Are religious people mean and less understanding about other people?
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Original post by yasminkattan
Is this trolling, a joke, what? I don't understand most people on this website
I am not trolling. If I was trolling I would never take 10 minutes to find a pic of Genelia as my profile pic
Why you offended? Thats what a lot of scholars. They declare things Haram which they are not. Like Honeymoon or Shampoo
Original post by eoe
I am not trolling. If I was trolling I would never take 10 minutes to find a pic of Genelia as my profile pic
Why you offended? Thats what a lot of scholars. They declare things Haram which they are not. Like Honeymoon or Shampoo
Why you offended? Thats what a lot of scholars. They declare things Haram which they are not. Like Honeymoon or Shampoo
I'm not offended. I've just never heard of any scholar declaring my name as being haram. I do know the types of names that are considered haram, however
Original post by yasminkattan
I wouldn't choose to be a part of a religion that asks me to do those things. I chose Islam because I believe in everything it teaches. So I haven't been brainwashed into anything, and I am most definitely not mindless.
No, I said it's of no use because I know someone who disbelieves would not pay attention to religious arguments. I could give you many and you would bring up the same thing, that it's not a choice and that it's part of a person's biology. But I don't believe this. Science has been wrong countless times
and I have yet to find any reliable scientific evidence that proves homosexuality is not a choice, or genetic.
No, I said it's of no use because I know someone who disbelieves would not pay attention to religious arguments. I could give you many and you would bring up the same thing, that it's not a choice and that it's part of a person's biology. But I don't believe this. Science has been wrong countless times
and I have yet to find any reliable scientific evidence that proves homosexuality is not a choice, or genetic.But what if, for instance, Islam changed and now said, we are to kill all unbelievers? Would you follow such an order?
Taking on a religion doesn't always seem to be a clear and calculated choice, though. It is usually something you grow up in and taught the values of.
Me for instance religion in school assemblies (though this is low level stuff) and families suggestions. Though some families push on their views very strongly, particularly in Islam.
But you are basing your argument on the underlying basis of sexuality on a mere hunch. I doubt you have read any scientific evidence on anything that is stated as fact by your religious ideology.
If you say that about science, then you clearly don't know what science is. Science is the accumulated knowledge of mankind where we have made hypotheses and tests of these hypotheses to see if they are either true or false, with a high margin of accuracy usually needed to deem something true. Such findings must then replicated many times before taken as 'axiom'... and even then, are still sometimes tested to make sure assumptions hold valid and reliable. Though its not to say that the scientific process is perfect (file-drawer problem etc.), it is very reliable.
And besides, it tends to be the case that religion gets practically nothing right.
What do you think gives you your life saving medicine, what it is your nurses and doctors learn to treat you, how you are typing on a wondrously complex input-output processing system to type what you just have into a message to send through the internet accessible to billions of people (if they so wish to see it), and lets you travel at 500mph at 15,000ft to go on holiday as to not spend 3 months getting there by foot.
If you don't assimilate the knowledge of mankind to at least some extent and without bias, then that leaves you pretty incapable of making realistic, fair, and educated/intelligent judgments.
P.S. About religious arguments - what is it that gives them any factual merit? Everyone tends to be open to evaluating them.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by driftawaay
Yes, they are more judgemental, closed minded and conservative.
I believe there was a study that was published very recently that showed that children from religious backgrounds are likely to be more mean/unforgiving than children from non-religious backgrounds? I didn't actually click the link and read it though, but it's an interesting idea
Generalising about a whole group of people based on a single characteristic is a bit stupid, imho
I can only answer for myself (Roman Catholic here :jebus: ) but growing up Catholic and going to Sunday School every week, etc. instilled in me a set of values very early on that otherwise would have no doubt taken a longer time to develop and put into practice. These values make me a better person than I would otherwise have been, because they challenge me to love and accept everyone. They make me challenge my stereotypes, my preconceptions and my prejudices. They take me well outside my comfort zone! I'm not saying that people need to be religious in order to be a good person - far from it! - but in my particular case, following WWJD ("What Would Jesus Do?") and striving to emulate Him in all areas of my life and all my interactions with everyone, has made me a far better person than I would have been otherwise
Generalising about a whole group of people based on a single characteristic is a bit stupid, imho
I can only answer for myself (Roman Catholic here :jebus: ) but growing up Catholic and going to Sunday School every week, etc. instilled in me a set of values very early on that otherwise would have no doubt taken a longer time to develop and put into practice. These values make me a better person than I would otherwise have been, because they challenge me to love and accept everyone. They make me challenge my stereotypes, my preconceptions and my prejudices. They take me well outside my comfort zone! I'm not saying that people need to be religious in order to be a good person - far from it! - but in my particular case, following WWJD ("What Would Jesus Do?") and striving to emulate Him in all areas of my life and all my interactions with everyone, has made me a far better person than I would have been otherwise
Original post by hellodave5
You can make up your own mind, you know.
To what extent does your disdain go of homosexual people?
Babe
To what extent does your disdain go of homosexual people?
Babe
Original post by driftawaay
Yes, they are more judgemental, closed minded and conservative.
u r an idiot
Original post by goldenshades
Stop being offensive. Disagreeing with someone's religious views does not suddenly make it okay for you to make ignorant assumptions of that person and purposely mock them for their belief.
Wasn't a massive troll. Just a slight one.
Those assumptions were actually correct, though. I was really testing those assumptions by trying to elicit a response, and open up dialogue to understand the beliefs that are held.
I am within my rights to mock dangerous or harmful beliefs, generally. If they don't have scope to be harmful, then I leave them alone.
If I ever am mocking, it isn't just 'FU', but is just to try and make that person evaluate the beliefs and to give me an insight into what beliefs are held.
Original post by hellodave5
Wasn't a massive troll. Just a slight one.
Those assumptions were actually correct, though. I was really testing those assumptions by trying to elicit a response, and open up dialogue to understand the beliefs that are held.
I am within my rights to mock dangerous or harmful beliefs, generally. If they don't have scope to be harmful, then I leave them alone.
If I ever am mocking, it isn't just 'FU', but is just to try and make that person evaluate the beliefs and to give me an insight into what beliefs are held.
Those assumptions were actually correct, though. I was really testing those assumptions by trying to elicit a response, and open up dialogue to understand the beliefs that are held.
I am within my rights to mock dangerous or harmful beliefs, generally. If they don't have scope to be harmful, then I leave them alone.
If I ever am mocking, it isn't just 'FU', but is just to try and make that person evaluate the beliefs and to give me an insight into what beliefs are held.
My beliefs are not dangerous or harmful to anyone, so you could have left them alone. Simply saying I do not agree with the homosexual lifestyle doesn't mean I will abuse anyone who practices it. Again, you don't agree with my religion in the same way I don't agree with homosexuality, and it is my right to express this. We don't all have to agree with what everyone does. Take care
Original post by yasminkattan
My beliefs are not dangerous or harmful to anyone, so you could have left them alone. Simply saying I do not agree with the homosexual lifestyle doesn't mean I will abuse anyone who practices it. Again, you don't agree with my religion in the same way I don't agree with homosexuality, and it is my right to express this. We don't all have to agree with what everyone does. Take care
Sorry. I simply worry when people follow what other people say, irrespective of what that thing is. One of the big causes of the largest problems our world has faced (WW2 for one, and other conflicts/massacres more generally).
Simply want people to be the best they can be. I feel questioning beliefs and being mildly derisory sometimes (being a troll) can result in discussion and reflection, which is always good as leads to understanding.
All the best to you too!
Original post by hellodave5
But what if, for instance, Islam changed and now said, we are to kill all unbelievers? Would you follow such an order?
Taking on a religion doesn't always seem to be a clear and calculated choice, though. It is usually something you grow up in and taught the values of.
Me for instance religion in school assemblies (though this is low level stuff) and families suggestions. Though some families push on their views very strongly, particularly in Islam.
But you are basing your argument on the underlying basis of sexuality on a mere hunch. I doubt you have read any scientific evidence on anything that is stated as fact by your religious ideology.
If you say that about science, then you clearly don't know what science is. Science is the accumulated knowledge of mankind where we have made hypotheses and tests of these hypotheses to see if they are either true or false, with a high margin of accuracy usually needed to deem something true. Such findings must then replicated many times before taken as 'axiom'... and even then, are still sometimes tested to make sure assumptions hold valid and reliable. Though its not to say that the scientific process is perfect (file-drawer problem etc.), it is very reliable.
And besides, it tends to be the case that religion gets practically nothing right.
What do you think gives you your life saving medicine, what it is your nurses and doctors learn to treat you, how you are typing on a wondrously complex input-output processing system to type what you just have into a message to send through the internet accessible to billions of people (if they so wish to see it), and lets you travel at 500mph at 15,000ft to go on holiday as to not spend 3 months getting there by foot.
If you don't assimilate the knowledge of mankind to at least some extent and without bias, then that leaves you pretty incapable of making realistic, fair, and educated/intelligent judgments.
P.S. About religious arguments - what is it that gives them any factual merit? Everyone tends to be open to evaluating them.
Taking on a religion doesn't always seem to be a clear and calculated choice, though. It is usually something you grow up in and taught the values of.
Me for instance religion in school assemblies (though this is low level stuff) and families suggestions. Though some families push on their views very strongly, particularly in Islam.
But you are basing your argument on the underlying basis of sexuality on a mere hunch. I doubt you have read any scientific evidence on anything that is stated as fact by your religious ideology.
If you say that about science, then you clearly don't know what science is. Science is the accumulated knowledge of mankind where we have made hypotheses and tests of these hypotheses to see if they are either true or false, with a high margin of accuracy usually needed to deem something true. Such findings must then replicated many times before taken as 'axiom'... and even then, are still sometimes tested to make sure assumptions hold valid and reliable. Though its not to say that the scientific process is perfect (file-drawer problem etc.), it is very reliable.
And besides, it tends to be the case that religion gets practically nothing right.
What do you think gives you your life saving medicine, what it is your nurses and doctors learn to treat you, how you are typing on a wondrously complex input-output processing system to type what you just have into a message to send through the internet accessible to billions of people (if they so wish to see it), and lets you travel at 500mph at 15,000ft to go on holiday as to not spend 3 months getting there by foot.
If you don't assimilate the knowledge of mankind to at least some extent and without bias, then that leaves you pretty incapable of making realistic, fair, and educated/intelligent judgments.
P.S. About religious arguments - what is it that gives them any factual merit? Everyone tends to be open to evaluating them.
What type of question is that? Islam would not change. And, well, this doesn't apply to me because I converted to Islam. It was probably the most clear and calculated choice I have made in my life. I didn't grow up this way and I wish I had, though I thankfully had the same values. Also, you say families strongly push their views onto their children. I don't think this is the case. If you are born into a family who follows the truth, as we believe, then their children will no doubt be raised the same way, just as an atheist would raise their child the way they think is right.
Actually this shows how little you know about Islam. Islam encourages us to seek knowledge. It is perfectly compatible with science, and what is said in the Qur'an is proof of this. How could we worship Allah and ignore the way His universe functions?
I know very well what science is. Science has been wrong many times in the past, and many things are just theories, e.g. the theory of evolution.
This 'knowledge of mankind' is thanks to Allah, and we are very much encouraged by Him to seek knowledge. So you are making assumptions based on the little knowledge you have on Islam.
Original post by hellodave5
Sorry. I simply worry when people follow what other people say, irrespective of what that thing is. One of the big causes of the largest problems our world has faced (WW2 for one, and other conflicts/massacres more generally).
Simply want people to be the best they can be. I feel questioning beliefs and being mildly derisory sometimes (being a troll) can result in discussion and reflection, which is always good as leads to understanding.
All the best to you too!
Simply want people to be the best they can be. I feel questioning beliefs and being mildly derisory sometimes (being a troll) can result in discussion and reflection, which is always good as leads to understanding.
All the best to you too!
It's fine. Only, who said I am following what other people say? I feel I can only be the best and improve as a person through religion. I'm not ignorant or closed-minded, it's just what I believe in.
Original post by yasminkattan
What type of question is that? Islam would not change. And, well, this doesn't apply to me because I converted to Islam. It was probably the most clear and calculated choice I have made in my life. I didn't grow up this way and I wish I had, though I thankfully had the same values. Also, you say families strongly push their views onto their children. I don't think this is the case. If you are born into a family who follows the truth, as we believe, then their children will no doubt be raised the same way, just as an atheist would raise their child the way they think is right.
Actually this shows how little you know about Islam. Islam encourages us to seek knowledge. It is perfectly compatible with science, and what is said in the Qur'an is proof of this. How could we worship Allah and ignore the way His universe functions?
I know very well what science is. Science has been wrong many times in the past, and many things are just theories, e.g. the theory of evolution.
This 'knowledge of mankind' is thanks to Allah, and we are very much encouraged by Him to seek knowledge. So you are making assumptions based on the little knowledge you have on Islam.
Actually this shows how little you know about Islam. Islam encourages us to seek knowledge. It is perfectly compatible with science, and what is said in the Qur'an is proof of this. How could we worship Allah and ignore the way His universe functions?
I know very well what science is. Science has been wrong many times in the past, and many things are just theories, e.g. the theory of evolution.
This 'knowledge of mankind' is thanks to Allah, and we are very much encouraged by Him to seek knowledge. So you are making assumptions based on the little knowledge you have on Islam.
I think that religions can change, even if the documents on which they are often based tend to stay the same - in that perception of them seems (I'm not sure, I haven't read them) to be rather arbitrary in that one person may say it means something different to the next - and differing levels of importance placed on different notions presented. Some people may ignore parts completely, whilst others may hold them to be of high importance.
This is not necessarily only such documents - but as a social framework too - religion can develop and change as a social structure, whereby it is slowly changed (like society generally).
Why did you convert to Islam, and from which religion?
You seem to have contradicted yourself in the 'pushing of views' as what you stated suggests that it is actually the case that everyone pushes their views on to their children. Though this MAY be more so for religious people relative to all people, I have no evidence to suggest that is the case. But people should let their children decide what is right - through the presentation of facts.
You completely blew my mind when you suggested that Evolutionary theory is false...! It is rather upsetting - as this sort of shows that you haven't looked at scientific evidence, as you feel it goes against your religious ideology.
Evolution, if you look at the evidence, you will find to be most certainly true. Literally irrefutable.
You misunderstand the term theory. Everything that is accepted to be true is considered a theory (and is to be tested and backed up by evidence, or disproven), whilst I think a 'law' is something which can be mathematically computed as to how it happens (i.e. Laws of Thermodynamics etc.).
What about the 'theory' of gravity? Is that false too? Just because something is stated as a 'theory' doesn't mean it doesn't have irrefutable evidence.
Science can be wrong because it is us humans building up knowledge. We postulate a theory which when it undergoes further scrutiny doesn't hold up. That is the basis for science.
Allah didn't give knowledge to mankind. That was scientific reasoning - with lots of observations and tests, and then making conclusions and inferences.
What knowledge has Allah given us?
Original post by yasminkattan
It's fine. Only, who said I am following what other people say? I feel I can only be the best and improve as a person through religion. I'm not ignorant or closed-minded, it's just what I believe in.
Well you said you would believe whatever your religion told you to - so essentially it is following what you're told, rather than making up your own mind.
Religion can be a force for self improvement, and I appreciate that!
But it seems you follow religion to the detriment of knowledge of the world and universe in which you live - because you attribute it all to religion, whilst it is very much not in religions realm, but is something you have to read about and observe yourself.
Religion and science don't have to be incompatible.
Original post by yasminkattan
What type of question is that? Islam would not change. And, well, this doesn't apply to me because I converted to Islam. It was probably the most clear and calculated choice I have made in my life. I didn't grow up this way and I wish I had, though I thankfully had the same values. Also, you say families strongly push their views onto their children. I don't think this is the case. If you are born into a family who follows the truth, as we believe, then their children will no doubt be raised the same way, just as an atheist would raise their child the way they think is right.
Actually this shows how little you know about Islam. Islam encourages us to seek knowledge. It is perfectly compatible with science, and what is said in the Qur'an is proof of this. How could we worship Allah and ignore the way His universe functions?
I know very well what science is. Science has been wrong many times in the past, and many things are just theories, e.g. the theory of evolution.
This 'knowledge of mankind' is thanks to Allah, and we are very much encouraged by Him to seek knowledge. So you are making assumptions based on the little knowledge you have on Islam.
Actually this shows how little you know about Islam. Islam encourages us to seek knowledge. It is perfectly compatible with science, and what is said in the Qur'an is proof of this. How could we worship Allah and ignore the way His universe functions?
I know very well what science is. Science has been wrong many times in the past, and many things are just theories, e.g. the theory of evolution.
This 'knowledge of mankind' is thanks to Allah, and we are very much encouraged by Him to seek knowledge. So you are making assumptions based on the little knowledge you have on Islam.
Wrong, wrong and wrong. Evolution is not just a theory, don't confuse the everyday meaning of the word and the scientific meaning of the word, they're different. Evolution is confirmed by all the evidence and is fact, just like the theory of gravity.
And the Quran contains no impressive or original science.
Original post by yasminkattan
I was commenting on what I saw and have encountered in the past. I don't need you to educate me on anything. If you can give me any scientific evidence to support what you're saying then please, go ahead.
And homophobic, by definition, means to hate or be scared of homosexuals. I neither hate nor am I scared of them. Simply disagreeing with your lifestyle does not make me a homophobe. I'll assume you don't agree with my religious views or the way I choose to live my life, just as I don't agree with yours and that's absolutely fine. We can all have different views Good luck to you also.
And homophobic, by definition, means to hate or be scared of homosexuals. I neither hate nor am I scared of them. Simply disagreeing with your lifestyle does not make me a homophobe. I'll assume you don't agree with my religious views or the way I choose to live my life, just as I don't agree with yours and that's absolutely fine. We can all have different views
Good luck to you also.But that's the thing, I don't disagree with your lifestyle! It's totally your choice to believe whatever you want, and I respect that. Just because I may not share your views doesn't mean that I disagree with you having them - a straight man who is not homophobic wouldn't share the preferences of a gay man, for example, but he equally wouldn't disagree with the gay man having them.
Cool, I'm very happy to give you evidence. There are plenty of studies ( http://healthland.time.com/2011/08/23/scientific-study-finds-that-bisexuality-really-exists/ ) investigating whether or not bisexuality really does exist, based on the arousal of bisexual participants to both male and female stimuli. The conclusion of this study? Yes, it does. Arousal is involuntary, so this clearly shows that bisexuality is not only real, but is not a choice. As any bisexual person could tell you. As I told you.
Anyway, I genuinely don't want to start an internet feud, so I'll stop now
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