Jeremy Clarkson dropped from Top Gear
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Original post by Juicy J
They can discipline him. Force him to make a public apology, make him pay compensation to the other party involved. But for the love of God, don't sack the lead presenter of the most successful British show in history!!
Is it the most successful British show in history? It's certainly not domestically, in terms of raw numbers. TV shows (across the board) had higher ratings 30 or 40 years ago.
And overseas? I haven't seen recent figures, but as recently as 2011 Dr Who was selling more in overseas markets.
In any case, it's a pretty facile argument to say that someone should be untouchable because they make money for the BBC. Where have we heard that before? And where does the line lie? Clarkson went too far, he knew it and he has paid the price. End of.
Original post by young_guns
I think people will be surprised at how well Top Gear holds up after he leaves. Will it still get the same ratings? Probably not. But I am skeptical about the claims of catastrophic fall offs in the ratings.
But I suppose all we can do is wait and see. I suspect many Top Gear watchers will tune in anyway.
But I suppose all we can do is wait and see. I suspect many Top Gear watchers will tune in anyway.
I think it'll be like New Coke. You'll get a lot of viewers looking to see what is going on, and then after the first one or two episodes it will implode. Ultimately Top Gear was not a show about cars it was a show about three blokes pissing about on fantasy weekend adventures; the whole show was the characters, not the content.
Top Gear the name will survive because the BBC won't want to admit that Clarkson defeated them and because they probably need to have some kind of car show. But it will go back to being a specialist show focussed on cars and occupying an obscure slot, like Gardeners' World or Songs or Praise, not a show with mass international appeal.
The Top Gear team might well be back in a different format on another channel, though.
Original post by watchingyouwatch
1. you are the one who is saying everyone who doesn't agree with you needs to leave the country
2. Who is trying to silence you ? We are just responding to your ridiculous posts. Freedom of Speech cuts both ways- you say what you want, we have the right to reply
3 Your grasp of racism is poor- anyone can be racist whatever their skin colour
2. Who is trying to silence you ? We are just responding to your ridiculous posts. Freedom of Speech cuts both ways- you say what you want, we have the right to reply
3 Your grasp of racism is poor- anyone can be racist whatever their skin colour
When did I say that? I said, if you hate England and its icons so much, there are plenty of other countries that you will fit in better. Why are you trying to despoil this land for the majority of us? You are selfish. You should leave and try and find happiness elsewhere, instead of crushing those who disagree with you.
There is no freedom of speech in this country. Just look at the punishments Clarkson has had for his non-infractions to see exactly that in action. Or people getting banned from football clubs for singing racist songs, or getting fired for flirting with women, or jailed for making crude jokes. Or whatever. There is no freedom of speech in this country, and that's my point. Liberals are so insistent on creating the kitsch nice-guy utopia that they have made life hell for those people who don't share their values. Which is exactly totalitarianism, for a different ideology.
Thanks for your lesson Professor.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by 41b
I'm happy to have a pleasant conversation with people. Liberals insist on pushing their agenda as hard as they can, relentlessly, without mercy or reproach.
I'm happy to have a pleasant conversation with people. Liberals insist on pushing their agenda as hard as they can, relentlessly, without mercy or reproach.
That's first-rate guff, good one.
So when it comes down to it, they force most people to the point where it is us or them.
Err, the whole point with liberals is that they don't. What you and most right-wingers can't stand is that we beat you in the free market of ideas. The average person thinks so what if two guys want to marry? They think it would be wrong to allow someone to die for lack of health insurance. They believe there should be reasonable regulation of big business.
I know that infuriates that the social democratic centre won the battle of ideas, and so right-wingers now play the victimhood card, and love to believe they are being persecuted.
I can hear the world's smallest violin playing.
North Korea and Cuba will cater to your tastes.
That's odd, given you're the one who is demanding that those who disagree with you should suffer banishment from this realm. You have far more in common with the commies than we do
Sweden
What's wrong with Sweden?
Original post by 41b
I'm happy to have a pleasant conversation with people. Liberals insist on pushing their agenda as hard as they can, relentlessly, without mercy or reproach.
So when it comes down to it, they force most people to the point where it is us or them.
So if you want to live in a liberal-socialist dystopia, Sweden, North Korea and Cuba will cater to your tastes. The rest of us enjoy our Clarksons traditions and old England and are sick of seeing you destroying it with your ideological nonsense. So if you hate England so much, go somewhere that you fit in, instead of ruining the country for the rest of us.
I see you're not calling me a Nazi anymore. I wonder if you'd have stopped if I was white. Who's the racist really?
I'm happy to have a pleasant conversation with people. Liberals insist on pushing their agenda as hard as they can, relentlessly, without mercy or reproach.
So when it comes down to it, they force most people to the point where it is us or them.
So if you want to live in a liberal-socialist dystopia, Sweden, North Korea and Cuba will cater to your tastes. The rest of us enjoy our Clarksons traditions and old England and are sick of seeing you destroying it with your ideological nonsense. So if you hate England so much, go somewhere that you fit in, instead of ruining the country for the rest of us.
I see you're not calling me a Nazi anymore. I wonder if you'd have stopped if I was white. Who's the racist really?
Are you going to stop dibbling your nonsense any time soon?
I don't live in England.
Actually, Sweden, Norway or any of the other Nordic countries really have a higher standard of living than the UK so I may well live there one day.
You're still a potential Nazi
Original post by Observatory
I think it'll be like New Coke. You'll get a lot of viewers looking to see what is going on, and then after the first one or two episodes it will implode. Ultimately Top Gear was not a show about cars it was a show about three blokes pissing about on fantasy weekend adventures; the whole show was the characters, not the content.
Top Gear the name will survive because the BBC won't want to admit that Clarkson defeated them and because they probably need to have some kind of car show. But it will go back to being a specialist show focussed on cars and occupying an obscure slot, like Gardeners' World or Songs or Praise, not a show with mass international appeal.
The Top Gear team might well be back in a different format on another channel, though.
Top Gear the name will survive because the BBC won't want to admit that Clarkson defeated them and because they probably need to have some kind of car show. But it will go back to being a specialist show focussed on cars and occupying an obscure slot, like Gardeners' World or Songs or Praise, not a show with mass international appeal.
The Top Gear team might well be back in a different format on another channel, though.
Ultimately, though, do we really care? I mean, it's just a TV show.
If it's all going to work out on another channel, then great; there's no cause for complaint and everyone's happy.
Original post by 41b
When did I say that? I said, if you hate England and its icons so much
That is so interesting. You're saying Clarkson is now a national "icon" who must be worshipped, or you have to leave the country?
Cult of the personality, comrade?
Original post by young_guns
That's first-rate guff, good one.
Err, the whole point with liberals is that they don't. What you and most right-wingers can't stand is that we beat you in the free market of ideas. The average person thinks so what if two guys want to marry? They think it would be wrong to allow someone to die for lack of health insurance. They believe there should be reasonable regulation of big business.
I know that infuriates that the social democratic centre won the battle of ideas, and so right-wingers now play the victimhood card, and love to believe they are being persecuted.
I can hear the world's smallest violin playing.
That's odd, given you're the one who is demanding that those who disagree with you should suffer banishment from this realm. You have far more in common with the commies than we do
What's wrong with Sweden?
Err, the whole point with liberals is that they don't. What you and most right-wingers can't stand is that we beat you in the free market of ideas. The average person thinks so what if two guys want to marry? They think it would be wrong to allow someone to die for lack of health insurance. They believe there should be reasonable regulation of big business.
I know that infuriates that the social democratic centre won the battle of ideas, and so right-wingers now play the victimhood card, and love to believe they are being persecuted.
I can hear the world's smallest violin playing.
That's odd, given you're the one who is demanding that those who disagree with you should suffer banishment from this realm. You have far more in common with the commies than we do
What's wrong with Sweden?
Ha.ha. Dream on. Liberals are headed to irrelevance in europe and the future elections will be fought between nationalists and internationalists.
Liberalism has failed. Look at Rotherham to see that. Liberals are the most unpopular and democratically unmandated political grouping today, and those of us with brains will be happy to see the back of you.
God Save Clarkson.
Original post by 41b
Liberals are so insistent on creating the kitsch nice-guy utopia that they have made life hell for those people who don't share their values
Liberals are so insistent on creating the kitsch nice-guy utopia that they have made life hell for those people who don't share their values
If not being allowed to shout "***** ***** *****" (n-word three times) in a black man's face is making your life hell, your priorities are really ****ed up.
Which is exactly totalitarianism
There is nothing totalitarian about a government legislating to curb particular expressions that are abusive, degrading and which have a tendency to provoke tension or violence between different races or social classes.
Legislating behaviour to promote harmony between the classes has a very long history in this country, and there has never been anything like freedom of speech in England. Speech is freer today on the vast majority of subjects than it has been in the past.
So it's funny for you to complain that it is we who don't like England and it's traditions. It appears that, actually, you are the one who is slating England's long-standing tradition of regulating behaviour that is liable to give rise to social unrest.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Zander01
Are you going to stop dibbling your nonsense any time soon?
I don't live in England.
Actually, Sweden, Norway or any of the other Nordic countries really have a higher standard of living than the UK so I may well live there one day.
You're still a potential Nazi
I don't live in England.
Actually, Sweden, Norway or any of the other Nordic countries really have a higher standard of living than the UK so I may well live there one day.
You're still a potential Nazi
Why are you talking to me about England if you don't even live here? It's clear I'm talking about Clarkson as some type of representative of classic British society. If you've no stake in the matter, who bother talking about it?
Standard of living is, in this context, the most worthless statistic. Having a robot do my chores is meaningless if I lose my identity, culture and traditions.
Ok. Call me whatever you like. It takes a fool to respond to arguments with insults.
Original post by James Milibanter
He also launched an incredible verbal attack
Was it super effective?
Original post by young_guns
If not being allowed to shout "***** ***** *****" (n-word three times) in a black man's face is making your life hell, your priorities are really ****ed up.
There is nothing totalitarian about a government legislating to curb particular expressions that are abusive, degrading and which have a tendency to provoke tension or violence between different races or social classes.
Legislating behaviour to promote harmony between the classes has a very long history in this country, and there has never been anything like freedom of speech in England. Speech is freer today on the vast majority of subjects than it has been in the past.
So it's funny for you to complain that it is we who don't like England and it's traditions. It appears that, actually, you are the one who is slating England's long-standing tradition of regulating behaviour that is liable to give rise to social unrest.
There is nothing totalitarian about a government legislating to curb particular expressions that are abusive, degrading and which have a tendency to provoke tension or violence between different races or social classes.
Legislating behaviour to promote harmony between the classes has a very long history in this country, and there has never been anything like freedom of speech in England. Speech is freer today on the vast majority of subjects than it has been in the past.
So it's funny for you to complain that it is we who don't like England and it's traditions. It appears that, actually, you are the one who is slating England's long-standing tradition of regulating behaviour that is liable to give rise to social unrest.
One minute you support free speech, the next you want to regulate it. But then you clarify. The speech that you want to hear is the speech you agree with. It all makes sense now.
It isn't nice if someone goes up to a black man and shots "****** ****** ******". But it is in no way liberal or supportive of free speech to criminalise him for doing so. That is the definition of totalitarianism, and you can see how far the logic has gone when Clarkson is reprimanded for making a joke about lesbians, or social workers reporting mass rapes and paedophilia by immigrants are sent on diversity seminars, or immigrants feel it is okay to murder 20 journalists for making racist jokes.
It's either free speech (notwithstanding fire in a crowded theatre) or no free speech, and liberals today have become the worst fascists by switching from the first camp to the second.
You might find worthwhile reading this book. I used to be a foolish liberal like you when I was younger, but reading widely and living life off the leftist thought-bubble has really opened my eyes.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Righteous-Mind-Divided-Politics-Religion/dp/0141039167/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1427301851&sr=8-1&keywords=the+righteous+mind
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by 41b
Ha.ha. Dream on. Liberals are headed to irrelevance in europe and the future elections will be fought between nationalists and internationalists.
Oh dear, you really are delusional. Moderate, centre-of-the-road liberalism has been wildly successful.
The Labour and Liberal Democrat parties are broadly liberal and democratic in their orientation. The Conservative Party is economically liberal and a good chunk of it is socially liberal (gay marriage under a Tory government).
And your beloved extremist parties like the BNP and EDL are widely reviled by ordinary people. The only nationalist party of which you would approve, UKIP, struggles to get more than 15% of the vote. And after May 2015, Labour will be sitting on the Treasury benches.
I'm sorry your far right delusions are not coming to fruition, you really need to grow up.
Original post by 41b
It isn't nice if someone goes up to a black man and shots "****** ****** ******". But it is in no way liberal or supportive of free speech to criminalise him for doing so. That is the definition of totalitarianism
It isn't nice if someone goes up to a black man and shots "****** ****** ******". But it is in no way liberal or supportive of free speech to criminalise him for doing so. That is the definition of totalitarianism
Mate, you are clueless. Pigeon chess doesn't appeal to me, and I'm sorry to say you're not the sharpest tool in the shed so I'm unlikely to get much enjoyment from debating with you.
All I will add is to say that you are so ignorant of England's history that you claim to be somehow authentically English, but then go ahead and ignore major strains in English political and legal thought (like reasonable regulation of free speech) that have been part of our society for centuries.
Original post by awkwardshortguy
Was it super effective?
It was a critical hit.
Original post by young_guns
Oh dear, you really are delusional. Moderate, centre-of-the-road liberalism has been wildly successful.
The Labour and Liberal Democrat parties are broadly liberal and democratic in their orientation. The Conservative Party is economically liberal and a good chunk of it is socially liberal (gay marriage under a Tory government).
And your beloved extremist parties like the BNP and EDL are widely reviled by ordinary people. The only nationalist party of which you would approve, UKIP, struggles to get more than 15% of the vote. And after May 2015, Labour will be sitting on the Treasury benches.
I'm sorry your far right delusions are not coming to fruition, you really need to grow up.
The Labour and Liberal Democrat parties are broadly liberal and democratic in their orientation. The Conservative Party is economically liberal and a good chunk of it is socially liberal (gay marriage under a Tory government).
And your beloved extremist parties like the BNP and EDL are widely reviled by ordinary people. The only nationalist party of which you would approve, UKIP, struggles to get more than 15% of the vote. And after May 2015, Labour will be sitting on the Treasury benches.
I'm sorry your far right delusions are not coming to fruition, you really need to grow up.
Your nonsense and lies aren't working any more. You are the fascist, and it's sad how desperate you are try and paint me, a first generation non-white immigrant into the UK, as a far right supporter of the BNP.
Enjoy your plate of stupidity for dinner.
Original post by 41b
It's either free speech (notwithstanding fire in a crowded theatre) or no free speech
It's either free speech (notwithstanding fire in a crowded theatre) or no free speech
You just completely contradicted yourself. It's either free speech or no free speech.
Or you could take the adult view and say there are some situations where it is reasonable for the government to regulate speech (like shouting fire in a crowded theatre)
I expect a bidding war to break out between various TV Channels (most likely ITV & Sky, maybe even Channel 4) for Clarkson as well as Hammond & May. The thinsg that I think will play on Clarkson's mind when these discussions open is global audience, freeview & adverts. No one likes adverts.
Original post by young_guns
Mate, you are clueless. Pigeon chess doesn't appeal to me, and I'm sorry to say you're not the sharpest tool in the shed so I'm unlikely to get much enjoyment from debating with you.
All I will add is to say that you are so ignorant of England's history that you claim to be somehow authentically English, but then go ahead and ignore major strains in English political and legal thought (like reasonable regulation of free speech) that have been part of our society for centuries.
All I will add is to say that you are so ignorant of England's history that you claim to be somehow authentically English, but then go ahead and ignore major strains in English political and legal thought (like reasonable regulation of free speech) that have been part of our society for centuries.
Oh man. I just feel bad for you. You are so 2005.
Ok. Enjoy your cultural relativism. Even as it bites you in the back side, you'll be too foolish to see it happening.
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