This discussion is now closed.
Check out other Related discussions
My favourite pro veganism quotation!
Scroll to see replies
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
We are much more like bonobos.
In fact the current thought in anthropology is that humans would not be where we are today if we had been more like chimpanzees than bonobos. Especially with regards to the differences between gender.
Hate to say but the bonobo similarities also mess up your view of feminism and the role of females in humans from a genetic standpoint
So what?
You can find what is essential rape as a mating strategy in loads of sexual species. Is rape now ok because of that? I mean after all, if you rape and get a woman pregnant you have passed on your genes. Which is all evolution is about.
In fact the current thought in anthropology is that humans would not be where we are today if we had been more like chimpanzees than bonobos. Especially with regards to the differences between gender.
Hate to say but the bonobo similarities also mess up your view of feminism and the role of females in humans from a genetic standpoint
So what?
You can find what is essential rape as a mating strategy in loads of sexual species. Is rape now ok because of that? I mean after all, if you rape and get a woman pregnant you have passed on your genes. Which is all evolution is about.
At the purest biological level, yes.
Original post by Jammy Duel
At the purest biological level, yes.
So, morally speaking is rape now ok?
If eating meat is morally acceptable for the same reasons why is rape not ok?
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
So, morally speaking is rape now ok?
If eating meat is morally acceptable for the same reasons why is rape not ok?
If eating meat is morally acceptable for the same reasons why is rape not ok?
Wait, so we have major protein sources without touching animals? I come back to the question, when did we become herbivores?
Why is rape not? Because the common set of morals declares otherwise.
Why is this thread in the chat forum?
Original post by Jammy Duel
Wait, so we have major protein sources without touching animals? I come back to the question, when did we become herbivores?
Why is rape not? Because the common set of morals declares otherwise.
Why is rape not? Because the common set of morals declares otherwise.
You are missing the point.
Both eating meat and rape are fine from a "biological" stand point. Male chimpanzees violently assault females.
Yet we deem rape as wrong but not eating meat. There is no reason why we have to respect female humans like we do from a "biological" stand point. Basically the argument that because certain behaviors are "natural" they are justified doesn't cut the mustard when so much of what we do contradicts "nature".
I can come up with lots of "biological" arguments as to why we don't accept rape or why some people are vegetarians but that also beside the point.
and yes, we also have major protein resources without touching animals...
Which again misses another point. The only thing that matters from "biological" point fo view is passing on genes. As long as you can live to say 50 years old that is enough to have offspring and rear them and maybe help your offspring have offspring of their own. So any kind of deficiency from a veggie diet doesn't really matter. Especially when you consider how bad eating too much meat if for us. It;s been in the news how bad eating too much red meat is for us in the long term and cancer. Eating too much meat (which most meat eaters do do) is probbaly just as bad for you as eating to little. But the important bit is that it is an old age disease so it doesn't matter "biologically" speaking. You still live long enough to have kids and pass o your genes. WHICH IS ALL THAT MATTERS BIOLOGICAL.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
Well yeah, that is where anarchist anthropologists come from. It was the advent of agriculture that we became such a hierarchical species, when before that we were relative egalitarian. Their view is that most of these hierarchies is a result of social conditioning and a form of historical materialism rather than genetic changes and can thus be changed. Which is the viewpoint I side with, although that is based on personal intuition rather than rigid science.
Do you consider the emergence of agriculture actively unnatural, in the sense of a conscious imposition intended to entrench ruling elites, or do you consider it natural, i.e. something that humans pretty much came up with because that was the path of least resistance at a particular time and place? Because it seems like you mean the first one when you talk about social conditioning.
The view that resonates with me is that we met with various ecological pressures when we migrated out of Africa. Demographics, geography, climate change, doesn't really matter, the important thing is that eventually we came across fertile land around major river valleys where it was marginally more sensible to stick around than to keep moving.
From there on it is a simple fact of life that there were competitive advantages to civilisation, not least militarily, we had to learn to defend our patch, but mainly in terms of population density and how easily we could be turned to one aligned purpose. Apparently agricultural societies were poorer nourished than hunter-gatherers, similar I suppose to how state finances are always in the red and based on fake money today, but the numbers allowed for a step change in things like knowledge transfer which is just the same today as well.
Original post by daydreamer4life
My favourite vegan quote is Theodor W. Adorno“Auschwitz begins wherever someone looks at a slaughterhouse and thinks: they're only animals."Adorno who said it was a jew himself!
I often quote this one, i didn't realise it was from Shaw
“Animals are my friends...and I don't eat my friends.”
― George Bernard Shawand
“Until he extends the circle of his compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace.”
― Albert Schweitzer
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
You are missing the point.
Both eating meat and rape are fine from a "biological" stand point. Male chimpanzees violently assault females.
Yet we deem rape as wrong but not eating meat. There is no reason why we have to respect female humans like we do from a "biological" stand point. Basically the argument that because certain behaviors are "natural" they are justified doesn't cut the mustard when so much of what we do contradicts "nature".
I can come up with lots of "biological" arguments as to why we don't accept rape or why some people are vegetarians but that also beside the point.
and yes, we also have major protein resources without touching animals....
Both eating meat and rape are fine from a "biological" stand point. Male chimpanzees violently assault females.
Yet we deem rape as wrong but not eating meat. There is no reason why we have to respect female humans like we do from a "biological" stand point. Basically the argument that because certain behaviors are "natural" they are justified doesn't cut the mustard when so much of what we do contradicts "nature".
I can come up with lots of "biological" arguments as to why we don't accept rape or why some people are vegetarians but that also beside the point.
and yes, we also have major protein resources without touching animals....
Well the reason we think rape is wrong is because we have theory of mind: we can empathise with the woman being raped because we know she is a sentient being the same as us. That is the reason why we "have to respect female humans like we do".
However, we see most animals as unable to comprehend that death is in their future, essentially non-sentient at least with respect to that. Of course an animal will feel fear when it is being killed (whether slaughtered humanely or torn apart by a predator), but I'm not sure the animal knows what is going on in quite the same sense we do. Certainly animals, especially the animals we farm, are not smart enough to understand what is going on on a farm systemically and that their and their friends' ultimate fate is to be carted off to their deaths.
We do routinely acknowledge that other animals have some form of higher consciousness when we condemn whaling, bushmeat, and ivory, and when we apply higher ethical standards to animal testing on chimps, octopuses, dolphins etc. However we do not speak of any of those animals "raping" or "murdering" each other because we assume they are not quite smart enough to have theory of mind, so those things are not immoral acts.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by scrotgrot
Well the reason we think rape is wrong is because we have theory of mind: we can empathise with the woman being raped because we know she is a sentient being the same as us. That is the reason why we "have to respect female humans like we do".
However, we see most animals as unable to comprehend that death is in their future, essentially non-sentient at least with respect to that. Of course an animal will feel fear when it is being killed (whether slaughtered humanely or torn apart by a predator), but I'm not sure the animal knows what is going on in quite the same sense we do. Certainly animals, especially the animals we farm, are not smart enough to understand what is going on on a farm systemically and that their and their friends' ultimate fate is to be carted off to their deaths.
We do routinely acknowledge that other animals have some form of higher consciousness when we condemn whaling, bushmeat, and ivory, and when we apply higher ethical standards to animal testing on chimps, octopuses, dolphins etc. However we do not speak of any of those animals "raping" or "murdering" each other because we assume they are not quite smart enough to have theory of mind, so those things are not immoral acts.
However, we see most animals as unable to comprehend that death is in their future, essentially non-sentient at least with respect to that. Of course an animal will feel fear when it is being killed (whether slaughtered humanely or torn apart by a predator), but I'm not sure the animal knows what is going on in quite the same sense we do. Certainly animals, especially the animals we farm, are not smart enough to understand what is going on on a farm systemically and that their and their friends' ultimate fate is to be carted off to their deaths.
We do routinely acknowledge that other animals have some form of higher consciousness when we condemn whaling, bushmeat, and ivory, and when we apply higher ethical standards to animal testing on chimps, octopuses, dolphins etc. However we do not speak of any of those animals "raping" or "murdering" each other because we assume they are not quite smart enough to have theory of mind, so those things are not immoral acts.
Actually pigs display object permanence, something not even young children do.
Many scientists believe that animals we frequently farm do, in fact, experience consciousness.
The question is not whether animals can reason, nor whether they understand what is happening to them. The question is can they suffer. The answer to that is yes. Paraphrased from someone.
There is a theory called the meat paradox. How does one designate one animal as food, but the other as family?
As a lifelong vegetarian, I can't answer this question.
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by Katty3
Actually pigs display object permanence, something not even young children do.
Many scientists believe that animals we frequently farm do, in fact, experience consciousness.
The question is not whether animals can reason, nor whether they understand what is happening to them. The question is can they suffer. The answer to that is yes. Paraphrased from someone.
There is a theory called the meat paradox. How does one designate one animal as food, but the other as family?
As a lifelong vegetarian, I can't answer this question.
Posted from TSR Mobile
Many scientists believe that animals we frequently farm do, in fact, experience consciousness.
The question is not whether animals can reason, nor whether they understand what is happening to them. The question is can they suffer. The answer to that is yes. Paraphrased from someone.
There is a theory called the meat paradox. How does one designate one animal as food, but the other as family?
As a lifelong vegetarian, I can't answer this question.
Posted from TSR Mobile
I am perturbed by the way pigs seem to be farmed, in small pens. It seems inhumane, is there a better way to do it or what are the reasons for it?
I absolutely do not agree about the suffering thing. Obviously there is real physical suffering, such as confinement in a small cage, or animals bred so hard for yield that they have health problems, or I can't imagine it's much fun having your tits squeezed by a milking machine.
And I think it's obvious animals are going to feel fear and suffering at the moment of their slaughter - although here, note that they'd feel the same dying in the wild too, likely worse.
But I absolutely do not agree that day-to-day life on the farm, aside from the physical suffering I mentioned above, entails suffering for animals. Surely the sort of suffering slavery/lack of freedom entails is that you know your life is not really yours but in the palm of someone else's hand: they choose your death date and where you go etc. Animals don't understand that and thus they do not suffer in the same manner as human slaves.
The fact that farm animals live longer with access to food, sex and medicine would seem to be an especially good trade-off if you don't understand and suffer from the state of being unfree.
That suffering does require reason and animals don't have it.
Original post by JD1lla
£20 - 30 for TWO people?! I spend £50 a week on just ME, at least £20 on meat for the week. One year of Vit D3 supply is like £10?
Well you clearly are terrible with your money
More like 30 pills for a tenner!? If that...
I currently have a years supply courtesy of the NHS but the Dr said its important I top it up with diet. You
Eh? Either you're trying to completely misrepresentate my argument or you're just not bothering to read it - a normal biological function cannot be compared to a social framework.
The first part "No more than in as much as food forming part of social events" makes no sense. What are you trying to say here? No more than what?
So all you've got left is nitpicking grammar? It's quite clear, eating meat is no more a social occasion than eating in general.
It is unless you supplement your diet with things like vitamin D3.
Because I haven't seen conclusive evidence that bivalves are incapable of pain.
Have you seen conclusive evidence that plants are incapable of pain? Ultimately its not about doing the least harm possible since that necessitates suicide, it's not even about reducing suffering in diet as much as possible since that would involve adopting freeganism, a bivalve or insect based diet or primitivist hunter-gatherer behaviour, so we can conclude that it just needs to reduce harm by wn amount, so veganism has no logical opposition to eating just a low meat diet or one with free-range and local animals rather than factory farmed, unless we go down the rights route, in which case I'll have to point out again that animals die for anyone to survive - we kill hundreds of thousands of insects and small herbivores to maintain crops for vegan diets, the only difference is that the cow ends up on my plate while the mouse doesn't end up on yours. So, why is it acceptable to kill animals provided you don't eat them?
I'm going to restate this question in bold in the hope you'll bother to answer it. I don't even care about the rest of my points, this is the clincher, so concentrate on answer it alone if that's easier for you to do:
What quality do humans have that make them moral subjects that animals lack?
Thought I was quite clear that it's irrelevant since morals don't come into predator-prey relationships but nevermind.
Posted from TSR Mobile
The first part "No more than in as much as food forming part of social events" makes no sense. What are you trying to say here? No more than what?
So all you've got left is nitpicking grammar? It's quite clear, eating meat is no more a social occasion than eating in general.
So eating is a matter of survival, yes, but eating meat is not.
It is unless you supplement your diet with things like vitamin D3.
Because I haven't seen conclusive evidence that bivalves are incapable of pain.
Have you seen conclusive evidence that plants are incapable of pain? Ultimately its not about doing the least harm possible since that necessitates suicide, it's not even about reducing suffering in diet as much as possible since that would involve adopting freeganism, a bivalve or insect based diet or primitivist hunter-gatherer behaviour, so we can conclude that it just needs to reduce harm by wn amount, so veganism has no logical opposition to eating just a low meat diet or one with free-range and local animals rather than factory farmed, unless we go down the rights route, in which case I'll have to point out again that animals die for anyone to survive - we kill hundreds of thousands of insects and small herbivores to maintain crops for vegan diets, the only difference is that the cow ends up on my plate while the mouse doesn't end up on yours. So, why is it acceptable to kill animals provided you don't eat them?
I'm going to restate this question in bold in the hope you'll bother to answer it. I don't even care about the rest of my points, this is the clincher, so concentrate on answer it alone if that's easier for you to do:
What quality do humans have that make them moral subjects that animals lack?
Thought I was quite clear that it's irrelevant since morals don't come into predator-prey relationships but nevermind.
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by NathanDYEL
I would........
Same, I don't live near a slaughterhouse anyway
It's funny you say that because you've just shown you fall into one of the categories I mentioned: ignorance is bliss.
There is more you can do, you can research it further and ensure that you cut things out when you discover they contain animal products.
Posted from TSR Mobile
Good morning. 
First of all, what is a moral subject? If you're asking why we should only take care of humans and not animals, that's not what I'm trying to say here. I recognise that animals are alive, with thoughts and feelings, but I don't want to starve. I would never harm an animal for any other reason; that would be cruel.(My cat has a different approach; he'll kill a mouse and he won't even eat it... That's just mean).
I don't understand the whole description/perscription thing...
Those "brown people" are humans, hence part of our species. They're the same as us in every way except the colour of their skin, which isn't a good reason to judge someone. To do so would be racist.
I don't fully understand what a moral agent is... My morality is based on a combination of what occurs in nature, experiences, human society, justice, facts, logic, and numerous other things, including - dare I say it - compassion.
Also, what does it mean to straw man someone? I'm fairly new to this site (you've probably noticed lol) and I keep seeing that term being tossed around. If you could give me the definition, I'd be very grateful.
Do I need to eat animal products? I would say that I do. They make up a substantial part of my diet, especially milk and cheese, and I don't eat much to begin with. The only meat I like to eat is fish, the only vegetables are carrot, cucumber, sweetcorn, peppers, and celery, and as far as fruit goes, strawberry, banana, and melon are my main three... I want to try more but I'm a very picky eater; it's a miracle I'm still going, to be honest. I think it's mainly because of the carbohydrates, and recently my weight has dropped which makes it difficult to buy clothes.
I've started exercising and lifting weights too, so my friends are telling me that I need to eat more or kiss goodbye to being strong.
My doctor told me to eat eggs more often because they contained something I needed, though I can't remember what. I tried to do as he said but I don't like the texture of eggs very much, plus they're basically chicken periods.
My family are hard to live with when it comes to meat; they like everything, and when I complain, I cause tension. Last night they were having pork and I managed to pull some strings and get myself haddock instead. Sometimes that doesn't happen; I'm given what they're having and I end up hardly touching it.They also eat takeaway, which I wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole.We had quorn mince/chicken once, but I was the only one who liked it and we haven't had it since.
I don't want to get caught up in a world of supplements; I'm already taking multivitamin tablets and I'm deficient in vitamin D. I don't want to live on pills for the rest of my life; I want to taste my food.
So do I need to eat animal products? Yes, because otherwise I'd become dangerously ill at the very least, and I don't want to lose anymore weight.
If I had to choose between sacrificing my own health and not saving a squid, I would pick the latter.
If I absolutely had to be killed to feed someone, I'd want something quick and painless. Maybe an injection? Then I can go peacefully in my sleep. If farms use a more brutal method, then that is what we should be tackling. I'm not sure how we'd solve that problem regarding fishing nets but we could come up with something.
Would I have fear? Yes, provided I knew what was going to happen. The same fear that an antelope has whilst it's running from its own predator, except I wouldn't be mauled to death and left for vultures/hyenas. I'd want every part of my body to be used, which is why I'm probably going to donate myself to science after I die.
It's like if a tiger ate my best friend; I'd be devastated and probably fall back into depression. Would I want to kill the tiger? Never. It was simply looking for food in order to survive; I can't judge it for that.
There's another thing I don't understand about veganism/vegetarianism... Plants are animals too, so why do you eat them? Is it because they don't move? They're sentient, aren't they? Even if they're not, they're still alive, so I can't help but wonder what makes them different from a cow. Except that they get eaten by the cow, but you get what I'm saying.
First of all, what is a moral subject? If you're asking why we should only take care of humans and not animals, that's not what I'm trying to say here. I recognise that animals are alive, with thoughts and feelings, but I don't want to starve. I would never harm an animal for any other reason; that would be cruel.(My cat has a different approach; he'll kill a mouse and he won't even eat it... That's just mean).
I don't understand the whole description/perscription thing...
Those "brown people" are humans, hence part of our species. They're the same as us in every way except the colour of their skin, which isn't a good reason to judge someone. To do so would be racist.
I don't fully understand what a moral agent is... My morality is based on a combination of what occurs in nature, experiences, human society, justice, facts, logic, and numerous other things, including - dare I say it - compassion.
Also, what does it mean to straw man someone? I'm fairly new to this site (you've probably noticed lol) and I keep seeing that term being tossed around. If you could give me the definition, I'd be very grateful.
Do I need to eat animal products? I would say that I do. They make up a substantial part of my diet, especially milk and cheese, and I don't eat much to begin with. The only meat I like to eat is fish, the only vegetables are carrot, cucumber, sweetcorn, peppers, and celery, and as far as fruit goes, strawberry, banana, and melon are my main three... I want to try more but I'm a very picky eater; it's a miracle I'm still going, to be honest. I think it's mainly because of the carbohydrates, and recently my weight has dropped which makes it difficult to buy clothes.
I've started exercising and lifting weights too, so my friends are telling me that I need to eat more or kiss goodbye to being strong.
My doctor told me to eat eggs more often because they contained something I needed, though I can't remember what. I tried to do as he said but I don't like the texture of eggs very much, plus they're basically chicken periods.
My family are hard to live with when it comes to meat; they like everything, and when I complain, I cause tension. Last night they were having pork and I managed to pull some strings and get myself haddock instead. Sometimes that doesn't happen; I'm given what they're having and I end up hardly touching it.They also eat takeaway, which I wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole.We had quorn mince/chicken once, but I was the only one who liked it and we haven't had it since.
I don't want to get caught up in a world of supplements; I'm already taking multivitamin tablets and I'm deficient in vitamin D. I don't want to live on pills for the rest of my life; I want to taste my food.
So do I need to eat animal products? Yes, because otherwise I'd become dangerously ill at the very least, and I don't want to lose anymore weight.
If I had to choose between sacrificing my own health and not saving a squid, I would pick the latter.
If I absolutely had to be killed to feed someone, I'd want something quick and painless. Maybe an injection? Then I can go peacefully in my sleep. If farms use a more brutal method, then that is what we should be tackling. I'm not sure how we'd solve that problem regarding fishing nets but we could come up with something.
Would I have fear? Yes, provided I knew what was going to happen. The same fear that an antelope has whilst it's running from its own predator, except I wouldn't be mauled to death and left for vultures/hyenas. I'd want every part of my body to be used, which is why I'm probably going to donate myself to science after I die.
It's like if a tiger ate my best friend; I'd be devastated and probably fall back into depression. Would I want to kill the tiger? Never. It was simply looking for food in order to survive; I can't judge it for that.
There's another thing I don't understand about veganism/vegetarianism... Plants are animals too, so why do you eat them? Is it because they don't move? They're sentient, aren't they? Even if they're not, they're still alive, so I can't help but wonder what makes them different from a cow. Except that they get eaten by the cow, but you get what I'm saying.
Original post by Louisb19
Work is slavery? You have every right to go live in the forest if you like, then you won't have to work!
If we stopped working the entire world would collapse since no one in the western world would have food, shelter or water. On the other hand, if we stopped killing animals:
- C02 emissions decrease
- 6 MILLION less animals die per minute
- 45% of the land on earth doesn't have to be used for the meat industry
- The amount of food we have available would increase 5 fold
- The human race could live with the peace of mind that we don't enslave and torture everything that we find.
No argument you can make apart from 'It tastes good!' is valid in favour of the meat industry, so please stop trying; it's honestly embarrassing.
If we stopped working the entire world would collapse since no one in the western world would have food, shelter or water. On the other hand, if we stopped killing animals:
- C02 emissions decrease
- 6 MILLION less animals die per minute
- 45% of the land on earth doesn't have to be used for the meat industry
- The amount of food we have available would increase 5 fold
- The human race could live with the peace of mind that we don't enslave and torture everything that we find.
No argument you can make apart from 'It tastes good!' is valid in favour of the meat industry, so please stop trying; it's honestly embarrassing.
Well firstly you argued eating meat had nothing to do with human development in an earlier post, which is wrong, it's part of the reason we have such large brains. Also had we not killed animals for we would may well have become prey and we certain wouldn't have carved out such enormous territories for ourselves.
How would the amount of food available go up if you take away a large food group?
No 45% of land on earth wouldn't be used by the meat industry but a large amount of that would be used by the animals we release until their inevitable death due to lack of ability to survive in the wild.
In my opinion saying meat tastes nice is a perfectly valid reason. Killing other animals for food is just part of nature, it's why the strongest survive.
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by BekahMay
True, most people do assume that because our ancestors eat meat we must have to yet decide that other aspects of their lives were wrong
Could i ask why youre vegan rather than vegetarian? I know there is still alit of ethical issies with alot of animal products but say for example free range eggs do you have any issue with them?
Could i ask why youre vegan rather than vegetarian? I know there is still alit of ethical issies with alot of animal products but say for example free range eggs do you have any issue with them?
Even when ethical issues are out the window, health issues are still there. There are many health issues involving the consumption of chicken eggs. (+meat and dairy)
Also "free range" is pretty much bull****, the only way to know you are getting real "free-range" eggs would to go to a small farm that isn't run by an organization and pick up the eggs yourself.
"Many organic and “free-range” farms cram thousands of animals together in sheds or on mud-filled lots to increase profits, just as factory farms do, and the animals often endure the same mutilations—such as debeaking, dehorning, and castration without painkillers—that occur on factory farms."
(edited 8 years ago)
I like meat.
I'm not saying there isn't enough plant food to go around, I'm saying that many of us need both. It's the same with just eating meat; you wouldn't get very far...
What about the rest of my message? My weight loss? My excersise regime and weight lifting? My difficult family? If I didn't eat any animal products, it would probably have a negative impact on my health and home life. I don't want to rely on supplements or spend hours researching different foods; I have other things I need to do.
I'd really like to keep talking with you but I might have to stop if the other guy/girl logs on; it's hard to keep track of two conversations. Lol
What about the rest of my message? My weight loss? My excersise regime and weight lifting? My difficult family? If I didn't eat any animal products, it would probably have a negative impact on my health and home life. I don't want to rely on supplements or spend hours researching different foods; I have other things I need to do.
I'd really like to keep talking with you but I might have to stop if the other guy/girl logs on; it's hard to keep track of two conversations. Lol
Haha! I don't like chips or potato; I'm more of a rice/spaghetti person, to be honest. Pasta is nice too, especially the tubes, and yes, the shape does impact the taste (everyone thinks I'm crazy when I tell them that). I'm not entirely sure what a balanced vegan diet is, but I don't want it to go against what my doctors have been telling me... All my life I've been taught that a balanced diet is having the right amount of fruit/veg, meat, sugar, and carbohydrates, and that focusing on one group isn't healthy.
I love to eat peanuts; I can easily go through a bag of them in one sitting, and I've never had tofu so I don't know what that's like... My parents say it's disgusting but then again, they would say that.
The fruit and vegetable part will be difficult; pears have a grainy texture for me and orange segments have those weird skins. Pineapple is nice but it's odd and stringy. Would it matter if I lived off smoothies? That removes the texture problem and I could probably fit a lot more in. I guess I could make vegetable smoothies too but that doesn't sound very appealing, especially when I don't like the taste of broccoli or beans or spinach or anything like that.
I don't know if juice contains animal products but either way, I haven't touched it in nearly 2 years because of the outrageous amounts of sugar. First I switched to milk, then I realised that probably wasn't doing me any favours either, so now I rely more heavily on water.
I think it's wrong to bully or insult someone just because of their diet; I can't believe your family would do such a thing and you have my sympathy.
My folks wouldn't threaten to kick me out or kill me, but I argue with them enough and my mother complains that she doesn't have enough time or space on the cooker to make different meals. I'm lucky they're okay with fish, otherwise I'd be totally screwed. I don't think I'd get bullied but I've been through enough of that already for different reasons, so I'm not too keen on risking it.
I love chocolate, and sweets and other sugary things, and melted cheese and sushi, so I honestly doubt if I could give all of that up in return for foods like cress and asparagus, which are quite bland.Would I be able to have cake? Or donuts? Oreos? Anything like that? I've cut down on a lot of these but they're still some of my favourite things to eat, especially at parties and the like.
Honestly, the furthest I could go is vegetarian or pescetarian, which I might well do after I get strong, so it wouldn't hinder my journey.Plus, if I ate Quorn then I could have spaghetti bolognese and wraps.
Pull ups are difficult so well done. I'm focusing on crunches, lunges, and lifting at the moment, and I like to think I'm getting better. Are you particularly muscular? Do you find it difficult to walk/run for long periods of time?
And might I add, thank you for being kinder and more civil than a lot of the people on this thread; many of them come across as snarky and entitled.I used to have a vegetarian friend and all she did was belittle me, from my diet to my music to my clothes and even the way I speak. Looking back, I don't think she could even be considered a friend.
I don't like chips or potato; I'm more of a rice/spaghetti person, to be honest. Pasta is nice too, especially the tubes, and yes, the shape does impact the taste (everyone thinks I'm crazy when I tell them that). I'm not entirely sure what a balanced vegan diet is, but I don't want it to go against what my doctors have been telling me... All my life I've been taught that a balanced diet is having the right amount of fruit/veg, meat, sugar, and carbohydrates, and that focusing on one group isn't healthy. I love to eat peanuts; I can easily go through a bag of them in one sitting, and I've never had tofu so I don't know what that's like... My parents say it's disgusting but then again, they would say that.
The fruit and vegetable part will be difficult; pears have a grainy texture for me and orange segments have those weird skins. Pineapple is nice but it's odd and stringy. Would it matter if I lived off smoothies? That removes the texture problem and I could probably fit a lot more in. I guess I could make vegetable smoothies too but that doesn't sound very appealing, especially when I don't like the taste of broccoli or beans or spinach or anything like that.
I don't know if juice contains animal products but either way, I haven't touched it in nearly 2 years because of the outrageous amounts of sugar. First I switched to milk, then I realised that probably wasn't doing me any favours either, so now I rely more heavily on water.
I think it's wrong to bully or insult someone just because of their diet; I can't believe your family would do such a thing and you have my sympathy.
My folks wouldn't threaten to kick me out or kill me, but I argue with them enough and my mother complains that she doesn't have enough time or space on the cooker to make different meals. I'm lucky they're okay with fish, otherwise I'd be totally screwed. I don't think I'd get bullied but I've been through enough of that already for different reasons, so I'm not too keen on risking it.
I love chocolate, and sweets and other sugary things, and melted cheese and sushi, so I honestly doubt if I could give all of that up in return for foods like cress and asparagus, which are quite bland.Would I be able to have cake? Or donuts? Oreos? Anything like that? I've cut down on a lot of these but they're still some of my favourite things to eat, especially at parties and the like.
Honestly, the furthest I could go is vegetarian or pescetarian, which I might well do after I get strong, so it wouldn't hinder my journey.Plus, if I ate Quorn then I could have spaghetti bolognese and wraps.
Pull ups are difficult so well done. I'm focusing on crunches, lunges, and lifting at the moment, and I like to think I'm getting better. Are you particularly muscular? Do you find it difficult to walk/run for long periods of time?
And might I add, thank you for being kinder and more civil than a lot of the people on this thread; many of them come across as snarky and entitled.I used to have a vegetarian friend and all she did was belittle me, from my diet to my music to my clothes and even the way I speak. Looking back, I don't think she could even be considered a friend.
The point if cannibalism has already been mentioned. It's non-sensical to say that eating a human and eating a chicken are the same.
I don't know if you heard but there was a big media storm recently about a man going up against a lion and unsurprisingly the lion lost
Posted from TSR Mobile
I don't know if you heard but there was a big media storm recently about a man going up against a lion and unsurprisingly the lion lost
Posted from TSR Mobile
Latest
Last reply 3 minutes ago
Official: King's College London A100 2024 Entry ApplicantsLast reply 4 minutes ago
PWC fly start degree apprenticeships 2024Last reply 5 minutes ago
Official University College London Applicant Thread for 2024Last reply 9 minutes ago
The Official King's College London Applicants for 2024 Entry ThreadLast reply 10 minutes ago
2024 visa Europe apprenticeshipLast reply 10 minutes ago
any updates on what the guest password is for philosphy cat ?Last reply 10 minutes ago
Official: Queen's University Belfast A100 2024 Entry ApplicantsLast reply 11 minutes ago
Edexcel A-level Salter's-Nuffield Advanced Biology Papers 1, 2, 3 (9BN0 01-03)Last reply 14 minutes ago
Official UCL Offer Holders Thread for 2024 entryLast reply 14 minutes ago
November 2023 Illegal Migration Intake Unit - Intake Response Team - Immigration OffiLast reply 17 minutes ago
MPhil micro and nanotechnology enterprise at CambridgePosted 20 minutes ago
HMRC reviewing the outcome of pre employment checksTrending
Last reply 6 days ago
Why is the political left now censorious and authoritarian??Last reply 2 weeks ago
2024 UK general election speculation and build-up threadLast reply 2 weeks ago
Trump needs a $464m bond in six days. What if he can't get it?Last reply 3 weeks ago
Is University of Birmingham prestigious and respected well enough in UK ?Last reply 1 month ago
TSR opinion poll, Feb 2024: how would you vote in the general election?Last reply 1 month ago
2024 Budget: Chancellor Jeremy Hunt under pressure to cut taxesTrending
Last reply 6 days ago
Why is the political left now censorious and authoritarian??Last reply 2 weeks ago
2024 UK general election speculation and build-up threadLast reply 2 weeks ago
Trump needs a $464m bond in six days. What if he can't get it?Last reply 3 weeks ago
Is University of Birmingham prestigious and respected well enough in UK ?Last reply 1 month ago
TSR opinion poll, Feb 2024: how would you vote in the general election?Last reply 1 month ago
2024 Budget: Chancellor Jeremy Hunt under pressure to cut taxes
