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Why do people in Britain hate sinn fein and the SNP
They both stand up to imperialism that you english impose on everyone. Why do english people always fall for propaganda demonizing sturgeon and adams. I will always vote labour as I live in england but these two parties have more integrity than any english politicians that is a fact. They are tolerant and welcome migrants unlike the evil tories bending to the rhetoric of UKIP picking on migrants.
I wish they were running in all of the UK to show england what it's like to be occupied by a foreign power. In my view the only way for labour to go is corbyn who has proven himself to not be racist and demonize these brave parties and their leaders.
So my question is what valid reasons do people in england have to be scared of these two parties? Can they not look past the rhetoric and think for themselves?
I wish they were running in all of the UK to show england what it's like to be occupied by a foreign power. In my view the only way for labour to go is corbyn who has proven himself to not be racist and demonize these brave parties and their leaders.
So my question is what valid reasons do people in england have to be scared of these two parties? Can they not look past the rhetoric and think for themselves?
Scroll to see replies
I don't understand why the SNP are demonised by the English press. So, they want Scotland to be independent. Why is that such a bad thing? Instead of demonising them, why can't the English press come to terms with the fact that a lot of Scots feel disenchanted with their situation as part of the UK, in the same way a lot of Northerners do.
Because i value British power and believe the union is greater than the sum of its parts.
Also, Adams is a terrorist.
Why would you willingly just accept something you don't want?
Also, Adams is a terrorist.
Original post by Steeplechasing
I don't understand why the SNP are demonised by the English press. So, they want Scotland to be independent. Why is that such a bad thing? Instead of demonising them, why can't the English press come to terms with the fact that a lot of Scots feel disenchanted with their situation as part of the UK, in the same way a lot of Northerners do.
Why would you willingly just accept something you don't want?
Original post by intelligent con
They both stand up to imperialism that you english impose on everyone. Why do english people always fall for propaganda demonizing sturgeon and adams. I will always vote labour as I live in england but these two parties have more integrity than any english politicians that is a fact. They are tolerant and welcome migrants unlike the evil tories bending to the rhetoric of UKIP picking on migrants.
I wish they were running in all of the UK to show england what it's like to be occupied by a foreign power. In my view the only way for labour to go is corbyn who has proven himself to not be racist and demonize these brave parties and their leaders.
So my question is what valid reasons do people in england have to be scared of these two parties? Can they not look past the rhetoric and think for themselves?
I wish they were running in all of the UK to show england what it's like to be occupied by a foreign power. In my view the only way for labour to go is corbyn who has proven himself to not be racist and demonize these brave parties and their leaders.
So my question is what valid reasons do people in england have to be scared of these two parties? Can they not look past the rhetoric and think for themselves?
Well I think SF supporting the IRA has a lot to do with it..
That being said, I have family members vote for SF, simply because they are told they are "The party for Ireland".
No party can fix the issues with that country though, especially the economy.
(edited 8 years ago)
well Im not sure why the SNP would be subject to any more scrutiny than any other political party but sinn fein are hated by many (and lauded by others) because the majority of their central figures and their leader have all been members or connected to the IRA and have often played active parts in the murder and disappearances of a couple of thousand people.
Yes it is true one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter but I don't think I would vote for anyone who would support and celebrate historical and current figures who killed and injured that many civilians and armed forces.
Also many of sinn fein's liberal policies (pro-abortion, Pro-gayrights, very leftist stance) are very worthy in theory, but gerry adams has been recorded saying "equality is a trojan horse" meaing he is using these worthy causes to drum up support for a united ireland rather than a genuine desire to improve any of the issues.
Yes it is true one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter but I don't think I would vote for anyone who would support and celebrate historical and current figures who killed and injured that many civilians and armed forces.
Also many of sinn fein's liberal policies (pro-abortion, Pro-gayrights, very leftist stance) are very worthy in theory, but gerry adams has been recorded saying "equality is a trojan horse" meaing he is using these worthy causes to drum up support for a united ireland rather than a genuine desire to improve any of the issues.
Original post by intelligent con
Imperialism is the creation of a colonial empire. The United Kingdom is not such a state: all UK citizens are equal before the law and have an equal civil and democratic rights in the UK. That's a fairly simple concept, but ones that nationalists - in search of grievances even when they sound ridiculous - seem to miss.
Scotland and Northern Ireland are part of the same sovereign country as England.
Sinn Fein supported terrorism against the UK, and the SNP want to destroy it - albeit without the use of violence. This country is their enemy, and it is unsurprising that people in this country do not much like that.
That's not even considering that both parties are backwards populists who don't particularly stand for anything other than undermining the UK.
So basically what you're saying is that nationalism is the worst, most bigoted thing since the Nazis when it's British nationalism, but it's great and progressive when Scots do it?
I am a Loyalist and a High Tory. The SNP and IRA political wing want to destroy the institutions I support.
Original post by intelligent con
They both stand up to imperialism that you english impose on everyone. Why do english people always fall for propaganda demonizing sturgeon and adams. I will always vote labour as I live in england but these two parties have more integrity than any english politicians that is a fact. They are tolerant and welcome migrants unlike the evil tories bending to the rhetoric of UKIP picking on migrants.
I wish they were running in all of the UK to show england what it's like to be occupied by a foreign power. In my view the only way for labour to go is corbyn who has proven himself to not be racist and demonize these brave parties and their leaders.
So my question is what valid reasons do people in england have to be scared of these two parties? Can they not look past the rhetoric and think for themselves?
I wish they were running in all of the UK to show england what it's like to be occupied by a foreign power. In my view the only way for labour to go is corbyn who has proven himself to not be racist and demonize these brave parties and their leaders.
So my question is what valid reasons do people in england have to be scared of these two parties? Can they not look past the rhetoric and think for themselves?
I'm a Labour man but i agree a lot with what the SNP have to say
Original post by intelligent con
They both stand up to imperialism that you english impose on everyone. Why do english people always fall for propaganda demonizing sturgeon and adams. I will always vote labour as I live in england but these two parties have more integrity than any english politicians that is a fact. They are tolerant and welcome migrants unlike the evil tories bending to the rhetoric of UKIP picking on migrants.
I wish they were running in all of the UK to show england what it's like to be occupied by a foreign power. In my view the only way for labour to go is corbyn who has proven himself to not be racist and demonize these brave parties and their leaders.
So my question is what valid reasons do people in england have to be scared of these two parties? Can they not look past the rhetoric and think for themselves?
I wish they were running in all of the UK to show england what it's like to be occupied by a foreign power. In my view the only way for labour to go is corbyn who has proven himself to not be racist and demonize these brave parties and their leaders.
So my question is what valid reasons do people in england have to be scared of these two parties? Can they not look past the rhetoric and think for themselves?
You have such an inflated victim complex, OP... 'The English' don't impose imperialism on anyone. In fact, if you took the time to ask everybody in England (because 'the English' consist of individuals with individual views, shockingly enough), I doubt you could find many who think that they are personally responsible for imperialism being perpetrated on anybody.
It's interesting that you use the same language as the SNP and, like most nationalists, you lack any talent for self-reflection. You would rather lash out and blame the media/the evil Tories/the English/the imperialists than think about why people don't like the SNP.
I can think of several reasons:
1. You indiscriminately tar a whole nation of people with the accusation of imperialism and then claim to be tolerant people based on your stance on immigration. Because you should never demonise anyone, unless they were born in England. #SNPLogic.
2. You whine. You play the victim and claim to be 'occupied by a foreign power' despite the pointed absence of an occupying English army in Scotland. And oh, remember that parliament you've had since 1999? That's occupied mostly by Scots, voted for by Scots. Not to mention that you're basically getting quasi-independence after the referendum, in which, need I remind anyone, Scots voted in favour of staying in political union with the so-called 'foreign power.'
3. You claim that the SNP and Sinn Fein have more integrity than other parties. On what basis do you make that claim? They are both rife with hypocrisy of the highest order. The SNP prides itself on 'free' university tuition for all... but only if you're Scottish. Apparently it's for cost reasons but, to avoid the risk of being too naive, I'll just call it what it really is: tolerating and welcoming migrants, unless they're English.
Given all this, I would contend that you're the one who cannot look past the rhetoric and think for him/herself.
Anyhow, enjoy the nationalist socialism. What could go wrong?
(edited 8 years ago)
To add to what Hydeman says, here are some more reasons the English hate the SNP:
1. Alex Salmond said the independence referendum would be 'once in a generation', but now, less than 1 year later, they've come up with a bunch of excuses to hold a second referendum (EU referendum, Tory government, austerity, they haven't got every little thing they want, etc)
2. At least £1,400 more per person is spent on the Scottish compared to what is spent on the English. This system has been widely discredited, including by Lord Barnett, its creator, and yet, the SNP believe that this is some kind of God-given right and, no doubt, if anyone even thought about making it fairer, they would demand another independence referendum. The closest thing I've heard to a justification for this is the revenue brought in from North Sea oil, but this has been steadily decreasing in the last year, so it would only be fair that funding for the Scots decreases along with it, but the SNP won't have any of that
3. Scottish MPs can vote on issues that only affect the English and yet English MPs have no say over these same issues in Scotland. The Tories came up with a simple, fair and reasonable way to solve this issue by ensuring that all English-only laws have to be approved by a majority of English MPs, while still allowing Scottish MPs to be part of the vast majority of the process of making a law that has no effect whatsoever on their constituents. However, the SNP have once again played the victim and, you guessed it, used it as justification for a second independence referendum
4. Before the election, it was widely thought that the SNP would hold the balance of power in a hung parliament. This would have meant more taxes, more welfare, more borrowing, more debt, etc. However, more importantly, it would have meant that a party that received barely 1% of the popular vote would have held the balance of power. I agree that it's somewhat unfair that the Tories got a majority with just 37% of the vote, but this is nowhere near as unfair as a party holding the balance of power with just 1% of the vote
5. If I were a Labour supporter, I would also hate the SNP because they were a large part of the reason that the Tories got a majority. Ed Miliband told them that if they voted SNP, we would get a Tory government, and he was right; Labour lost seats to the SNP in Scotland, and the Tories gained seats from everyone is England partly because of hatred of the SNP (for the reasons I've already described).
Having said all that, I've got to hand it to the SNP; when the next independence referendum comes around, they'd have annoyed the English so much that, instead of begging them to stay, we'll simply say 'goodbye and good riddance'.
1. Alex Salmond said the independence referendum would be 'once in a generation', but now, less than 1 year later, they've come up with a bunch of excuses to hold a second referendum (EU referendum, Tory government, austerity, they haven't got every little thing they want, etc)
2. At least £1,400 more per person is spent on the Scottish compared to what is spent on the English. This system has been widely discredited, including by Lord Barnett, its creator, and yet, the SNP believe that this is some kind of God-given right and, no doubt, if anyone even thought about making it fairer, they would demand another independence referendum. The closest thing I've heard to a justification for this is the revenue brought in from North Sea oil, but this has been steadily decreasing in the last year, so it would only be fair that funding for the Scots decreases along with it, but the SNP won't have any of that
3. Scottish MPs can vote on issues that only affect the English and yet English MPs have no say over these same issues in Scotland. The Tories came up with a simple, fair and reasonable way to solve this issue by ensuring that all English-only laws have to be approved by a majority of English MPs, while still allowing Scottish MPs to be part of the vast majority of the process of making a law that has no effect whatsoever on their constituents. However, the SNP have once again played the victim and, you guessed it, used it as justification for a second independence referendum
4. Before the election, it was widely thought that the SNP would hold the balance of power in a hung parliament. This would have meant more taxes, more welfare, more borrowing, more debt, etc. However, more importantly, it would have meant that a party that received barely 1% of the popular vote would have held the balance of power. I agree that it's somewhat unfair that the Tories got a majority with just 37% of the vote, but this is nowhere near as unfair as a party holding the balance of power with just 1% of the vote
5. If I were a Labour supporter, I would also hate the SNP because they were a large part of the reason that the Tories got a majority. Ed Miliband told them that if they voted SNP, we would get a Tory government, and he was right; Labour lost seats to the SNP in Scotland, and the Tories gained seats from everyone is England partly because of hatred of the SNP (for the reasons I've already described).
Having said all that, I've got to hand it to the SNP; when the next independence referendum comes around, they'd have annoyed the English so much that, instead of begging them to stay, we'll simply say 'goodbye and good riddance'.
I hate the SNP because they're a bunch of bigoted liars who think they represent all of Scotland.
They manage to simultaneously have a superiority complex and a victim complex depending on the time of day.
They want to destroy my country.
They have managed to turn many Englishmen against Scotland, and divided Scotland itself - they are symptomatic of how inward looking this nation has become. Not one politician during the election talked about foreign affairs, there is no outcry over reduced defence spending reducing British power and influence, the Tories have started seeing themselves as an English only party.
I could go on and on...
They manage to simultaneously have a superiority complex and a victim complex depending on the time of day.
They want to destroy my country.
They have managed to turn many Englishmen against Scotland, and divided Scotland itself - they are symptomatic of how inward looking this nation has become. Not one politician during the election talked about foreign affairs, there is no outcry over reduced defence spending reducing British power and influence, the Tories have started seeing themselves as an English only party.
I could go on and on...
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by L i b
Imperialism is the creation of a colonial empire. The United Kingdom is not such a state: all UK citizens are equal before the law and have an equal civil and democratic rights in the UK. That's a fairly simple concept, but ones that nationalists - in search of grievances even when they sound ridiculous - seem to miss.
Scotland and Northern Ireland are part of the same sovereign country as England.
Sinn Fein supported terrorism against the UK, and the SNP want to destroy it - albeit without the use of violence. This country is their enemy, and it is unsurprising that people in this country do not much like that.
That's not even considering that both parties are backwards populists who don't particularly stand for anything other than undermining the UK.
Scotland and Northern Ireland are part of the same sovereign country as England.
Sinn Fein supported terrorism against the UK, and the SNP want to destroy it - albeit without the use of violence. This country is their enemy, and it is unsurprising that people in this country do not much like that.
That's not even considering that both parties are backwards populists who don't particularly stand for anything other than undermining the UK.
The UK isn't the enemy of the SNP any more than the EU is the enemy of UKIP.
They just don't want to be part of it.
Original post by DarrenBCFC
I'm a Labour man but i agree a lot with what the SNP have to say
Which parts? The economically illeterate, unfundable policies that they claim to want to introduce but never do?
Original post by Hydeman
3. You claim that the SNP and Sinn Fein have more integrity than other parties. On what basis do you make that claim? They are both rife with hypocrisy of the highest order. The SNP prides itself on 'free' university tuition for all... but only if you're Scottish. Apparently it's for cost reasons but, to avoid the risk of being too naive, I'll just call it what it really is: tolerating and welcoming migrants, unless they're English.
3. You claim that the SNP and Sinn Fein have more integrity than other parties. On what basis do you make that claim? They are both rife with hypocrisy of the highest order. The SNP prides itself on 'free' university tuition for all... but only if you're Scottish. Apparently it's for cost reasons but, to avoid the risk of being too naive, I'll just call it what it really is: tolerating and welcoming migrants, unless they're English.
So long as you have attended a Scottish Secondary School or you are an EU student. You don't have to pay tuition fees.
It has nothing to do with nationality. Scottish students have to pay tuition to study in England so English students have to pay tuition to study in Scotland. Seems fair to me.
Original post by MatureStudent36
Which parts? The economically illeterate, unfundable policies that they claim to want to introduce but never do?
Anti Austerity
Original post by KimKallstrom
So basically what you're saying is that nationalism is the worst, most bigoted thing since the Nazis when it's British nationalism, but it's great and progressive when Scots do it?
Don't forget how silent Sinn Fein were on the crimes of the Nazis, the attacks on Irish men who fought for Britain against the Nazis, the campaign of terrorism carried out against the people of London by the IRA.
If anything this country does far too much to see the world from the perspective of a terrorist group which attacked its civilians, I mean the Turks don't exactly show the same understanding to the Kurdish minority who want to break away. In Turkey they'd crush them into nonexistence and then deny the whole thing, not saying we should do this, but really the British have very little to apologise for.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by DarrenBCFC
Anti Austerity
The anti austerity that has involved the SNP using non of the existent tax taking powers available in Scotland in order to not implement austerity measures.
The SNP say a lot, but tend to do little.Funding for education and healthcare in Scotland is falling below that seen in England.
Original post by SausageMan
So long as you have attended a Scottish Secondary School or you are an EU student. You don't have to pay tuition fees.
It has nothing to do with nationality. Scottish students have to pay tuition to study in England so English students have to pay tuition to study in Scotland. Seems fair to me.
It has nothing to do with nationality. Scottish students have to pay tuition to study in England so English students have to pay tuition to study in Scotland. Seems fair to me.
You must have a pretty skewed sense of fairness in that case. England is run by the UK Government, which doesn't pretend to offer anybody free tuition. And thanks for adding to what I knew - it's free for everybody in the EU except the English. It totally has nothing to do with nationality.
So long as the SNP continues to boast that it offers free university for everyone while neglecting to mention that 'everyone' doesn't include English people, the charge of hypocrisy stands.
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