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Question regarding quadratic equation roots

Hello guys,

I was wondering that since the product of the two roots of a quadratic equation equal to the y-intercept (c) in the quadratic form and that the sum of the two roots equal to (-b) in the quadratic form.

Does anyone know why or how this was invented?

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Reply 1
Original post by Chittesh14
Hello guys,

I was wondering that since the product of the two roots of a quadratic equation equal to the y-intercept (c) in the quadratic form and that the sum of the two roots equal to (-b) in the quadratic form.

Does anyone know why or how this was invented?

A quadratic can be written in the form

a(xp)(xq)a(x-p)(x-q)

where pp and qq are the roots of the quadratic.

Expand this and compare it with ax2+bx+cax^2+bx+c.
Reply 2
Original post by Chittesh14
Hello guys,

I was wondering that since the product of the two roots of a quadratic equation equal to the y-intercept (c) in the quadratic form and that the sum of the two roots equal to (-b) in the quadratic form.

Does anyone know why or how this was invented?

Also a correction:

The product of the two roots is equal to ca\frac{c}{a}

and the sum is equal to ba-\frac{b}{a}.
you could also try adding and multiplying the two versions ( one with +, one with - ) of the quadratic formula
Reply 4
Original post by notnek
Also a correction:

The product of the two roots is equal to ca\frac{c}{a}

and the sum is equal to ba-\frac{b}{a}.


Yeah sorry, I knew that, I was meant to write when a is <1 :biggrin:.
Reply 5
Original post by notnek
A quadratic can be written in the form

a(xp)(xq)a(x-p)(x-q)

where pp and qq are the roots of the quadratic.

Expand this and compare it with ax2+bx+cax^2+bx+c.


Is that the actual way to prove the theorem - that the products are equal to +c
Reply 6
Original post by Chittesh14
Is that the actual way to prove the theorem - that the products are equal to +c

It's one way. The bear has given you another way.
Reply 7
Original post by notnek
It's one way. The bear has given you another way.


Thanks :P. I never knew it was that easy lol!
Reply 8
Original post by the bear
you could also try adding and multiplying the two versions ( one with +, one with - ) of the quadratic formula


Thanks :smile:
Reply 9
Original post by notnek
A quadratic can be written in the form

a(xp)(xq)a(x-p)(x-q)

where pp and qq are the roots of the quadratic.

Expand this and compare it with ax2+bx+cax^2+bx+c.


a(x-p)(x-q)
a(x^2-xq-px+pq)
ax^2 - axq - apx + apq = 0
ax^2 + bx + c = 0

apq = c
pq = c/a

- axq - apx = bx
- xq - px = bx/a
- q - p = b/a
q + p = -b/a

Is this correct? :smile:

Done in head and on iPad so sorry if there are any spelling mistakes lol.
Posted from TSR Mobile
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Chittesh14
a(x-p)(x-q)
a(x^2-xq-px+pq)
ax^2 - axq - apx + apq = 0
ax^2 + bx + c = 0

apq = c
pq = c/a

- axq - apx = bx
- xq - px = bx/a
- q - p = b/a
q + p = -b/a

Is this correct? :smile:

Done in head and on iPad so sorry if there are any spelling mistakes lol.
Posted from TSR Mobile

Edit: Actually not quite. You can compare the coefficients, e.g. -p - q = b/a etc but not the complete terms (i.e. no -px - qx = -bx/a).

As an exercise you might now try to find similar results for a cubic equation.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by 16Characters....
Edit: Actually not quite. You can compare the coefficients, e.g. -p - q = b/a etc but not the complete terms (i.e. no -px - qx = -bx/a).

As an exercise you might now try to find similar results for a cubic equation.


Sorry I don't get what you mean by the first line :/, especially the complete terms part.


Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by Chittesh14
Sorry I don't get what you mean by the first line :/, especially the complete terms part.

Posted from TSR Mobile


You are correct that ax2+bx+cax2apxaqx+apq ax^2 + bx + c \equiv ax^2 - apx - aqx + apq {Note that the use of \equiv means that it holds whatever value of x you substitute in. It means "is the same as" or "is equivalent to"}

From here we can do what is called "comparing coefficients" which is exactly what is says on the tin. We can compare the coefficients of x to see that apaq=b - ap - aq = b and hence p+q=ba p + q = \frac{-b}{a} . We would not write apxaqx=bx -apx - aqx = bx , we would only write the coefficients down.
Original post by 16Characters....
You are correct that ax2+bx+cax2apxaqx+apq ax^2 + bx + c \equiv ax^2 - apx - aqx + apq {Note that the use of \equiv means that it holds whatever value of x you substitute in. It means "is the same as" or "is equivalent to"}

From here we can do what is called "comparing coefficients" which is exactly what is says on the tin. We can compare the coefficients of x to see that apaq=b - ap - aq = b and hence p+q=ba p + q = \frac{-b}{a} . We would not write apxaqx=bx -apx - aqx = bx , we would only write the coefficients down.


Oh right lol thanks :smile:


Posted from TSR Mobile
Can anyone please tell me if there is a shorter way of working out this question ?

There are two curves y = (x-1)^3 and y = (x-1)(1+x).
I need to find the coordinates of the points of intersection.

This is my method:

(x1)3=(x1)(1+x)[br](x22x+1)(x1)=(x1)(1+x)[br](x32x2+x)(x22x+1)=(x1)(1+x)[br]x33x2+3x1=x2+xx1[br]x33x2+3x1=x21[br]x34x2+3x=0[br]x(x24x+3)=0[br]x(x3)(x1)=0[br]So,x=0orx=3orx=1.(x-1)^3 = (x-1)(1+x)[br](x^2-2x+1)(x-1) = (x-1)(1+x)[br](x^3 - 2x^2 + x) - (x^2 - 2x + 1) = (x-1)(1+x)[br]x^3 - 3x^2 + 3x - 1 = x^2 + x - x - 1[br]x^3 - 3x^2 + 3x - 1 = x^2 - 1[br]x^3 - 4x^2 + 3x = 0[br]x(x^2 - 4x + 3) = 0[br]x(x-3)(x-1) = 0[br]So, x = 0 or x = 3 or x = 1.

I think this part of the method is pretty straightforward and fast.

y=(x1)(1+x)[br][br]Whenx=0,y=(01)(1+0)[br]=(1)(1)[br]=1[br][br]Whenx=3,y=(31)(1+3)[br]=(2)(4)[br]=8[br][br]Whenx=1,y=(11)(1+1)[br]=(0)(2)[br]=0[br][br]So,thecoordinatesofthepointsofintersectionare(0,1),(3,8)and(1,0).y = (x-1)(1+x)[br][br]When x = 0, y = (0-1)(1+0)[br]= (-1)(1)[br]= -1[br][br]When x = 3, y = (3-1)(1+3)[br]= (2)(4)[br]= 8[br][br]When x = 1, y = (1-1)(1+1)[br]= (0)(2)[br]= 0[br][br]So, the co-ordinates of the points of intersection are (0,-1), (3,8) and (1,0).
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Chittesh14
x


Yes.

Just to make it easier for you to see, if we swapped x-1 for a then we would have a^3 = a(1+x).

So then a^3 - a(1+x) = 0 and there is a common factor between those two terms.

That saves you a bit of expanding.
Original post by SeanFM
Yes.

Just to make it easier for you to see, if we swapped x-1 for a then we would have a^3 = a(1+x).

So then a^3 - a(1+x) = 0 and there is a common factor between those two terms.

That saves you a bit of expanding.


So, x^3 = x(1+x).
x^3 - x(1+x) = 0
x^3 - x^2 - x = 0
x(x^2 - x - 1) = 0

Then what? :redface:
Original post by Chittesh14
So, x^3 = x(1+x).
x^3 - x(1+x) = 0
x^3 - x^2 - x = 0
x(x^2 - x - 1) = 0

Then what? :redface:


Oh, you should keep x-1 in there instead of putting a (which you've now changed into x which is very dangerous!). I just labelled it a to make it clear that you were factoring out.

a^3 - a(1+x) = 0
You've then multiplied it out and then factored it out which is fine but you can skip the third line by just noticing that a is the commmon factor, so a^3 - a(1+x) = a(a^2 - (1+x)), and then substitute a back out and factorise whatever's in the brackets. Ideally you don't need to use 'a', just use (x-1) from the start and notice that you can factor out (x-1) from (x-1)^3 - (x-1)(x+1).
Original post by SeanFM
Oh, you should keep x-1 in there instead of putting a (which you've now changed into x which is very dangerous!). I just labelled it a to make it clear that you were factoring out.

a^3 - a(1+x) = 0
You've then multiplied it out and then factored it out which is fine but you can skip the third line by just noticing that a is the commmon factor, so a^3 - a(1+x) = a(a^2 - (1+x)), and then substitute a back out and factorise whatever's in the brackets. Ideally you don't need to use 'a', just use (x-1) from the start and notice that you can factor out (x-1) from (x-1)^3 - (x-1)(x+1).


So,(x1)3(x1)(1+x)=0[br](x1)2(1+x)=0[br](x22x+1)(1+x)=0[br](x32x2+x)+(x22x+1)=0[br]x3x2x+1=0So, (x-1)^3 - (x-1)(1+x) = 0[br](x-1)^2(1+x) = 0[br](x^2-2x+1)(1+x) = 0[br](x^3 - 2x^2 + x) + (x^2 - 2x + 1) = 0[br]x^3 - x^2 - x + 1 = 0

This is clearly incorrect.

V2

(x1)3(x1)(1+x)=0[br](x1)2(1+x)=0[br](x22x+1)1x=0[br]x23x=0[br]x(x3)=0[br]x=0orx=3(x-1)^3 - (x-1)(1+x) = 0[br](x-1)^2 - (1+x) = 0[br](x^2 - 2x + 1) - 1 - x = 0[br]x^2 - 3x = 0[br]x(x-3) = 0[br]x = 0 or x = 3

Partially correct, where is the x = 1 gone? :redface:

I know that if I multiply the equation above by (x-1), I'll get the correct answer, but I don't know how to bring that (x-1) back.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Chittesh14
So,(x1)3(x1)(1+x)=0[br](x1)2(1+x)=0[br](x22x+1)(1+x)=0[br](x32x2+x)+(x22x+1)=0[br]x3x2x+1=0So, (x-1)^3 - (x-1)(1+x) = 0[br](x-1)^2(1+x) = 0[br](x^2-2x+1)(1+x) = 0[br](x^3 - 2x^2 + x) + (x^2 - 2x + 1) = 0[br]x^3 - x^2 - x + 1 = 0

This is clearly incorrect.

V2

(x1)3(x1)(1+x)=0[br](x1)2(1+x)=0[br](x22x+1)1x=0[br]x23x=0[br]x(x3)=0[br]x=0orx=3(x-1)^3 - (x-1)(1+x) = 0[br](x-1)^2 - (1+x) = 0[br](x^2 - 2x + 1) - 1 - x = 0[br]x^2 - 3x = 0[br]x(x-3) = 0[br]x = 0 or x = 3

Partially correct, where is the x = 1 gone? :redface:


For V1 I'm not quite sure how you got to your second line.

For V2 you're almost there, but you 'cancelled out' x-1 from going to the first line to the second line. (if you put each line in brackets from line 2 onwards and multiply by (x-1) then you will get what you did by going through the long way.

You shouldn't cancel out solutions, instead just factorise them. Like if you have sinx = tanx, then you would say sinx = (sinx)/cosx and it would be a mistake to divide both sides by sinx as you would be getting rid of a solution.

Instead, you go cosxsinx - sinx = 0 and so sinx(cosx - 1) = 0. And your question is similar to this.

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