House of Commons is so gay
It transpires that after the most recent election, the UK has the highest proportion of gay MPs of any legislature in the world. There are 32 LGBT MPs, out of 650 members of the House of Commons, or about 5% compared to a general population prevalence of about 5% according to this article.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/577185/UK-parliament-gay-politicians
What do you think of this? And do you think equality for LGBT has arrived, generally speaking?
Personally, I think it has in the UK. It's true that there is still more to do, but things have changed so much in the last 10 years. It would now be worse for your career, for your life and well-being, to be closeted than to be out; it's perfectly ordinary for a young chap to come up through university being out, to be out in his chosen profession, to meet another young chap and get married, maybe have kids. This would have been unthinkable just 25 years ago
To use a World War 2 analogy, gay equality is like the Allies and it's early 1945; overall, we've won the war, just a few mopping up operations to complete.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/577185/UK-parliament-gay-politicians
What do you think of this? And do you think equality for LGBT has arrived, generally speaking?
Personally, I think it has in the UK. It's true that there is still more to do, but things have changed so much in the last 10 years. It would now be worse for your career, for your life and well-being, to be closeted than to be out; it's perfectly ordinary for a young chap to come up through university being out, to be out in his chosen profession, to meet another young chap and get married, maybe have kids. This would have been unthinkable just 25 years ago
To use a World War 2 analogy, gay equality is like the Allies and it's early 1945; overall, we've won the war, just a few mopping up operations to complete.
(edited 8 years ago)
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I read the thread with prejudice of thinking that you used the word 'gay' in the context of stupid/insulting, but now reading this, it denotes a very perculiar, now retified, problem in my opinion of course.
Gay is the new Oxbridge.
Original post by Marshall Taylor
I read the thread with prejudice of thinking that you used the word 'gay' in the context of stupid/insulting, but now reading this, it denotes a very perculiar, now retified, problem in my opinion of course.
I'm not sure I entirely follow you, but saying the House of Common is so gay is meant to be a play on words, people would click thinking it was some homophobic thing or some puerile use of the word gay, and find I mean it is actually gay (well, 5% gay).
Original post by Little Toy Gun
Gay is the new Oxbridge.
Not quite sure what you mean; care to elaborate? I'm intrigued
Original post by TheBlackWatch
Not quite sure what you mean; care to elaborate? I'm intrigued
Ox Bridge -> Animal Crossing -> ... Ta da, the meaning of that post.
Original post by JoshDawg
Ox Bridge -> Animal Crossing -> ... Ta da, the meaning of that post.
Err...
Original post by TheBlackWatch
I'm not sure I entirely follow you, but saying the House of Common is so gay is meant to be a play on words, people would click thinking it was some homophobic thing or some puerile use of the word gay, and find I mean it is actually gay (well, 5% gay).
Yes, the title is a play on words I clicked on it thinking something else. What responses would you be expect by saying that 5% of the House of Commons is gay?
Original post by Marshall Taylor
Yes, the title is a play on words I clicked on it thinking something else. What responses would you be expect by saying that 5% of the House of Commons is gay?
It's not a criticism of the House of Commons, obviously. I was inviting comment on that new fact, and also on the equality issue generally.
Original post by whorace
There is an iron curtain descending over Europe, the gays do not think it is fabulous enough.
Is there?
Poland and Lithuania are the only nations in the world with transsexual MPs.
Original post by TheBlackWatch
It transpires that after the most recent election, the UK has the highest proportion of gay MPs of any legislature in the world. There are 32 LGBT MPs, out of 650 members of the House of Commons, or about 5% compared to a general population prevalence of about 5% according to this article.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/577185/UK-parliament-gay-politicians
What do you think of this? And do you think equality for LGBT has arrived, generally speaking?
Personally, I think it has in the UK. It's true that there is still more to do, but things have changed so much in the last 10 years. It would now be worse for your career, for your life and well-being, to be closeted than to be out; it's perfectly ordinary for a young chap to come up through university being out, to be out in his chosen profession, to meet another young chap and get married, maybe have kids. This would have been unthinkable just 25 years ago
To use a World War 2 analogy, gay equality is like the Allies and it's early 1945; overall, we've won the war, just a few mopping up operations to complete.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/577185/UK-parliament-gay-politicians
What do you think of this? And do you think equality for LGBT has arrived, generally speaking?
Personally, I think it has in the UK. It's true that there is still more to do, but things have changed so much in the last 10 years. It would now be worse for your career, for your life and well-being, to be closeted than to be out; it's perfectly ordinary for a young chap to come up through university being out, to be out in his chosen profession, to meet another young chap and get married, maybe have kids. This would have been unthinkable just 25 years ago
To use a World War 2 analogy, gay equality is like the Allies and it's early 1945; overall, we've won the war, just a few mopping up operations to complete.
Do we really believe that 5% of the population is actually gay? The largest impartial survey conducted in the UK found 1.1% were gay or lesbian.
If that's accurate, we really do have a very gay House of Commons. After too long having a Parliament that under-represents minorities, it's unusual to consider what to think about a Parliament over-representing minorities.
Original post by T.L
Do we really believe that 5% of the population is actually gay? The largest impartial survey conducted in the UK found 1.1% were gay or lesbian.
If that's accurate, we really do have a very gay House of Commons. After too long having a Parliament that under-represents minorities, it's unusual to consider what to think about a Parliament over-representing minorities.
If that's accurate, we really do have a very gay House of Commons. After too long having a Parliament that under-represents minorities, it's unusual to consider what to think about a Parliament over-representing minorities.
The website 'Gaydar' reportedly had 2.2 million UK men registered to it in 2010, around the time that this piece of data was published. They played a random, albeit interesting, role in disputing the research because of their membership base.
Based on their membership statistics, they had an estimated 6.7% of the UK population registered on there. It's outlined further here: http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2010/09/24/15-figure-is-wrong-says-gay-website-with-22-million-members/
Obviously, that's not a scientific number, as it neither takes into account those who are gay and never register, and those who'll have signed up numerous times. It doesn't cover those who are female and non-heterosexual, though. So who knows how that could impact it either. There's also obvious details in relation to the census information they're using to measure a population number, so I'm not quite convinced that they've got 6.7%, as my quick calculations suggest the numbers don't add up. Despite that, even when you do a bit of rejigging yourself, it's hard to get a percentage, based on their member stats, that isn't at least double what the Office for National Statistics report, so there's something amiss there.
It's quite interesting just how much the numbers vary, despite the confusion it causes. Social research has always had ethical and methodological nightmares when trying to quantify these types of stats, so it's not surprising to me that they've been subjected to such obvious scrutiny. Whilst it was a large scale study (just under half a million), the responses to it from organisations has been particularly interesting, and has really drawn attention to the limitations of these forms of data collection methods.
What the real statistic is... I wish I knew. Within Sociology, anything from 5-7% tends to be the accepted range. There's some who go as high as 10%, and some who go as low as 1-2%. The Government accepts it as being around 6%, but everybody has such differing variations that it's all a bit unpredictable to get any solid idea about.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by T.L
Do we really believe that 5% of the population is actually gay? The largest impartial survey conducted in the UK found 1.1% were gay or lesbian.
A ludicrous underestimate. What are you so worried about?
That same study showed only 93.5% of people identified as heterosexual. So what are the others?In any case, a poor methodology will give you an inaccurate result
http://www.psmag.com/books-and-culture/gay-population-lgbt-homosexual-sex-kinsey-68670
In the indirect, or “veiled” method, the survey asked people to choose between 0 and 4 to indicate their agreement with the statement “I consider myself to be heterosexual.” The results don't necessarily mean that 19 percent of the population is composed of exclusively gay men and exclusively lesbian women, but rather that a significant percentage of the population is unwilling to position themselves at either extreme end of a spectrum.
Using the direct method, 17 percent or survey respondents indicated that they had had a same-sex experience. But using the veiled method, the researchers concluded that some 27 percent of participants appear to have had some same-sex experiences.
Using the direct method, 17 percent or survey respondents indicated that they had had a same-sex experience. But using the veiled method, the researchers concluded that some 27 percent of participants appear to have had some same-sex experiences.
Are you really going to tell us that 95% of people who have same-sex experiences are not gay? I'm not saying 27% of the population is gay, but the claim that only 1 in 100 are is pretty laughable. As the commenter above alluded to, the Treasury guesses it's around 6%, and these guys tend to be good with numbers
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/10/09/study-polls-may-underestimate-anti-gay-sentiment-and-size-of-gay-lesbian-population/
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by LPK
The website 'Gaydar' reportedly had 2.2 million UK men registered to it in 2010, around the time that this piece of data was published. They played a random, albeit interesting, role in disputing the research because of their membership base.
Good point. If the figures TL is offering are accurate, there are about 80,000 gay men in London.
Grindr alone has 350,000 users in London, that is just the gay men who use it (plenty don't). My experience of London is that it's more like one in ten or one in nine here. And my experience of life is that about one-fifth of guys will trip my spidey senses (which is consistent with what the survey I posted says; 27% of men have had a same-sex experience at one point or another)
Where I work, all except one of the men in my directorate are gay. We are talking about 15 guys in just one element in an organisation that is not particularly associated with gay men (it's engineering-orientated)
Original post by TheBlackWatch
A ludicrous underestimate. What are you so worried about? That same study showed only 93.5% of people identified as heterosexual. So what are the others?
In any case, a poor methodology will give you an inaccurate result
http://www.psmag.com/books-and-culture/gay-population-lgbt-homosexual-sex-kinsey-68670
Are you really going to tell us that 95% of people who have same-sex experiences are not gay? I'm not saying 27% of the population is gay, but the claim that only 1 in 100 are is pretty laughable. As the commenter above alluded to, the Treasury guesses it's around 6%, and these guys tend to be good with numbers
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/10/09/study-polls-may-underestimate-anti-gay-sentiment-and-size-of-gay-lesbian-population/
That same study showed only 93.5% of people identified as heterosexual. So what are the others?In any case, a poor methodology will give you an inaccurate result
http://www.psmag.com/books-and-culture/gay-population-lgbt-homosexual-sex-kinsey-68670
Are you really going to tell us that 95% of people who have same-sex experiences are not gay? I'm not saying 27% of the population is gay, but the claim that only 1 in 100 are is pretty laughable. As the commenter above alluded to, the Treasury guesses it's around 6%, and these guys tend to be good with numbers
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/10/09/study-polls-may-underestimate-anti-gay-sentiment-and-size-of-gay-lesbian-population/
I'm not worried about anything. I would suggest that if 93.5% said they are heterosexual, and 1.1% said they were homosexual, that leaves 5.4% of people who are bisexual or somewhere on the spectrum in between. It's absurd to presume that everybody who has had any sort of homosexual experience is gay, in exactly the same way that it's absurd to say that every gay person who has had a homosexual experience is straight. I wouldn't be at all surprised if 95% of people who have had same-sex experiences aren't exclusively gay.
Given that it's generally accepted that human sexuality is a spectrum of different preferences, it makes no sense to me to co-opt people lying at any intermediate position into being gay. The only figunres I have used are from the largest recent survey I could find which directly asks the question rather than drawing extrapolations from personal experience or dating websites unaudited user figures.
Original post by TheBlackWatch
Good point. If the figures TL is offering are accurate, there are about 80,000 gay men in London.
Grindr alone has 350,000 users in London, that is just the gay men who use it (plenty don't). My experience of London is that it's more like one in ten or one in nine here. And my experience of life is that about one-fifth of guys will trip my spidey senses (which is consistent with what the survey I posted says; 27% of men have had a same-sex experience at one point or another)
Where I work, all except one of the men in my directorate are gay. We are talking about 15 guys in just one element in an organisation that is not particularly associated with gay men (it's engineering-orientated)
Grindr alone has 350,000 users in London, that is just the gay men who use it (plenty don't). My experience of London is that it's more like one in ten or one in nine here. And my experience of life is that about one-fifth of guys will trip my spidey senses (which is consistent with what the survey I posted says; 27% of men have had a same-sex experience at one point or another)
Where I work, all except one of the men in my directorate are gay. We are talking about 15 guys in just one element in an organisation that is not particularly associated with gay men (it's engineering-orientated)
The problem with using dating site data as representative of demographics is that it's inherently wildly inaccurate. By definition, Grindr shouldn't have many married, or non-single people in it. The data is unaudited and there may be multiple profiles of the same person. A lot of those people are likely not to be London residents, but list their nearest large / global city. The same source as gives London 350,000 users gives the entire US 1,558,000 users. Calculating from those figures we find that 4.2% of Londoners are Tinder users and 0.49% of Americans. However, as you say, this ignores people not using the site. I haven't found any data on Grindr's usage among the population, but Tinder claim that in their most popular cities they have reached up to 10% of the population. If we apply this to Grindr users, you'd have figures of 42% of Londoners being gay and 4.9% of Americans. Clearly there is something seriously wrong with using dating site data, and needless to say personal experience is totally irrelevant to the whole of society.
Original post by T.L
The only figunres I have used are from the largest recent survey I could find which directly asks the question
Which is immediately suspect because there are going to be plenty of people who answer the question innaccurately, this is well known.
In any case, you agree that 93.5% of people are heterosexual and 6.5% of people are not heterosexual, according to your own figures. And about 5% of parliament is LGBT.
Why are you so worried about this? It seems to match your figures exactly
Original post by T.L
I wouldn't be at all surprised if 95% of people who have had same-sex experiences aren't exclusively gay.
Do you have any evidence to support that?
This is very good news. A bigger concern is the over representation of fee paying school attendees and Oxbridge graduates.
(edited 8 years ago)
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