Turkey Condemns Russia for Fighting Islam in Syria, Calls on West to Accept ISIS

It's refreshing to see a Moslem accept that there have been instances of Islamic aggression. Most refuse to countenance it.

That's part of my point. They're a pashtun nationalist group with islamist tendencies, which were mainly used to win support from other sunni self-described islamist countries like saudi arabia in the war against the USSR. I do not like or promote the taliban. They murdered over 10000 of my fellow shia adherents in afghanistan, wiping out entire villages.

Regardless, in the last few centuries of muslim rule in spain, most of the ethnic iberian population had converted to Islam - the inquisition was far more oppressive than any muslim dynasty in Spain's actions towards non muslims. Even the Almohads and Almoravids weren't as bad.

The west funded the Mujahideen to combat the Soviet Union. Pakistan funded the Taliban. Not America.

All forms of superstitious interference in laws is bad, whether Christian or Islamic, as is forced religious conversion (and indoctrination into any religion of those under 18). I condemn both unreservedly.

Legal systems are based upon principles that have mainly come from religion. Religion was, historically, the legalising force of civilisation

Are you trying to tell me that the ancient Greek or pre-Justinian Roman law was derived from religious principles? I don't think so. Common law is derived from pre-Christian times and if there were any religious principles involved they are now entirely lost.

I never said that the USA funded the taliban. Saudi arabia funded both the Taliban and the Mujahideen whereas the USA had only funded and trained the Mujahideen. The taliban came about from a student movement from a madrassah run by a pakistani organisation called Jamiat Ulema-e-Islam. The taliban actually took over -from- the mujahideen government of the Islamic State of Afghanistan through conquest, establishing the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan and forcing the mujahideen to retreat to form the Northern Alliance - I'm aware of all this and that they were separate groups.

Obama quite clearly isn't pro-ISIS/ Islamist.

I wouldn't call the YPG/ YPJ amazing either. In terms of effectiveness or in terms of conformity to the Geneva conventions. They also have committed war crimes.

That isn't to say I don't support the Kurds, or am some sort of ISIS shill. It's an observation, and lets keep some perspective to things - it's a war, crimes will be committed by all sides.

Young woman probably aren't flocking to join because 1) they are poorly equipped 2) they aren't very effective 3) they keep dying 4) they have young families to look after.

Britain should keep out of the conflict completely.

Err, the US is arming the YPG.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/20/turkey-iraqi-kurds-kobani-isis-fighters-us-air-drops-arms

And the US has provided massive air support to them. You want to see that support ended, don't you? Or is it easier to pretend it doesn't exist because then you don't seem so obviously hypocritical by supporting the Kurds enemies while claiming to be left-wing

It could. The EU could admit Turkey to membership, and Merkel has been making positive noises about that recently in trying to deal with the mess she caused by opening Germany's doors to the Syrians and other migrants in an uncontrolled way.

Can you imagine the damage that having Turkey in the EU could do to Europe, with its citizens given rights to live and work?

Sorry, thought you were implying the old 'USA created the Taliban' cliche. So how does that all tie in to western foreign policy then? Specifically that the west shouldn't have intervened in Afghanistan.

The west shouldn't have funded the mujahideen when the soviet union was about to collapse with or without afghanistan. I think that the taliban wouldn't have become what they were if it wasn't for the circumstances they were living in at the time.

Benefit of hindsight though, no?
At the time surely it was a sound strategic decision? Maybe America should have simply taken a greater role in the post-Soviet nation building.

That's true. Although I think it was fairly evident what was about to happen to the USSR... Afghanistan was a desperate grab.

Although I think it was fairly evident what was about to happen to the USSR

What are you, a computer that runs only on logic or a human being with a conscience and beating heart? You miss the point somewhat, I think. About the Kurdish forces fighting ISIS, it is not a question of effectiveness?! They are fighting insurmountable odds. Their bravery should be commended by you. They are the persecuted trying to kill a cruel monster! That is the simple truth of the dynamic. You sound like someone who would prefer to back the winning side because it's winning. Yes, Obama is supporting Isis by playing both sides, however intentional or not. He and his White House administration should be better than they are. I cannot forgive them for funding jihadists. That's shaking hands with the devil and trying to play God to make a particular (possible) outcome. Astoundingly brainless tactic too.

That's part of my point. They're a pashtun nationalist group with islamist tendencies, which were mainly used to win support from other sunni self-described islamist countries like saudi arabia in the war against the USSR. I do not like or promote the taliban. They murdered over 10000 of my fellow shia adherents in afghanistan, wiping out entire villages.

Always laugh when Pashtuns say America should have left the Taliban government alone, it's pretty easy to say keep things the same when it's your ethnic group which dominates the government.

I'm not pashtuun. I have a teeny bit of pashtuun blood that I usually forget about, but that's it. I only think the taliban should have been left there while the northern alliance was funded and aided, with war discouraged so that over time the country might recoalesce as the taliban evolved once their political descendants encountered real educations.