Destitute migrants with new born children.

Reading the news today I saw quite a few articles about the migrants in Greece


who have travelled from places such as Syria in order find a better life. A lot of them are heading to Greece and then on to wealthier European countries.

I'm sure we all have differing opinions about that matter in general but that's not what I'm focusing on here (personally, I feel that they are victims of circumstance and if I were them I'd probably do the same).

Anyway, I've noticed in quite a few pictures across a lot of articles that some of these migrants have young children - in some cases babies who are months old. Now, I'm a woman in my 20s and I live in a relatively wealthy country (UK) but I consciously choose not to have children because I know that at this point in my life I couldn't afford a child and it would be unfair on the child to live in relative poverty. What gets me is that these migrants are coming from poor, often violent, countries and they are having babies. I know some people might say ''they might not be able to afford contraception'' - but that's not good enough, they should abstain if they can't afford kids and have no contraception.

There maybe to instances where a woman has become pregnant against her will and that is a separate issue - we can't tell that from the pictures. But there will be instances where these children have been created with mutual consent and that's what I find incomprehensible.

Obviously, I'd want those children to be given aid and for their parents to be helped but their parents are causing problems that could be avoided and those children are likely to live in poverty for the rest of their lives. It seems crazy to want to put a child through such suffering.

Just to point out, I generally do not care what other people choose to do with their personal lives - I don't care what hair color they have, how they dress, who they want to be in a relationship with (so long as they're of age) or if they want to change their name to 'Mango Ferret Banana Queen' - IDGAF, but when people do things, intentionally or not, that negatively affect the lives of innocent people I find it incomprehensible. These adults are bringing innocent babies into a terrible set of circumstances and abject poverty - I just can't comprehend the rational of that or the level of irresponsibility that could accidentally lead to that.


Controversial topic, I know. I'm interested to hear people's opinions on this because it seems that you're not allowed to express this opinion without people thinking you are heartless. Personally, I think it's heartless to bring a child into poverty.

I agree it's heartless to bring a child into poverty, but people choose to do all kinds of selfish things. And lots of/most people want to have children, so it makes sense that a lot of people in poverty would still have children.

But also I'd point out that while not being able to afford contraception can be a factor, so can being uneducated about sex. Also, it's easy for you to say "I'd just abstain" - would you really? Your whole life? You'd become celibate just in case? I reckon people always search for outlets, things to make them feel better, escapes. And why wouldn't sex be one of those things?

And finally, remember that in some places it's a choice to have lots of children so they can work from a young age and earn money for the family. Yes, that is selfish, but as I said, people are selfish.

If it comes to that, obviously just abstaining is useless. Hence, you undergo chemical castration. The problem with making yourself better by reproductive sex (which amounts to making humans) is that you are making another human suffer (by making him live a life of poverty).

If your argument is "people are selfish, nothing can be done", then you could have saved yourself from writing all those paragraphs.

People are selfish. That is the crux of a lot of ****ty stuff that happens in the world.

It was hardly an essay though

x

Yes, I can understand that it's quite a universal human yearning to want children but I also believe that rational thought should override that urge/yearning if you know that the child would be born into poverty.

It doesn't take a genius to know that if someone puts their penis into a vagina then there is a great possibility that a baby could be created. I don't go for the argument of lack of education. Lack of education concerns things such as believing that a woman can't get pregnant if the male pulls out before ejaculating - but the person who believes that also knows that there is a risk that the woman could become pregnant. How do you eliminate risk? You don't do it at all.

Yes, I personally could make that decision very easily. Maybe for men it's more difficult (but still, since we're talking consensual sex that wouldn't make a different here) but maybe different women would struggle - but to give into that struggle is irresponsible when you know the consequences.
By the way, I'm not saying those people should be like nuns/monks and never touch each other - I'm saying they should not be having penetrative vaginal sex. There are plenty of other things they could do.

Because their rational should kick in and they should realize that the consequences of their 'outlet' is the creation of an innocent human being who will be born into poverty and as such they should search for another outlet. Some people find joyriding a great outlet but it doesn't mean that it's a rational thing to do. Some people find murdering a great outlet but that doesn't mean they should do it.

Well, I'd agree with that - they're definitely selfish.

Not saying it should happen since I'm sure there's a lot more think about but my first thought to that is - if governments want to deport them then 1.why not deport the parents and put the babies into adoption systems so they can at least have a chance at life in a developed country? They'd have access to healthcare/education/jobs/a future and basically not have to pay for their parents irresponsibility. 2. More future tax payers if they're raised right and educated properly.

Reading the news today I saw quite a few articles about the migrants in Greece


who have travelled from places such as Syria in order find a better life. A lot of them are heading to Greece and then on to wealthier European countries.

I'm sure we all have differing opinions about that matter in general but that's not what I'm focusing on here (personally, I feel that they are victims of circumstance and if I were them I'd probably do the same).

Anyway, I've noticed in quite a few pictures across a lot of articles that some of these migrants have young children - in some cases babies who are months old. Now, I'm a woman in my 20s and I live in a relatively wealthy country (UK) but I consciously choose not to have children because I know that at this point in my life I couldn't afford a child and it would be unfair on the child to live in relative poverty. What gets me is that these migrants are coming from poor, often violent, countries and they are having babies. I know some people might say ''they might not be able to afford contraception'' - but that's not good enough, they should abstain if they can't afford kids and have no contraception.

There maybe to instances where a woman has become pregnant against her will and that is a separate issue - we can't tell that from the pictures. But there will be instances where these children have been created with mutual consent and that's what I find incomprehensible.

Obviously, I'd want those children to be given aid and for their parents to be helped but their parents are causing problems that could be avoided and those children are likely to live in poverty for the rest of their lives. It seems crazy to want to put a child through such suffering.

Just to point out, I generally do not care what other people choose to do with their personal lives - I don't care what hair color they have, how they dress, who they want to be in a relationship with (so long as they're of age) or if they want to change their name to 'Mango Ferret Banana Queen' - IDGAF, but when people do things, intentionally or not, that negatively affect the lives of innocent people I find it incomprehensible. These adults are bringing innocent babies into a terrible set of circumstances and abject poverty - I just can't comprehend the rational of that or the level of irresponsibility that could accidentally lead to that.


Controversial topic, I know. I'm interested to hear people's opinions on this because it seems that you're not allowed to express this opinion without people thinking you are heartless. Personally, I think it's heartless to bring a child into poverty.

I totally get your point -I was putting that out there for debate and playing devil's advocate BUT if it did happen and was done by the state it wouldn't be calling "child knapping", just as the US uses the terms "lethal injection"/"death penalty" rather than 'murder'.

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Well there are destitute children all over the world, whether they are the offspring of mgrants or not. If you care about desititute children then why not invite them all over here to use the NHS, GP's surgeries and get benefits? Organise planes to bring them over here, but then again, where are you going to put them all and who is going to pay for houses to be built for them to live in and who is going to pay for hospitals to put them into when they are sick, and what about paying for their food, clothing and schools? Don't you understand that we have A LIMITED NUMBER OF doctors' surgeries and when you need an urgent appointment because you have cancer or a blood disease, will you mind waiting for six months for an appointment or even not getting one at all?
So if you don't mind any of that, fine, invite them all over here, millions of them, to get benefits which tax payers here will have to pay for and don't forget the cost of TEACHING THEM ENGLISH.