64% of the UK did not want David Cameron as priminister
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Original post by whorace
Evidently most of them did not care enough to vote.
The turnout this year is 66%, the highest since 1997's 71.4%.
'Evidently most of them did not...vote'. How?
Original post by Tawheed
Perhaps not, but Labour fight for more people than the tories do. A party of less debt and less taxes cutting welfare, raising tuition fee's to give tax breaks on the rich at the cost of indebting future generations with even more debt.
The Tories won get over it. Yes the electoral system is disproportionate but it has worked for a long time and does have some positives such as extreme groups such as UKIP are kept out of government. It's annoying that people like you probable didn't even care to vote when the Lib Dems proposed to change it but now are up in arms just because labour lost. Labour has benefited from this system too as previously mentioned how in 2005 they only got 35% of the vote and 355 seats with the Tories on 32.4% and only 198 seats. You can't cry about how unfair a system is only when the result doesn't suit you despite being more than happy to benefit from it previously. Hyprocisy really annoys me. Am I worried what going to happen without the Lib Dems acting as a buffer? Yes but its really not the end of the world. The Conservatives(Tories)/Labour(Whigs) have ruled intermittently for centuries. Labour will get their turn again.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Little Toy Gun
The turnout this year is 66%, the highest since 1997's 71.4%.
'Evidently most of them did not...vote'. How?
'Evidently most of them did not...vote'. How?
The Cons received the highest percentage of the popular votes, and the most seats, the 34% that moan should get off their lazy backsides and vote.
How much of this figure is SNP or Green?
Original post by Tawheed
I knew this from a while ago, it's just shocking when you count the numbers and reflect.
I'm sure you wouldn't be so surprised if Labour won
Not really clear. With 37% explicit Conservative vote and 12% UKIP who would probably take DC over any other alternative to Farage, that gives him 49%. Add the DUP and the fact I rounded Tory/UKIP vote share down and he probably gets a majority.
The left bloc is a lot more fragmented. Neither the SNP nor Labour can afford to explicitly endorse the other. The Lib Dems no longer have a clear platform.
It's also far from unprecedented. Labour in 2005 won a huge majority polling 35% of the vote to the Tories' 32%.
The left bloc is a lot more fragmented. Neither the SNP nor Labour can afford to explicitly endorse the other. The Lib Dems no longer have a clear platform.
It's also far from unprecedented. Labour in 2005 won a huge majority polling 35% of the vote to the Tories' 32%.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Tawheed
Almost 2/3rds of the UK did not want the conservatives to be in government - and they are.
Thoughts on this?
This isn't a random figure, i go by the total votes, which put tories at around 36% of the vote. Infact, only 6% more than labour who had 30%. So much for democracy even though i can't think of a better system as yet to supply a majority government.
Thoughts on this?
This isn't a random figure, i go by the total votes, which put tories at around 36% of the vote. Infact, only 6% more than labour who had 30%. So much for democracy even though i can't think of a better system as yet to supply a majority government.
70% did not want Labour to be in government. 92% didn't want the Lib Dems.
If we accept that no party is ever going to satisfy everyone, it makes sense to choose the one that's least disliked to form a government. And right now, that's the Conservatives.
Original post by Tawheed
Perhaps not, but Labour fight for more people than the tories do. A party of less debt and less taxes cutting welfare, raising tuition fee's to give tax breaks on the rich at the cost of indebting future generations with even more debt.
Too bad the electorate disagrees with you. Democracy, eh?
Left-whingers indeed ...
Original post by Tawheed
Perhaps not, but Labour fight for more people than the tories do. A party of less debt and less taxes cutting welfare, raising tuition fee's to give tax breaks on the rich at the cost of indebting future generations with even more debt.
Oh, so democracy doesn't matter when it works in your favour?
I'm sorry OP, your whole argument is a joke.
Original post by Observatory
Not really clear. With 37% explicit Conservative vote and 12% UKIP who would probably take DC over any other alternative to Farage, that gives him 49%. Add the DUP and the fact I rounded Tory/UKIP vote share down and he probably gets a majority.
The left bloc is a lot more fragmented. Neither the SNP nor Labour can afford to explicitly endorse the other. The Lib Dems no longer have a clear platform.
It's also far from unprecedented. Labour in 2005 won a huge majority polling 35% of the vote to the Tories' 32%.
The left bloc is a lot more fragmented. Neither the SNP nor Labour can afford to explicitly endorse the other. The Lib Dems no longer have a clear platform.
It's also far from unprecedented. Labour in 2005 won a huge majority polling 35% of the vote to the Tories' 32%.
You will be happy to see my data posted up there. In the last 45 elections, only 12 of them produced a winning party with more than 50% of the popular votes, and this includes year when there were very few, if not only practically two, parties.
In two of those years, the Opposition actually had more popular votes (above 50% even). The highest in record was the first one with such data available, back in 1832 with Earl Grey
Original post by Little Toy Gun
Just to provide some numbers:
2015: 36.9% The Rt Hon David Cameron
2010: 36.1% + 23% = 59.1% The Rt Hon David Cameron
2005: 35.2% The Rt Hon Anthony Blair
2001: 40.7% The Rt Hon Anthony Blair
1997: 43.2% The Rt Hon Anthony Blair
1992: 41.9% The Rt Hon Sir John Major
1987: 42.2% The Rt Hon Baroness Margaret Thatcher
1983: 42.4% The Rt Hon Baroness Margaret Thatcher
1979: 43.9% The Rt Hon Baroness Margaret Thatcher
1974 (Oct): 39.2% The Rt Hon Baron Harold Wilson
1974 (Feb): 37.2% The Rt Hon Baron Harold Wilson
1970: 46.4% The Rt Hon Sir Edward Heath
1966: 48.0% The Rt Hon Baron Harold Wilson
1964: 44.1% The Rt Hon Baron Harold Wilson
1959: 49.4% The Rt Hon Earl Harold Macmillan
1955: 49.7% The Rt Hon Earl Anthony Eden
1951: 44.3% The Rt Hon Sir Winston Churchill
1950: 46.1% The Rt Hon Earl Clement Attlee
1945: 47.7% The Rt Hon Earl Clement Attlee
1935: 47.8% The Rt Hon Earl Stanley Baldwin
1931: 55.0% The Rt Hon Earl Stanley Baldwin
1929: 37.1% The Rt Hon Ramsay MacDonald
1924: 46.8% The Rt Hon Earl Stanley Baldwin
1923: 38.0% The Rt Hon Earl Stanley Baldwin
1922: 38.5% The Rt Hon Andrew Bonar Law
1918: 33.3% The Rt Hon Andrew Bonar Law
1910 (Dec): 43.9% The Rt Hon Earl Henry Asquith
1910 (Jan): 43.1% The Rt Hon Earl Henry Asquith
1906: 48.9% The Rt Hon Sir Henry Campbell-Bannerman
1900: 50.3% The Rt Hon Marquess Robert Gascoyne-Cecil
1895: 49.0% The Rt Hon Marquess Robert Gascoyne-Cecil
1892: 47.0% The Rt Hon Marquess Robert Gascoyne-Cecil
1886: 51.1% The Rt Hon Marquess Robert Gascoyne-Cecil
1885: 47.4% The Rt Hon William Ewart Gladstone
1880: 54.7% The Rt Hon Duke Spencer Cavendish
1874: 44.3% The Rt Hon Earl Benjamin Disraeli
1868: 61.5% The Rt Hon William Ewart Gladstone
1865: 59.5% The Rt Hon Viscount Henry John Temple
1859: 65.7% The Rt Hon Viscount Henry John Temple
1857: 65.9% The Rt Hon Viscount Henry John Temple
1852: 41.9% The Rt Hon Earl Edward Smith-Stanley (Opposition won 57.9%)
1847: 42.7% The Rt Hon Earl Edward Smith-Stanley (Opposition won 53.8%)
1841: 50.9% The Rt Hon Sir Robert Peel
1837: 51.7% The Rt Hon Viscount William Lamb
1835: 57.3% The Rt Hon Viscount William Lamb
1832: 67.9% The Rt Hon Earl Charles Grey
No data available before this.
2015: 36.9% The Rt Hon David Cameron
2010: 36.1% + 23% = 59.1% The Rt Hon David Cameron
2005: 35.2% The Rt Hon Anthony Blair
2001: 40.7% The Rt Hon Anthony Blair
1997: 43.2% The Rt Hon Anthony Blair
1992: 41.9% The Rt Hon Sir John Major
1987: 42.2% The Rt Hon Baroness Margaret Thatcher
1983: 42.4% The Rt Hon Baroness Margaret Thatcher
1979: 43.9% The Rt Hon Baroness Margaret Thatcher
1974 (Oct): 39.2% The Rt Hon Baron Harold Wilson
1974 (Feb): 37.2% The Rt Hon Baron Harold Wilson
1970: 46.4% The Rt Hon Sir Edward Heath
1966: 48.0% The Rt Hon Baron Harold Wilson
1964: 44.1% The Rt Hon Baron Harold Wilson
1959: 49.4% The Rt Hon Earl Harold Macmillan
1955: 49.7% The Rt Hon Earl Anthony Eden
1951: 44.3% The Rt Hon Sir Winston Churchill
1950: 46.1% The Rt Hon Earl Clement Attlee
1945: 47.7% The Rt Hon Earl Clement Attlee
1935: 47.8% The Rt Hon Earl Stanley Baldwin
1931: 55.0% The Rt Hon Earl Stanley Baldwin
1929: 37.1% The Rt Hon Ramsay MacDonald
1924: 46.8% The Rt Hon Earl Stanley Baldwin
1923: 38.0% The Rt Hon Earl Stanley Baldwin
1922: 38.5% The Rt Hon Andrew Bonar Law
1918: 33.3% The Rt Hon Andrew Bonar Law
1910 (Dec): 43.9% The Rt Hon Earl Henry Asquith
1910 (Jan): 43.1% The Rt Hon Earl Henry Asquith
1906: 48.9% The Rt Hon Sir Henry Campbell-Bannerman
1900: 50.3% The Rt Hon Marquess Robert Gascoyne-Cecil
1895: 49.0% The Rt Hon Marquess Robert Gascoyne-Cecil
1892: 47.0% The Rt Hon Marquess Robert Gascoyne-Cecil
1886: 51.1% The Rt Hon Marquess Robert Gascoyne-Cecil
1885: 47.4% The Rt Hon William Ewart Gladstone
1880: 54.7% The Rt Hon Duke Spencer Cavendish
1874: 44.3% The Rt Hon Earl Benjamin Disraeli
1868: 61.5% The Rt Hon William Ewart Gladstone
1865: 59.5% The Rt Hon Viscount Henry John Temple
1859: 65.7% The Rt Hon Viscount Henry John Temple
1857: 65.9% The Rt Hon Viscount Henry John Temple
1852: 41.9% The Rt Hon Earl Edward Smith-Stanley (Opposition won 57.9%)
1847: 42.7% The Rt Hon Earl Edward Smith-Stanley (Opposition won 53.8%)
1841: 50.9% The Rt Hon Sir Robert Peel
1837: 51.7% The Rt Hon Viscount William Lamb
1835: 57.3% The Rt Hon Viscount William Lamb
1832: 67.9% The Rt Hon Earl Charles Grey
No data available before this.
Original post by Arbolus
70% did not want Labour to be in government. 92% didn't want the Lib Dems.
If we accept that no party is ever going to satisfy everyone, it makes sense to choose the one that's least disliked to form a government. And right now, that's the Conservatives.
If we accept that no party is ever going to satisfy everyone, it makes sense to choose the one that's least disliked to form a government. And right now, that's the Conservatives.
I think the idea is not to not have the Conservatives in government or have any power, but rather that they should have a fewer number of seats to reflect their popularity and approval better. This way, they will form a coalition with other parties and increase their legitimacy to rule.
The coalition last term had the second highest combined vote share of the last 45 elections, and highest of the last 44.
Original post by whorace
The Cons received the highest percentage of the popular votes, and the most seats, the 34% that moan should get off their lazy backsides and vote.
My question was how you could say 'most' did not vote when most did.
Original post by Marshall Taylor
How much of this figure is SNP or Green?
Vote shares:
1. Conservatives - 36.9% - 11,334,920 votes
2. Labour - 30.4% - 9,347,326 votes
3. UKIP - 12.6% - 3,881,129 votes
4. Lib Dems - 7.9% - 2,415,888 votes
5. SNP - 4.7% - 1,454,436 votes
6. Greens - 3.6% - 1,157,613 votes
7. DUP - 0.6% - 184,260 votes
8. PC - 0.6% - 181,694 votes
9. SF - 0.6% - 176,232 votes
10. UUP - 0.4% - 114,935 votes
11. SDLP - 0.3% - 99,809 votes
12. Alliance - 0.2% - 61,556 votes
13. TUSC - 0.1% - 36,327 votes
14. NHA - 0.1% - 20,210 votes
15. TUV - 0.1% - 16,538 votes
16. Respect - 0.0% - 9,989 votes
17. Cannabis - 0.0% - 8,419 votes
18. Yorkshire - 0.0% - 6,811 votes
19. ED - 0.0% - 6,531 votes
20. MRLP - 0.0% - 3,898 votes
21. SLP - 0.0% - 3,481 votes
22. CPA - 0.0% - 3.260 votes
23. Christians - 0.0% - 3,205 votes
24. Workers - 0.0% - 2,724 votes
25. BNP - 0.0% - 1,667 votes
26. Class - 0.0% - 529 votes
Seats in the House of Commons:
1. Con - 331 - 50.9% - 14% more
2. Lab - 232 - 35.7% - 5.3% more
3. SNP - 56 - 8.6% - 3.9% more
4. DUP - 8 / LD - 8 - 1.2% each - 0.6% more / 6.7% less
6. SF - 4 - 0.6% - same
7. PC - 3 / SDLP - 3 - 0.5% each - 0.1% less / 0.2% more
9. UUP - 2 - 0.3% - 0.1% less
10. Grn - 1 / UKIP - 1 / Others - 1 - 0.2% each - 3.4% less / 12.4% less
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Little Toy Gun
Just to provide some numbers:
The majorities before the war were when there were very few other parties so voters had little option, so obviously vote majorities were more common.
You cannot count the 2010 vote as a majority for David Cameron when the other votes were for Nick Clegg, who was deputy. The thread was referring to votes for the prime minister, not for the government, and we are using the assumption OP meant that: vote for the party = vote for the prime minister.
Original post by Tawheed
Perhaps not, but Labour fight for more people than the tories do. A party of less debt and less taxes cutting welfare, raising tuition fee's to give tax breaks on the rich at the cost of indebting future generations with even more debt.
You can't claim a labour government would be more legitimate because you like their policies. You don't care about the voting system, you just want a labour in power.
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by Maid Marian
What I don't understand is how UKIP came third but only got one seat. wat wat wat
Because they were not 1st in a lot of places, the came 2nd or 3rd so it means they didn't gett many seats
Original post by Aj12
You can't claim a labour government would be more legitimate because you like their policies. You don't care about the voting system, you just want a labour in power.
Posted from TSR Mobile
Posted from TSR Mobile
The voting system is really something labour or tory voters need to consider. However, i am clamping down on the tories because they represent a lot less people, and far more will benefit under labour in my own opinion, and that is why the numbers feel bitter.
Original post by Tawheed
Almost 2/3rds of the UK did not want the conservatives to be in government - and they are.
Thoughts on this?
This isn't a random figure, i go by the total votes, which put tories at around 36% of the vote. Infact, only 6% more than labour who had 30%. So much for democracy even though i can't think of a better system as yet to supply a majority government.
Thoughts on this?
This isn't a random figure, i go by the total votes, which put tories at around 36% of the vote. Infact, only 6% more than labour who had 30%. So much for democracy even though i can't think of a better system as yet to supply a majority government.
Where were all the left wing outcries when labour won the last election with even less of a majority.....
Original post by Tawheed
The voting system is really something labour or tory voters need to consider. However, i am clamping down on the tories because they represent a lot less people, and far more will benefit under labour in my own opinion, and that is why the numbers feel bitter.
Your own opinion is frankly irrelevant here. The conservative party got more votes, ergo it has more legitimacy and represents more people Before you try to harp on about whose policies benefit who more, that does not matter.
If you want electoral reform by all means agitate for it, it is a worthwhile go. However leave the ideological bias at the door, you just undermine yourself otherwise.
Original post by Tawheed
The voting system is really something labour or tory voters need to consider. However, i am clamping down on the tories because they represent a lot less people, and far more will benefit under labour in my own opinion, and that is why the numbers feel bitter.
And in the opinion of the electorate, you're wrong.
That's democracy, buddy.
Original post by Maid Marian
I don't understand how that works
I see :/
I see :/
First Past the Post works by electing the party member with the most votes, or the first one to achieve a majority of votes in their constituency, as their elected representative. Take a hypothetical scenario where we only have 2 parties, Tory and Labour, and each party has a candidate standing in every constituency in the UK. In every single seat, Tory beat Labour by 1 vote. This means Tories get all 650 seats in the Commons, even though Labour got 49% of the nation's vote. Tories have 100% of the seats for 51% of the vote. This is the reality of how FPTP works.
Similarly, because of this, UKIP can end up with 15% of the country's vote and only 1 seat - since they were always a minority party in the constituencies they stood in, albeit a popular one. Whereas the SNP have very concentrated support - standing only in the 59 seats in Scotland - they have huge support in those 59 constituencies so can end up with 56 seats with only 5% of the national vote (but over 50% of the vote in the constituencies they stood in). Whereas UKIP would consistently get around about 15% of the vote but spread over a much larger number of constituencies.
This is why people put a lot of stock in a proportional representation system over FPTP.
Original post by littleangel9914
The Tories won get over it. Yes the electoral system is disproportionate but it has worked for a long time and does have some positives such as extreme groups such as UKIP are kept out of government. .
How are UKIP 'extreme'?
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