NEW: your 6 least liked active politicians in the UK
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So many deluded sheep here. THEY DON'T MATTER.
Original post by That Bearded Man
Diane Abbott (irritating)
Simon Danczuk (betrayed his party)
IDS (murderer)
Jeremy Hunt (destroying the health services and ignoring the complaints)
Philip Davies (filibustered a carers allowance bill, pure scum)
Theresa May (mental)
Posted from TSR Mobile
Simon Danczuk (betrayed his party)
IDS (murderer)
Jeremy Hunt (destroying the health services and ignoring the complaints)
Philip Davies (filibustered a carers allowance bill, pure scum)
Theresa May (mental)
Posted from TSR Mobile
How has Simon danczuk betrayed his party? The guys a creep though
Corbyn: His main consistency has been U-Turns, despite the fact he is seen as being principled and a man of his word. He is clueless when it comes to foreign affairs and has little knowledge of the issues around one of his core beliefs, nuclear disarmament.
Theresa May: Seems to be the worst instincts of the Conservative Party in one neat bundle.
Diane Abbot: Needs no elaboration.
BoJo: Dishonest and I cannot help but feel his idiot act is hiding some dark political views.
That's all I've got.
Simon Danczuk: I'll throw him in for a complete lack of judgment. He then has the gall to complain that Corbyn and his supporters are trying to set him up and use recent events as a way to punish him for his criticism.
Theresa May: Seems to be the worst instincts of the Conservative Party in one neat bundle.
Diane Abbot: Needs no elaboration.
BoJo: Dishonest and I cannot help but feel his idiot act is hiding some dark political views.
That's all I've got.
Simon Danczuk: I'll throw him in for a complete lack of judgment. He then has the gall to complain that Corbyn and his supporters are trying to set him up and use recent events as a way to punish him for his criticism.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Aj12
Corbyn: His main consistency has been U-Turns, despite the fact he is seen as being principled and a man of his word. He is clueless when it comes to foreign affairs and has little knowledge of the issues around one of his core beliefs, nuclear disarmament.
Theresa May: Seems to be the worst instincts of the Conservative Party in one neat bundle.
Diane Abbot: Needs no elaboration.
BoJo: Dishonest and I cannot help but feel his idiot act is hiding some dark political views.
Ken Livingston: The remarks he makes about other politicians are plain nasty. The man just irks me.
That's all I've got.
Simon Danczuk: I'll throw him in for a complete lack of judgment. He then has the gall to complain that Corbyn and his supporters are trying to set him up and use recent events as a way to punish him for his criticism.
Theresa May: Seems to be the worst instincts of the Conservative Party in one neat bundle.
Diane Abbot: Needs no elaboration.
BoJo: Dishonest and I cannot help but feel his idiot act is hiding some dark political views.
Ken Livingston: The remarks he makes about other politicians are plain nasty. The man just irks me.
That's all I've got.
Simon Danczuk: I'll throw him in for a complete lack of judgment. He then has the gall to complain that Corbyn and his supporters are trying to set him up and use recent events as a way to punish him for his criticism.
Ken Livingstone isn't an MP, MEP or member of the HoL. If he was he'd be on the top of my list. The world will be a better place when he goes.
Agree with all of that although for BoJo i dont think he has dark political views- I just think he's probably not a very nice person.
Original post by Davij038
Ken Livingstone isn't an MP, MEP or member of the HoL. If he was he'd be on the top of my list. The world will be a better place when he goes.
Agree with all of that although for BoJo i dont think he has dark political views- I just think he's probably not a very nice person.
Agree with all of that although for BoJo i dont think he has dark political views- I just think he's probably not a very nice person.
Dark was perhaps too strong, but I really do not know what to make of him. The idea of him succeeding Cameron worries me.
Original post by Davij038
Theresa May: unpleasant, populist, Daily Mail courting witch.
Theresa May: unpleasant, populist, Daily Mail courting witch.
Lol so true. She is just so unsympathetic.
Original post by Aj12
Dark was perhaps too strong, but I really do not know what to make of him. The idea of him succeeding Cameron worries me.
I wouldn't actually be worried though I'd prefer Osborne (I'm not a tory though). Unlikely as it is May would obviously be the most worrisome.
I think we're BoJo goes on the EU vote will be interesting. apparently David Cameron is the most trusted politician on the issue but that if Boris campaigned for out this would be nullified. I could well see Boris being Cameron MKII if he campaigns for in. He strikes me as being rather Gove-esque in that he's quite complicated.
Original post by Davij038
I'm not so sure.
For a start the UK needed a stable government in the midst of the recession.
Neither the Tories nor labour would have signed up to a PR referendum. As somebody relatively ambivalent on the issue I don't see any reason why a PR referendum would have fared any better- it was a long shot but it was their only chance and in 2010 seemed better than nothing.
No, I don't think anything would have kept them going. The moment they'd entered government they lost their core protest vote.
For a start the UK needed a stable government in the midst of the recession.
Neither the Tories nor labour would have signed up to a PR referendum. As somebody relatively ambivalent on the issue I don't see any reason why a PR referendum would have fared any better- it was a long shot but it was their only chance and in 2010 seemed better than nothing.
No, I don't think anything would have kept them going. The moment they'd entered government they lost their core protest vote.
I don't necessarily agree that the UK needed a stable government. I don't believe in the De-politicisaton of ideals and that's what the Lib Dems engaged in.
Austerity was an ideological choice. Not a 'public good' one. It was a way for the tories and Orange Bookers to 'roll bank the frontiers of the state' and give more control to the private sector.
The idea that you can't invest to grow is nonsense, just look at USA or even China. Look at FDR after the Great recession. You very much can invest to grow.
But instead the coalition made out that austerity wasn't an ideological choice but one of necessity. It wasn't.
As for PR, in my opinion it would have had more of a chance. Half the reason people didn't want AV was because they did not understand it and it's not actually a proportional system. And no one really wants it as a first choice option. It now gives the government a chance to say 'you rejected AV' when we have a debate on voting systems.
They should have stuck to their principles and mandated a referendum on PR.
Original post by Bornblue
I don't necessarily agree that the UK needed a stable government. I don't believe in the De-politicisaton of ideals and that's what the Lib Dems engaged in.
Austerity was an ideological choice. Not a 'public good' one. It was a way for the tories and Orange Bookers to 'roll bank the frontiers of the state' and give more control to the private sector.
The idea that you can't invest to grow is nonsense, just look at USA or even China. Look at FDR after the Great recession. You very much can invest to grow.
But instead the coalition made out that austerity wasn't an ideological choice but one of necessity. It wasn't.
Austerity was an ideological choice. Not a 'public good' one. It was a way for the tories and Orange Bookers to 'roll bank the frontiers of the state' and give more control to the private sector.
The idea that you can't invest to grow is nonsense, just look at USA or even China. Look at FDR after the Great recession. You very much can invest to grow.
But instead the coalition made out that austerity wasn't an ideological choice but one of necessity. It wasn't.
Regardless of whether or not we agree to a Keynesian approach or whatever- at the time of the recession many large companies were worried about an unstable UK and that this would have consequences to the economy regardless of what policies were to be ushered in. Labour were also falling apart at the time.
As for 'de-politicization of ideals' I think that this is pretty much inevitable in a democracy- particularly with a new party that hasn't been in government. I mean, just look at the shambles of an interview that the Green Leader did on LBC made.
Regardless, I hope you'll understand if i don't waste time defending a party i don't support!
EDIT: If your interested in how the Coalition came about- 22 days in May by David Laws is quite insightful.
As for PR, in my opinion it would have had more of a chance. Half the reason people didn't want AV was because they did not understand it and it's not actually a proportional system. And no one really wants it as a first choice option. It now gives the government a chance to say 'you rejected AV' when we have a debate on voting systems.
They should have stuck to their principles and mandated a referendum on PR.
Most people i speak to don't understand FPTP let alone PR. I think we can agree to disagree on that one!
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Davij038
Regardless of whether or not we agree to a Keynesian approach or whatever- at the time of the recession many large companies were worried about an unstable UK and that this would have consequences to the economy regardless of what policies were to be ushered in. Labour were also falling apart at the time.
As for 'de-politicization of ideals' I think that this is pretty much inevitable in a democracy- particularly with a new party that hasn't been in government. I mean, just look at the shambles of an interview that the Green Leader did on LBC made.
Regardless, I hope you'll understand if i don't waste time defending a party i don't support!
EDIT: If your interested in how the Coalition came about- 22 days in May by David Laws is quite insightful.
Most people i speak to don't understand FPTP let alone PR. I think we can agree to disagree on that one!
As for 'de-politicization of ideals' I think that this is pretty much inevitable in a democracy- particularly with a new party that hasn't been in government. I mean, just look at the shambles of an interview that the Green Leader did on LBC made.
Regardless, I hope you'll understand if i don't waste time defending a party i don't support!
EDIT: If your interested in how the Coalition came about- 22 days in May by David Laws is quite insightful.
Most people i speak to don't understand FPTP let alone PR. I think we can agree to disagree on that one!
My tune has changed somewhat in recent months. I don't blame the Lib Dems for entering into a coalition anymore but I do blame them for not standing up for their principles and enforcing or even trying to enforce their key-note vote winning policies. It would have been like Ed Miliband giving a tax cut to mansion owners had he been elected!
The de-politicisation of ideals is something i'm very wary of. I don't believe that there are moral values we live by. I don't believe anything is inherently right or wrong. I don't believe there are such things as 'the public good' or an 'underlying consensus' etc. Everything is political. Even arguments such as having a trial before conviction and freedom from torture are political rather than in any greater moral standards.
So what I hate is when political parties of all types make out that political and ideological views are not political but merely 'for the public good' and 'necessary'.
I would have had far more respect for the tories if they justified austerity by ideology, not by 'necessity' or the 'public good'. Same with the Lib Dems.
Was it any event in particular that made you turn away from the Lib Dems, ideologically speaking rather than the party?
Original post by Davij038
How has Simon danczuk betrayed his party? The guys a creep though
He has publically criticised Corbyn at every step, writing in the Mail and appearing in interviews criticising the election, threatening to vote again his bills etc. I have no problem with MPs privately disagreeing, but to set out to undermine the Party at every opportunity is an insult to those who voted for him, or who don't agree with his views but back his mandate.
I think the young girl allegations and his refusal to accept or apologise this says alot about his character.
Original post by cranbrook_aspie
1. George Osborne
2. David Cameron
3. Iain Duncan Smith
4. Theresa May
5. Jeremy Hunt
6. Simon Danczuk
2. David Cameron
3. Iain Duncan Smith
4. Theresa May
5. Jeremy Hunt
6. Simon Danczuk
I agree with this, although I would be tempted to add Sir Eric Pickles. Also, I would add the evil witch Bronwyn Bishop (google her - she spent taxpayers' money on helicopter rides and ousted the one person who saved her career). However, she is an Australian.
Original post by Quamquam123
I agree with this, although I would be tempted to add Sir Eric Pickles. Also, I would add the evil witch Bronwyn Bishop (google her - she spent taxpayers' money on helicopter rides and ousted the one person who saved her career). However, she is an Australian.
How did I know you'd say him?
No particular order
Theresa May: ****ing mad. Just mad. Basically wants a camera in every room in the country to curb "Terrorists".
Iain and Duncan Smith: Both theses men were born without a heart.
Dianne Abbott: She is so annoying.
David Cameron: Basically just a mouthpiece for the people in the parties backrooms. Has taken no responsibility for the hardships that the steel industry is in right now. Sucking up to the Chinese, instead of protecting our industry.
Leanne Wood: My version of Sturgeon. Quite batty ideas. Wants to break Wales away from the union. Also, She leads the National party and doesn't speak Welsh.
Douglas Carswell: Doesn't have the balls to contest for leader.
George Osbourne: On here for causing some of the worst levels of poverty for quite some time. Selling off public companies for a quick profit, aka Royal Mail. Sucking up to the Chinese instead of helping the UK steel industry.
Nicky Morgan : Incompetent.
Stephen Crabb: No help to us in Wales at all.
Theresa May: ****ing mad. Just mad. Basically wants a camera in every room in the country to curb "Terrorists".
Iain and Duncan Smith: Both theses men were born without a heart.
Dianne Abbott: She is so annoying.
David Cameron: Basically just a mouthpiece for the people in the parties backrooms. Has taken no responsibility for the hardships that the steel industry is in right now. Sucking up to the Chinese, instead of protecting our industry.
Leanne Wood: My version of Sturgeon. Quite batty ideas. Wants to break Wales away from the union. Also, She leads the National party and doesn't speak Welsh.
Douglas Carswell: Doesn't have the balls to contest for leader.
George Osbourne: On here for causing some of the worst levels of poverty for quite some time. Selling off public companies for a quick profit, aka Royal Mail. Sucking up to the Chinese instead of helping the UK steel industry.
Nicky Morgan : Incompetent.
Stephen Crabb: No help to us in Wales at all.
Sorry for the late rep,y, I was halfway through a lengthy reply when my phone died which wasn't fun...
Had that been the price of government and he would have been able to implement virtually every other manifesto pledge I think that would have been worthwhile. The lib dems delivered on most of their manifesto despite actually losing seats in 2010 (tax cuts, green investment bank etc) . The problem was nobody was listening.
The de-politicisation of ideals is something i'm very wary of. I don't believe that there are moral values we live by. I don't believe anything is inherently right or wrong. I don't believe there are such things as 'the public good' or an 'underlying consensus' etc. Everything is political. Even arguments such as having a trial before conviction and freedom from torture are political rather than in any greater moral standards.
So what I hate is when political parties of all types make out that political and ideological views are not political but merely 'for the public good' and 'necessary'.
I would have had far more respect for the tories if they justified austerity by ideology, not by 'necessity' or the 'public good'. Same with the Lib Dems.
Was it any event in particular that made you turn away from the Lib Dems, ideologically speaking rather than the party?
The answer to this is quite long, so Ill try to keep it brief.
The points you outlined above is essentially relativism, which I think a liberal society reinforces and even encourages. I am opposed to this. Whilst I do not believe that morality exists and we live in a materialist world, I do think that there can be an empirical ethics which is for lack of s better word good and truthful.
For instance if say someone is beating their wife it is wrong not because he is neccessArily 'evil' (what if he loves her but is struggling with mental health issues for example) but he would be wrong because beating his wife would have negative consequences for both of them which could be readily observed.
In a liberal Democratic society it doesn't matter per se what is right but what is popular and herin lies the problem of capitalism. I do not believe that human beings are on the whole rational and that 'freedom' is an absurd abstraction for lives which are in reality shaped by the environment and genetics.
All good left wing stuff so far, but where I'd go further and am primarily influenced by Christopher Hitchens is that this is the case on a global level. Liberal Democracies for all their many faults are a better way of living than under a despotic dictatorship or personality cult (say North korea) - regardless of culture, even if every single person in that area rejected it. Unfortunately so much of the left, notably Corbyn reject this as an imperialist position and embrace their own relativism with the internal contradictions that this implies.
Original post by Bornblue
My tune has changed somewhat in recent months. I don't blame the Lib Dems for entering into a coalition anymore but I do blame them for not standing up for their principles and enforcing or even trying to enforce their key-note vote winning policies. It would have been like Ed Miliband giving a tax cut to mansion owners had he been elected!
Had that been the price of government and he would have been able to implement virtually every other manifesto pledge I think that would have been worthwhile. The lib dems delivered on most of their manifesto despite actually losing seats in 2010 (tax cuts, green investment bank etc) . The problem was nobody was listening.
The de-politicisation of ideals is something i'm very wary of. I don't believe that there are moral values we live by. I don't believe anything is inherently right or wrong. I don't believe there are such things as 'the public good' or an 'underlying consensus' etc. Everything is political. Even arguments such as having a trial before conviction and freedom from torture are political rather than in any greater moral standards.
So what I hate is when political parties of all types make out that political and ideological views are not political but merely 'for the public good' and 'necessary'.
I would have had far more respect for the tories if they justified austerity by ideology, not by 'necessity' or the 'public good'. Same with the Lib Dems.
Was it any event in particular that made you turn away from the Lib Dems, ideologically speaking rather than the party?
The answer to this is quite long, so Ill try to keep it brief.
The points you outlined above is essentially relativism, which I think a liberal society reinforces and even encourages. I am opposed to this. Whilst I do not believe that morality exists and we live in a materialist world, I do think that there can be an empirical ethics which is for lack of s better word good and truthful.
For instance if say someone is beating their wife it is wrong not because he is neccessArily 'evil' (what if he loves her but is struggling with mental health issues for example) but he would be wrong because beating his wife would have negative consequences for both of them which could be readily observed.
In a liberal Democratic society it doesn't matter per se what is right but what is popular and herin lies the problem of capitalism. I do not believe that human beings are on the whole rational and that 'freedom' is an absurd abstraction for lives which are in reality shaped by the environment and genetics.
All good left wing stuff so far, but where I'd go further and am primarily influenced by Christopher Hitchens is that this is the case on a global level. Liberal Democracies for all their many faults are a better way of living than under a despotic dictatorship or personality cult (say North korea) - regardless of culture, even if every single person in that area rejected it. Unfortunately so much of the left, notably Corbyn reject this as an imperialist position and embrace their own relativism with the internal contradictions that this implies.
1. Tristram Hunt (intuitively annoying, useless on political strategy, no charisma, occupies what is, in my eyes, a very lazy ideological domain)
2. Iain Duncan Smith (so thick - yet so certain he's right! this article exposes well http://anotherangryvoice.blogspot.com.es/2013/02/ian-duncan-smith-workfare-propaganda.html )
3. Sadiq Kahn (currently anyway - something so irritatingly insubstantial about him)
4. Matthew Hancock (a bit like Hunt, gets on my nerves on an innate basis - watching him so confidently spout what I think is crap with such certainty)
5. Nick Clegg's still in parliment isn't he? (For idiotically putting the tories into power and not admitting his decisions destroyed his party)
6. gonna opt for Frank Field for this last one, altho could've been many. For this https://number10duckworthstreet.wordpress.com/2015/07/21/frank-fields-arrogantly-admits-his-constituents-views-count-for-nothing-and-its-not-his-job-to-speak-up-for-them/
2. Iain Duncan Smith (so thick - yet so certain he's right! this article exposes well http://anotherangryvoice.blogspot.com.es/2013/02/ian-duncan-smith-workfare-propaganda.html )
3. Sadiq Kahn (currently anyway - something so irritatingly insubstantial about him)
4. Matthew Hancock (a bit like Hunt, gets on my nerves on an innate basis - watching him so confidently spout what I think is crap with such certainty)
5. Nick Clegg's still in parliment isn't he? (For idiotically putting the tories into power and not admitting his decisions destroyed his party)
6. gonna opt for Frank Field for this last one, altho could've been many. For this https://number10duckworthstreet.wordpress.com/2015/07/21/frank-fields-arrogantly-admits-his-constituents-views-count-for-nothing-and-its-not-his-job-to-speak-up-for-them/
Emily Thornberry
Jeremy Hunt
Michael Gove
David Cameron
Lucy Allen
That UKIP (spokesperson?) backup one, the witch.
Jeremy Hunt
Michael Gove
David Cameron
Lucy Allen
That UKIP (spokesperson?) backup one, the witch.
Original post by THE EPIC Panda
Dianne Abbott: She is so annoying.
Dianne Abbott: She is so annoying.
At least she doesn't support their dumb-ass foreign escapades.
Original post by SaucissonSecCy
At least she doesn't support their dumb-ass foreign escapades.
I know right, everything would be so much better if sad dam was still in power...
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