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Why is the UK scared of socialism?

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Because people generally don't have a good understanding of what socialism actually entails.

The UK government actually employs various socialist policies such as the NHS, minimum wage, state pension etc. We don't live in a fully capitalist or socialist country. It's a mixture of the two and it would do people well to remember that any time they treat socialism like some kind of boogie man.

Yes, but people are generally happy with the current mixture of capitalist and socialist policies. Anybody who was alive and conscious during the Cold War understands full well what proper socialism entails. Even so-called socialists don't want socialism when it means they're on the losing end: a very amusing article by Dan Hodges (I think that's the name anyway) comes to mind in which he opposed the mansion tax based on the noble principle of 'tax should be higher for everybody but me.'

Reply 41

StretfordEnd

Original post by Bustamove

I'm fine with a few aspects of socialism, but when a country completely adopts socialist policies like communism, then I'm leaving straight up

Communism isn't a 'socialist policy', it's an independent political philosophy.

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Reply 42

looseseal

Original post by StretfordEnd

Communism isn't a 'socialist policy', it's an independent political philosophy.

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Way too many people fail to realise this simple fact.

Reply 43

illegaltobepoor

Original post by Hydeman

I'm not a Tory though. ._________________.

Oh Ukipper?

Reply 44

Betelgeuse-

Original post by illegaltobepoor

You don't have to destroy Capitalism in order for a Socialist solution to work. Examples of Socialism are wealth distribution via the NHS, Education and Welfare system which we have in this country.

Jeremy Corbyn is well aware of this. He understands that a Socialist society will never work in a world that is Capitalist in its very nature. This is why he wants to utilize the Capitalist means of money manipulation (QE) to bring Britain into the 21st century.

You may doubt me but look at China. The place use to be a third world country but Mao that Communist murdering lunatic used the Capitalists greed and spending power to his own advantage. The benefit we have with Corbyn is that hes not going to go mad-max and slaughter a load of civilians to get what he wants. At best he might break the law and cease some assets of the 1% but that is hardly threatening to run over a Civilian with a Tank lol.

You think that printing more money is manipulation? Alls it does is devalue your currency and cause inflation. See zimbabwe. £5 mars bars for everyone!

Reply 45

illegaltobepoor

Original post by Betelgeuse-

You think that printing more money is manipulation? Alls it does is devalue your currency and cause inflation. See zimbabwe. £5 mars bars for everyone!

Yet we did it shortly after 2008 to the sum of 375 billion injected into the financial markets for the benefit of the richest 10% of Brits.

You forgot about this didn't you.

http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/publications/Documents/quarterlybulletin/qb110301.pdf

Yet when its ordinary people getting something for nothing you throw a wobbly lol.

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 46

Betelgeuse-

Original post by illegaltobepoor

Yet we did it shortly after 2008 to the sum of 375 billion injected into the financial markets for the benefit of the richest 10% of Brits.

You forgot about this didn't you.

No, it can be used in certain times but printing money is not some magical cure which it sounds like you think it is

Reply 47

troubadour.

Original post by illegaltobepoor

Oh Ukipper?

Voted for them but no, not a UKIP fan either. I have no party affiliation so maybe I can just be Hydeman rather than 'Tory' or 'Ukipper', if that's okay. :tongue:

Reply 48

illegaltobepoor

Original post by Betelgeuse-

No, it can be used in certain times but printing money is not some magical cure which it sounds like you think it is

I am a regular listener of Peter Schiff. Don't put words into my mouth and then claim I believe in such things.

What your going to see is QE money put into state assets which are not for sale! This means 80% of the funds for building houses will not enter the real economy.

It is likely that British workers will be picked rather than giving huge contracts to foreign firms. Working class Brits tend to spend 99% of income earned so that money will go straight into the economy. This excess spending won't have time to wander and cause inflation because it will be spent on necessities. Due to there being a rise in the liquidity of the lower classes in metro areas property prices may go higher but im sure Corbyn will put in rent caps.

There is a danger of inflation here but there will be a lot of mitigation from inflation when a huge string of nationalization occurs along with money leaving the real economy and put into council house funding. There is then the energy firms which take the next part of the pie and again the money will be sucked back into the Corbyn national bank.

The danger is using QE money for welfare and wars. Basically don't do what Obama and Bush did.

Your only see inflation if the rest of the world thinks we are a fake economy and then every1 will dump sterling as a safe haven.

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 49

illegaltobepoor

Original post by Hydeman

Voted for them but no, not a UKIP fan either. I have no party affiliation so maybe I can just be Hydeman rather than 'Tory' or 'Ukipper', if that's okay. :tongue:

Hmm voted for UKIP? That means your a Libertarian yes?

Reply 50

username1148663

Generally as it hasn't worked out well where it has been tried.

People also fear change.

As a side note Americans would most likely think most European countries have socialism already

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Reply 51

Mr JB

The entire spectrum is complete nonsense, is a mechanism for control and is designed to make idiots believe they actually have a say in what goes on in the world. The reality is, its just another proponent of the illusion of democracy, encourages people to get involved and vote for parties that quite frankly couldn't give a damn about us and are only interested in serving themselves and the elites in which they associate with. Capitalism in today's UK isn't far from Communism itself. The only difference is that rather than having a public sector elite influence policy we now have a political elite and private sector elite who do the same thing, which creates another layer of protection, adds to the confusion and makes idiots believe that everything is great.

Reply 52

Smithy-Smiths

Original post by slade p

Socialism is a wrecking ball just like atheism and feminism.

Don't you just hate it when people weaken good natured debates with ignorant comments like this? Yeah same...

Reply 53

The_Mighty_Bush

Original post by Smithy-Smiths

Don't you just hate it when people weaken good natured debates with ignorant comments like this? Yeah same...

He's completely correct. Best way to destroy a civilisation is to spread socialist, feminist and atheist propaganda.

Reply 54

NoTreason

Original post by Hydeman

Have you considered the possibility that most people actually do know what socialism is and reject its principles because they don't like them? I love how there's basically no way to convince socialists that their ideas are unwelcome to most of the electorate. If the electorate agreed with you, I'd bet good money that you would instantly proclaim the wisdom of the electorate unparalleled, despite slagging off the same people for being brainwashed by 'capitalist propaganda' when they don't agree with you.

That is actually a good point. But socialism and marxism is supported by some intellectuals, mostly those involved in the social sciences. So, perhaps, it's a case that although people may disagree with socialism, they only do so because they are stupid.

Reply 55

troubadour.

Original post by NoTreason

So is capitalism. People may not be capable of cutting political analysis but the basics of socialism don't require you to have a degree in political science (which isn't a science, but that's one for another day). I doubt you could find many people, for instance, who are happy to pay higher income tax or, if they live in a reasonably sized house in London, a wealth tax that punishes them for living in an expensive part of the country.

Sure, there are plenty of people who go around saying, 'I want to pay more tax,' but they quickly follow up with, 'I want everyone to pay more tax.' That is when they cross the line between having an opinion and totalitarianism and, perhaps more relevantly, the majority public opinion and the opinion of champagne socialists who live a life of comfort while demonising other people who'd like to live as comfortably by telling them that they're not compassionate or decent human beings if they don't support statist policies.

That's one thing about intellectuals, particularly wealthy ones: they're happy to have an equal healthcare system where you have to stand in a two- or three-year long queue but only because they can afford to have private healthcare. It's very easy to preach from that sort of position. In that respect, at least, the public's opinion counts for a little bit more than the opinion of self-proclaimed intellectuals (like I said, political science isn't a science).

(edited 8 years ago)

We're not though..

Because of this:

Because protestant nations in particular seem to value property rights.

Also because Thatcher won the argument regarding whether the market better allocates resources than government. In the 1970's the state had its hands in around 90 firms apparently.. the number that people want in public ownership is around 5.