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Question about convergent series/sequences...?

Is it always true that a sequence ana_{n} converges if and only if n=1an\sum_{n=1}^{\infty} a_{n} converges?

Also, what is the difference between a sequence and a series?

Thanks


Posted from TSR Mobile
Reply 1
jh
Original post by A Confused Guy
Is it always true that a sequence ana_{n} converges if and only if n=1an\sum_{n=1}^{\infty} a_{n} converges?

Also, what is the difference between a sequence and a series?

Thanks


Posted from TSR Mobile


The sequence is basically just your list of a_n terms. The series is what you get when you put a summation sign in front of it. Do you not have lecture notes or a standard textbook that gives you the definitions of these?

For your first question, think about a_n = 1/n. Does a_n converge as a sequence as n->infinity? Does the corresponding series converge?
Original post by A Confused Guy
Is it always true that a sequence ana_{n} converges if and only if n=1an\sum_{n=1}^{\infty} a_{n} converges?

Also, what is the difference between a sequence and a series?

Thanks


Posted from TSR Mobile


Certainly not.

Consider the case when an=1n\displaystyle a_n=\frac{1}{n}.

We have an=1n0\displaystyle a_n=\frac{1}{n} \rightarrow 0 as n\displaystyle n \rightarrow \infty.

However we also have that n=11n\displaystyle \sum_{n=1}^{\infty}\frac{1}{n} diverges. This is the harmonic series.

Note: Sequences are just a list of numbers a1,a2,a3.....\displaystyle a_1, a_2, a_3..... strictly speaking it's a function f:NR\displaystyle f:\mathbb{N}\rightarrow\mathbb{R}.

Whereas a series is when you add up a terms of a sequence.
Original post by poorform
Certainly not.

Consider the case when an=1n\displaystyle a_n=\frac{1}{n}.

We have an=1n0\displaystyle a_n=\frac{1}{n} \rightarrow 0 as n\displaystyle n \rightarrow \infty.

However we also have that n=11n\displaystyle \sum_{n=1}^{\infty}\frac{1}{n} diverges. This is the harmonic series.

Note: Sequences are just a list of numbers a1,a2,a3.....\displaystyle a_1, a_2, a_3..... strictly speaking it's a function f:NR\displaystyle f:\mathbb{N}\rightarrow\mathbb{R}.

Whereas a series is when you add up a terms of a sequence.



Or if you want easier example: take the constant sequence (1)(1). It's very clear that this converges to 1, but you're going to have a hard time persuading me that adding up infinitely many 1s will come to a finite number.
Reply 4
Original post by BlueSam3
Or if you want easier example: take the constant sequence (1)(1). It's very clear that this converges to 1, but you're going to have a hard time persuading me that adding up infinitely many 1s will come to a finite number.


What about 1+2+3+...

Spoiler

Original post by shamika
What about 1+2+3+...

Spoiler



Please don't tell me this equals -1/12.
Reply 6
Original post by rayquaza17
Please don't tell me this equals -1/12.


Lol! It does!
Original post by shamika
Lol! It does!


n=1n\displaystyle \sum_{n=1}^{\infty} n diverges via the null sequence test since an:=n\displaystyle a_n:=n \rightarrow \infty as
Unparseable latex formula:

\displaystylen n \rightarrow \infty

.

I have seen the result you mentioned before but it relies on some rearrangement which I don't think is valid.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by A Confused Guy
Is it always true that a sequence ana_{n} converges if and only if n=1an\sum_{n=1}^{\infty} a_{n} converges?

Also, what is the difference between a sequence and a series?

Thanks


Posted from TSR Mobile

If.

A series is the sum of the terms in a sequence.
Reply 9
Original post by poorform
n=1n\displaystyle \sum_{n=1}^{\infty} n diverges via the null sequence test since an:=n\displaystyle a_n:=n \rightarrow \infty as
Unparseable latex formula:

\displaystylen n \rightarrow \infty

.

I have seen the result you mentioned before but it relies on some rearrangement which I don't think is valid.


Warning: if you've only done a first course in analysis, I wouldn't bother reading the rest of this post.

The easiest (rigorous) derivation is via the analytic continuation of the Riemann Zeta function and then evaluating ζ(1)\zeta (-1).

For a much longer discussion, see here. The other main source of derivations comes from advanced physics, where setting the sum as -1/12 makes things like string theory self-consistent. Note that what these methods are not saying is that the analysis you've learnt is wrong and that these divergent series are suddenly convergent. What these methods actually show you is that you can set the value of these divergent series to a finite number and that somehow this makes sense in some rigorous mathematical context. There's actually a lot of theory around divergent series where alternative definitions of summation assign lots of divergent series (in the traditional epsilon-delta definition) with finite values.

In a similar way to 1+2+...=-1/12, 1+1+1+... = -1/2 :smile:
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by poorform
n=1n\displaystyle \sum_{n=1}^{\infty} n diverges via the null sequence test since an:=n\displaystyle a_n:=n \rightarrow \infty as
Unparseable latex formula:

\displaystylen n \rightarrow \infty

.

I have seen the result you mentioned before but it relies on some rearrangement which I don't think is valid.


I recommend taking analysis and complex analysis courses further, they get really interesting and you do see problems like this!
Original post by TheIrrational
I recommend taking analysis and complex analysis courses further, they get really interesting and you do see problems like this!


Cool!

And yeah I will be doing more (complex) analysis courses next year and probably the year after. It's probably my favourite most interesting topic out of all the modules I have done so far (1st year)

thanks
Original post by shamika
Warning: if you've only done a first course in analysis, I wouldn't bother reading the rest of this post.

The easiest (rigorous) derivation is via the analytic continuation of the Riemann Zeta function and then evaluating ζ(1)\zeta (-1).

For a much longer discussion, see here. The other main source of derivations comes from advanced physics, where setting the sum as -1/12 makes things like string theory self-consistent. Note that what these methods are not saying is that the analysis you've learnt is wrong and that these divergent series are suddenly convergent. What these methods actually show you is that you can set the value of these divergent series to a finite number and that somehow this makes sense in some rigorous mathematical context. There's actually a lot of theory around divergent series where alternative definitions of summation assign lots of divergent series (in the traditional epsilon-delta definition) with finite values.

In a similar way to 1+2+...=-1/12, 1+1+1+... = -1/2 :smile:


Hmmmm seems interesting but way beyond me at the moment. thanks for the insight.
Original post by shamika
What about 1+2+3+...

Spoiler




Original post by poorform
n=1n\displaystyle \sum_{n=1}^{\infty} n diverges via the null sequence test since an:=n\displaystyle a_n:=n \rightarrow \infty as
Unparseable latex formula:

\displaystylen n \rightarrow \infty

.

I have seen the result you mentioned before but it relies on some rearrangement which I don't think is valid.


There's two different (but related) ways that I know of to evaluate silly sums like that: one is the complex analysis method noted above, and redefining what we mean by "summation" through abelian means.

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