Do you consider UKIP good or bad?

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Rubbish.

Time and time again its representatives have been caught out saying outlandish things. Farage recently said he would get rid of race laws . True not all members are racists, but they certainly have the capacity

Reply 821

democracyforum

Original post by DIN-NARYU-FARORE

I did

No country should leave. Romania has given more than it has taken and so will the rest of the eastern bloc. Economics wise its a no brainer that we stay in the EU. Culture wise is a different topic. in light of immigration concerns there should be no more expansion

Where will the Eu be in 10 years ?

What about Southern Europe ?

Or do we just plod along on the same path ?

Will Cameron get his reform in the next 3 years ?

Are there any problems of the EU ?

Reply 822

Reue

Original post by DIN-NARYU-FARORE

Farage recently said he would get rid of race laws

No he didn't. He said he would make it legal for an employer to prefer a british candidate over a non-british one.

This is not a new idea, infact our previous prime minister was saying the exact same thing: http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2009/jan/30/brown-british-jobs-workers

Reply 823

Reue

Original post by Smonnie

UKIP is a joke of a party, designed to appeal to bigoted Daily Mail readers. Terrible policies, terrible people, terrible party.

Which policies would you brand terrible?

Reply 824

democracyforum

He said, discriminate based on nationality. Are you British ?

British jobs for British workers

Reply 825

Smonnie

Original post by Reue

Which policies would you brand terrible?

Withdrawal from EU (and therefore isolationism).

Hegemonic obsession with immigration. By this, I mean that when politicians fixate on 'immigration' putting strain on our NHS, or contributing to increased crime rates, or taking benefits, what we are really talking about is those separate issues (health, law and order, welfare) and using immigrants as an easy scapegoat. This is particularly ludicrous when it is considered that recent EU immigrants are net EU contributors.

I just, speaking as a liberal conservative, that they are a bigoted and thoroughly unimpressive party, led by an uncharismatic man, and that they should not play a role within the executive of our next government.

Reply 826

geokinkladze

Original post by Smonnie

Hegemonic obsession with immigration. By this, I mean that when politicians fixate on 'immigration' putting strain on our NHS, or contributing to increased crime rates, or taking benefits, what we are really talking about is those separate issues

Struggling to understand who you are having a go at in the context you were critical of UKIP policies and now seem to be ranting at politicians in general?

Reply 827

DIN-NARYU-FARORE

Original post by democracyforum

Where will the Eu be in 10 years ?

What about Southern Europe ?

Or do we just plod along on the same path ?

Will Cameron get his reform in the next 3 years ?

Are there any problems of the EU ?

Southern need reform not kicking out. The EU needs to have more powers to intrude and monitor countries that take the piss, but greek students are a great addition to the UK education system

Reforms? yes! restriction of benefits? ok! restriction of movement? No

Cameron wont get re-elected

Of course there are problems but it pays to be part of the 2nd biggest economic group in the world.

Reply 828

Smonnie

Original post by geokinkladze

Struggling to understand who you are having a go at in the context you were critical of UKIP policies and now seem to be ranting at politicians in general?

I'm surprised that you're struggling.

Unless you seriously think that there is another political party that focuses more on immigration?

I'm not ranting at politicians - I am more intelligent than that, thank-you.

Reply 829

DIN-NARYU-FARORE

Original post by Reue

No he said he would get rid of race discrimination laws. 'Colour blind' is precisely what he said

Why cant you just accept its a racist party?

Reply 830

Reue

Original post by DIN-NARYU-FARORE

No he said he would get rid of race discrimination laws. 'Colour blind' is precisely what he said

Why cant you just accept its a racist party?

And what is wrong with the term colour blind? He said it in the context that everyone should be colour blind to race and so it would make no difference what race someone was.

You're taking quotes, misinterpreting them or just misrepresenting the context.

Reply 831

InnerTemple

Original post by Reue

Q: "Under UKIP would there be laws stopping discrimination based on race?"
A: "No."

Pretty clear to me.

Posted from TSR Mobile

Reply 832

Reue

Original post by InnerTemple

Q: "Under UKIP would there be laws stopping discrimination based on race?"
A: "No."

Pretty clear to me.

Posted from TSR Mobile

Very clear, if that was what was said.. but it wasn't. As always the context is important.

Anyway; Farage has since explained his response as applying to employers looking to hire a British working over a foreign one.

(edited 9 years ago)

Reply 833

InnerTemple

Original post by Reue

Ok, let's see the exact quote:

Q: "So in UKIP Land there would be no law against nationality based on the grounds of nationality. Would there be a law against discrimination on the grounds of race or colour?"
A: No.

The question is quite clearly about race. The answer is just a clear.

Farage tried to backtrack. He said that he was talking about nationality and nothing else. That's quite clearly not the case.

Farage then seemed to support the views he expressed in the interview, saying that they actually gave a massive slap on the back for progress, so all was good.

Reply 834

geokinkladze

Original post by Smonnie

Unless you seriously think that there is another political party that focuses more on immigration?

The conservatives?

Reply 835

geokinkladze

Original post by Smonnie

This is particularly ludicrous when it is considered that recent EU immigrants are net EU contributors.

This may or may not be true, depending on what considers when calculating net contribution.

For argument's sake, consider it to be true, how does that help a local authority plan for school places?

Reply 836

geokinkladze

Original post by InnerTemple

Ok lets try this:

Let's say in my land there wouldn't be laws criminalising canabis. Does that mean I want people to start smoking canabis? Am I now a drug dealer?

Farage's quote, part of a larger interview which we won't get to see, involved a discussion on the difference between nationality and race. Farage is critical on how the law can be used to prosecute people who discriminate based on race but not those who discriminate based on nationality. Farage's proposal is to abolish discrimination laws and let employers employ who they want.

Reply 837

InnerTemple

Original post by geokinkladze

Ok lets try this:

Let's say in my land there wouldn't be laws criminalising canabis. Does that mean I want people to start smoking canabis? Am I now a drug dealer?

I'd say it means you are indifferent. You don't care if people smoke cannabis, but you certainly do not think they should be prosecuted.

Original post by geokinkladze

Farage's quote, part of a larger interview which we won't get to see, involved a discussion on the difference between nationality and race.

It was clear that the nationality point had already been addressed. The interviewer referred to Farage's stance on this in the question. The question was clearly about race, and race alone.

Original post by geokinkladze

Farage is critical on how the law can be used to prosecute people who discriminate based on race but not those who discriminate based on nationality.

If this is Farage's position, then he is clearly very confused and knows nothing on the subject. The law can be used to prosecute people who discriminate on the grounds of both race and nationality. See S.9(1) of the Equality Act 2010.

Original post by geokinkladze

Farage's proposal is to abolish discrimination laws and let employers employ who they want.

Ah - so now he does want to get rid of racial discrimination laws?

So first he says he wants to. Then he says he doesn't. Then his supporters and the man himself say that actually he was just referring to nationality. Then Farage comes close to supporting what he originally said. Then his supporters keep saying that Farage actually didn't mean race.

And now you are saying that actually he did mean race... in fact, he means anything someone can be discriminated on...

Interesting.

Reply 838

Leeds98

Original post by DIN-NARYU-FARORE

Nah mate

leave the EU

country goes to ****

businesses cant get good trade deals and have to pay customs on everything . they'll employ less people and pay them less which leads to lower standards of livelihood which will piss everyone off

then suddenly black people become the problem

**** that ****. first its the immirgrants then itll be the non-white british

So suddenly your smart enough to decide the rest of us are too stupid to make a decision on Europe?

The UK is a net importer European companies are not going to bankrupt themselves and lose one of their biggest customers because the EU say so. Plenty of European countries outside of the EU trade easily with simple trade agreements. Anyone who believe leaving the EU would cripple the UKs economy is fear-mongering and knows nothing about basic economics.

Reply 839

The Dictator

They could well pull us in the right direction. I must admit, I am not as enthusiastic about them as I was before. But Farage is a decent and an honourable man. Those that surround him, probably less so. I cannot deny being dismayed as their recent U-turns in policy simply to attract Labour voters. I would encourage them to stand their ground in the fight against the wicked collectivist ideology that is pulling our country into the quagmire. I hope Farage wins in South Thanet, and wins big, and I hope the same for all other prospective UKIP candidates.