Jeremy Corbyn Elected!

Attracting a million or so Green, 1.4 million SNP and a few hundred thousand plaid voters does not account for the millions in UKIP and conservatives and the millions who will defect to them. The left do not get it, England is predominately right wing, always has been and always will be.

No, England is generally centrist, the right has bombed as much as the left in the past.

Original post by Gears265

Please explain to me, if the left is so popular why did UKIP get more votes than the Greens, SNP and plaid put TOGETHER? Haha seriously if anything people are moving right, immigration and the EU are top of people's concerns. Get with the program.

UKIP are actually reasonably left wing - don't confuse being left wing with being liberal; the left-right split is economics, and UKIP are roughly centre left on that. The EU and immigration debates are quite hotly contested, which is where an anti-EU labour leader (like Corbyn) may well become an advantage for labour.

Reply 41

Bill_Gates

21

Love him!

power to the masses brah

Reply 42

Imperion

17

Original post by ✈ |✡||✡|

Oy gevalt!

Cool username bro

Original post by saeed97

We need a Putin not a Corbyn to make Britain great again.

Reply 43

the bear

20

Original post by Gears265

Labour is finished hahaha, they have completely abandoned the centre and right of politics, let the left burn with him in 2020

Word.

Labor is consigned to the Corbin of history

:rofl:

Reply 44

username878267

15

Why is Jeremy always preceded by 'left wing Corbyn ' in the media yet Cameron is never preceded by 'right wing' Cameron.

The media bias is astonishing.

Original post by Stiff Little Fingers

UKIP are actually reasonably left wing - don't confuse being left wing with being liberal; the left-right split is economics, and UKIP are roughly centre left on that. The EU and immigration debates are quite hotly contested, which is where an anti-EU labour leader (like Corbyn) may well become an advantage for labour.

As Oswald Mosley found when he left the Labour Party, the similarity of particular policies; even attitudes like hostility to high finance etc doesn't attract sufficient votes.

Reply 47

nulli tertius

21

Original post by Bornblue

Why is Jeremy always preceded by 'left wing Corbyn ' in the media yet Cameron is never preceded by 'right wing' Cameron.

The media bias is astonishing.

The Centre for Policy Studies is always a right wing think tank. The Institute for Public Policy Research is always an independent think tank.

There are a lot of different biases in the media.

Reply 48

Stiff Little Fingers

21

Original post by nulli tertius

As Oswald Mosley found when he left the Labour Party, the similarity of particular policies; even attitudes like hostility to high finance etc doesn't attract sufficient votes.

Well yes, but UKIP made considerable gains off Labour because of the anti-EU sentiments, an anti-EU labour leader has the potential to reverse those gains.

Reply 49

Gears265

5

Original post by Stiff Little Fingers

No, England is generally centrist, the right has bombed as much as the left in the past.

UKIP are actually reasonably left wing - don't confuse being left wing with being liberal; the left-right split is economics, and UKIP are roughly centre left on that. The EU and immigration debates are quite hotly contested, which is where an anti-EU labour leader (like Corbyn) may well become an advantage for labour.

Public opinion says otherwise but it depends on the perspective of where central politics really is. The spectrum has blurred lines so we can agree to disagree on that one.

I fail to see how UKIP comply to a left wing brand of politics. At the centre of it the party supports a free market economy and is very much open to privatising sectors of the economy. This is very much different to corbyn's economics. Where you may be making the comparison is the stance on manufacturing and engineering. Here they are similar but the concepts are attributed to socialist ideals not left wing ideals. UKIP is taking a firm position on borrowing and clearing the deficit while Corbyn is very much the opposite- pro mass borrowing and not too bothered by the deficit.

Regarding the EU, I accept the left were originally the anti EU voice on the spectrum back in 75 but the reasons of being opposed to the EU establishment differ very much between the left and right. The right want control of our borders, a movement away from a federal EU, a greater decentralisation of powers to national governments ect.

The left focus more on the social and economic inequality, the austerity across the EU and foreign affairs. Simply look at the difference between the left and UKIP in regards to the migrant crisis.

But I am anti-EU through and through so I welcome the fact Corbyn will open the left to the argument. Instead I will always side with UKIP on the matter but Corbyn raises issues on the EU I too am concerned about, especially the tax havens like that of Junker's precious Luxembourg which have flourished in the EU.

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 50

demx9

3

If he wasn't so pro immigration it would be great

Reply 51

demx9

3

Original post by Stiff Little Fingers

UKIP are actually reasonably left wing.

No, they are the only Libertarian party, how is that left wing?

Reply 52

arfah

17

Original post by Law-Hopeful

Putin? Which of his domestic policies are you a fan of? His anti-LGBT "propaganda" law? The burning of “290 tons of fresh produce and 29 tons of livestock products" imported from the EU?

Pray tell.

Talking to non mahrams is haram right. I'm not even going to bother replying to you.

Reply 53

Illiberal Liberal

2

Original post by arfah

Talking to non mahrams is haram right. I'm not even going to bother replying to you.

Not according to me :dontknow:

There's no shame in not being able to justify Putin being your favourite world-leader. :h:

Reply 54

nulli tertius

21

Original post by Stiff Little Fingers

Well yes, but UKIP made considerable gains off Labour because of the anti-EU sentiments, an anti-EU labour leader has the potential to reverse those gains.

I don't think there are any floating voters there.

I don't think UKIP gained any anti-EU, pro-immigration voters at the last election. They are still safe inside the Conservative and Labour parties. Anyone who is anti-EU, anti-immigration and economically left wing or anti-elite isn't going to Corbyn.

Reply 55

Stiff Little Fingers

21

Original post by demx9

No, they are the only Libertarian party, how is that left wing?

Not really - the new statesman did a pretty good breakdown of their economic policies not too long ago: http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2014/04/how-ukip-turning-left-economy

UKIP haven't really been libertarians for a while now.

Original post by nulli tertius

I don't think there are any floating voters there.

I don't think UKIP gained any anti-EU, pro-immigration voters at the last election. They are still safe inside the Conservative and Labour parties. Anyone who is anti-EU, anti-immigration and economically left wing or anti-elite isn't going to Corbyn.

UKIP saw massive gains last election, predominately from labour - a big part of that will be the eu/immigration debate. They won't take back on immigration with corbyn, but the ones who voted UKIP because they're opposed to the crony-ism of the EU may start floating back.

Reply 56

Foreverlost--

5

He attended 'university of North London" now-known as the London metropolitan university! Says a lot.. Not al politicians are Oxbridge privately educated. Maybe quite representative of the Labour Party. Good on him!!

Reply 57

demx9

3

Original post by Stiff Little Fingers

UKIP haven't really been libertarians for a while now.

Sure, but it's just populism, they still are right wing at heart .. It would be awesome to have a Front National tho

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 58

nulli tertius

21

Original post by Stiff Little Fingers

UKIP saw massive gains last election, predominately from labour - a big part of that will be the eu/immigration debate. They won't take back on immigration with corbyn, but the ones who voted UKIP because they're opposed to the crony-ism of the EU may start floating back.

As I say, I don't think the anti-EU pro immigration voters switched to UKIP.

Reply 59

SaucissonSecCy

16

Original post by Gears265

Labour is finished hahaha, they have completely abandoned the centre and right of politics, let the left burn with him in 2020

Funny, Brown was centrist and he was derided as completely useless. Surely most of these perecptions comes downto charisma and perceived authority more than actual policies, shallow thought hat is, contempitble though it is. Corbyn is no worse for them as a follow up to Blair than Brown and Miliband. And in fact he's better. Better they have the courage of their convictions and represent a truly different vision than the Tories...the only alternative is to virutally replicate Tory policy and try and find a Blair lite figure who is an also ran in terms of charisma and statesmanship--Kendall, Cooper, Burnham etc. You're entirely wrong in your analysis-I accept Blair's winning qualiites, but that was because of his charisma, and how he convinced on his policies, not their objective worth. It took exceptional charisma, exceptional media manipulation and policies that were extremely favourable for many Tory voters. Politics and circumstances change, like in geopolitics, and the Blairite's are entirely wrong to think we need more of the same. They are like an analogy of the people who still base theit judgement on how England should be and how it shouldn't change on the fact we ran the empire once--things have changed and we need to adapt-same principle.I wish they would just fade away to be honest.

Jeremy Corbyn Elected!

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