dazzles me and I cannot help but feel scared.
However, there is a great chance that Syriza will continue doing what New Democracy (the previous party in power) was doing, simply because there is no other viable option. They will pretend to be "tough" with Brussels, but objectively they are absolutely powerless. If they want to keep control and avoid a riot in a month or two this is what they will do.
Furthermore, they are not genuinely left wing. The only parties that actually follow their said political orientation is Golden Dawn (the fascists) and KKE (the communists), so I wouldn't worry about that.
I guess we'll just have to wait and see...
Posted from TSR Mobile
The previous government was actually doing a good job of slowly improving the situation and was following the only way out - yes, it may have negatively affected people's lives due to increased taxation but this year there was actually a positive increase in Greece's economy. And until the debt is at least somewhat paid off, Greece will never get out of the crisis.
Syriza, on the other hand, has yet to propose any actual strategy. The only reason people voted for them is that "people on 400 euro wages should not be taxed". I have talked to many Greeks about this and they all refused to listen to reason. The naivety of the population absolutely dazzles me and I cannot help but feel scared.
However, there is a great chance that Syriza will continue doing what New Democracy (the previous party in power) was doing, simply because there is no other viable option. They will pretend to be "tough" with Brussels, but objectively they are absolutely powerless. If they want to keep control and avoid a riot in a month or two this is what they will do.
Furthermore, they are not genuinely left wing. The only parties that actually follow their said political orientation is Golden Dawn (the fascists) and KKE (the communists), so I wouldn't worry about that.
I guess we'll just have to wait and see...
Posted from TSR Mobile
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30975437
Thoughts?
The gist of the party seems to be anti-austerity, rebuilding their social framework and standing up to the EU.
Will this help Greece or will it sink it even further into economic ruin? How will the EU react?
The Greek equivalent of Labour have also been utterly annihilated by a rival genuine left wing party that sprung up over night.
Thoughts?
The gist of the party seems to be anti-austerity, rebuilding their social framework and standing up to the EU.
Will this help Greece or will it sink it even further into economic ruin? How will the EU react?
The Greek equivalent of Labour have also been utterly annihilated by a rival genuine left wing party that sprung up over night.
My thoughts are that there is no way they will have the debt written off however as the Greek economy is now growing and they operate a primary surplus, it is possible that they could have a lot of the debt interest wiped out which itself would reduce the amount of austerity needed. They could probably get a few of the smaller things they want.
The real question is how Spain (far left party potentially going to win although unlike Syiza i believe they are Euro-skeptic) or Italy (another country with a primary surplus) react to such a deal.
At any rate, they don't seem hardline enough to leave the EU.
Original post by Messiah Complex
No it won't. How can you become more bankrupt than bankrupt? Greece was on its knees and at the mercy of the EU regardless. If renegotiation doesn't go ahead because Merkel says no and the Greeks go their own way they'll be free to set up FTA's with the emerging global economy to suit themselves. Once other EU countries see that Greece has done this they'll want to have their cake and eat it as well. This is the start of the EU's demise and its hardly the start of the Euro's demise as that idiotic idea was doomed to fail from the off.
Except they will be economically screwed. Any new currency will depreciate immediately by around 50%, Greece won't be able to afford the imports it needs and they will not be able to borrow money off the international markets either. It's not just going to be a case of lets write off all the debt, get a new currency and start signing free trade deals, it'll all be fine and Greece can sail off into the sunset.
Original post by Rakas21
The real question is how Spain (far left party potentially going to win although unlike Syiza i believe they are Euro-skeptic)
The real question is how Spain (far left party potentially going to win although unlike Syiza i believe they are Euro-skeptic)
Podemos don't want out of the EU, but I think they've said they want the Lisbon Treaty torn up and rewritten from scratch.
Original post by Clip
Greece is never going to be anything other than a basket case. It's just like Indonesia and the Philippines geographically - hundreds of tiny islands which makes infrastructure and bureacracy impossible. Everything costs a fortune to do - due mostly to geography.
No matter what they do, it will be a disaster.
No matter what they do, it will be a disaster.
How does this theory explain Japan?
Original post by anarchism101
How does this theory explain Japan?
Or Britain
Generally speaking being an Island country is good for trading etc
Original post by Aj12
Except they will be economically screwed. Any new currency will depreciate immediately by around 50%, Greece won't be able to afford the imports it needs and they will not be able to borrow money off the international markets either. It's not just going to be a case of lets write off all the debt, get a new currency and start signing free trade deals, it'll all be fine and Greece can sail off into the sunset.
Nobody said that. However, Greece is bankrupt now and can afford nothing itself as it is. It lives economically because the EU, well Germany, lets it. Sooner or later its going to burst and to be honest, it's in their interests that its sooner.
Quick Reply
Related discussions
- 2023–24 by-elections thread
- [Official] 2024 US elections megathread
- rosarian v a-levels. ~r's gyg 2024⭐
- How does one even go about answering this question!?
- TSR opinion poll, Feb 2024: how would you vote in the general election?
- Rochdale By-election: George Galloway elected as new MP
- Politics
- Have the Tories stopped being Conservative?
- Geert Wilders's far-right PVV wins most seats in Dutch election
- 2024 UK general election speculation and build-up thread
- Rethinking the nation state - what a Labour Government could do
- How to get an A* in Politics?
- A-level Classical Civilisation Study Group 2023-2024
- A-level Classical Civilisation Study Group 2022-2023
- Predictions for Greek Theatre paper 2024
- Reshuffle: David Cameron is back and Braverman sacked
- Great British Bake Off 2023 discussion thread
- who is donald trump
- Community Awards 2023: Feedback and suggestions
- Edexcel A-level Politics Paper 1 (9PL0 01) - 23rd May 2023 [Exam Chat]
Latest
Trending
Last reply 2 days ago
Why is the political left now censorious and authoritarian??Last reply 2 days ago
Is it true that British unis are prejudiced towards degrees from Scottish unis?Last reply 2 days ago
If the Russell Group was now a fair representation of what it still claims to beLast reply 2 weeks ago
TSR Goes Green: How important will the environment be in this year's election?Last reply 2 weeks ago
Research Rankings of universities if you add Research Quality & Intensity percentagesLast reply 1 month ago
Is University of Birmingham prestigious and respected well enough in UK ?Trending
Last reply 2 days ago
Why is the political left now censorious and authoritarian??Last reply 2 days ago
Is it true that British unis are prejudiced towards degrees from Scottish unis?Last reply 2 days ago
If the Russell Group was now a fair representation of what it still claims to beLast reply 2 weeks ago
TSR Goes Green: How important will the environment be in this year's election?Last reply 2 weeks ago
Research Rankings of universities if you add Research Quality & Intensity percentagesLast reply 1 month ago
Is University of Birmingham prestigious and respected well enough in UK ?
