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David Cameron on UK Muslim Communities: "We won’t let women be second-class citizens"

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they shouldn't have been been allowed in without the ****ing language. jesus christ, I swear to god man...!
What is he talking about ? Muslims are a perfectly integrated group in the UK society.
Original post by BaconandSauce
A link would be good

But yes you are right you should make the effort and it's not wrong making it a condition of citizenship for those who CHOOSE this option.


It was just something I saw in passing, idk if it's actually a thing or not haha

I do think though we should support people in learning the language when they're willing - Cameron's just cut funding for English lessons. 'You can't speak English but you're willing to learn? Well I'll just get rid of those classes for you...'
Original post by abruiseonthesky
It was just something I saw in passing, idk if it's actually a thing or not haha

I do think though we should support people in learning the language when they're willing - Cameron's just cut funding for English lessons. 'You can't speak English but you're willing to learn? Well I'll just get rid of those classes for you...'


No I think he was a idiot for cutting the funding but I do have issues in why should we have to pay for this given as I keep saying choosing to become a citizen is an individuals choice. I see no issues as this is a choice having to achieve a certain level of competence in communication and at your own cost.

I think this should still be the case but it should not be publicly funded (people should be willing to do this themselves and at their own cost given the benefits citizenship brings)
Original post by BaconandSauce
No I think he was a idiot for cutting the funding but I do have issues in why should we have to pay for this given as I keep saying choosing to become a citizen is an individuals choice. I see no issues as this is a choice having to achieve a certain level of competence in communication and at your own cost.

I think this should still be the case but it should not be publicly funded (people should be willing to do this themselves and at their own cost given the benefits citizenship brings)


Help people learn English --> they're more employable --> they pay taxes back
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
Only if we also take back the lazy feckless Brits who live in other countries who are too lazy to learn the local language.

I'm not sure how deporting these women helps alleviate their oppression... Cameron, PR mastermind appeasing the liberal Guardinistas and immigrant hating Kippers in one fell stroke.


"Lazy feckless brits" who provide huge amounts of money for those countries
Also has nothing to do with the issue of the article
Original post by abruiseonthesky
Help people learn English --> they're more employable --> they pay taxes back


But as a citizen they don't actually have to work

as I said the benefits of citizenship are on the whole greater than the cost of learning the language

But the real issue is the people who we are trying to get to learn the language and to remove the disadvantage they have in our society. I can understand why some would not want this (can you imagine telling most muslim women imported into the UK for marriage that for example they don't have to tolerate being beaten as it's against the law or that there is such a thing a martial rape and it's against the law or even worse they can file for a Divorce without their families permission or approval as they have all these wonderful things called rights as a citizen of this country).
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by abruiseonthesky
Do you agree with (I think) Dubai deporting people who refuse to learn Arabic (just out of interest)?


Of course
Original post by TheArtofProtest
And they are supposed to feel grateful for this?


of course ????
I'll be totally frank, I'm so glad I'm English and can fluently speak the language because it is such a tough, tough language to learn. We act like it's easy for immigrants to learn it but some learn faster than others, we should take such factors in to consideration rather than jumping the gun like we Brits love to do.
Reply 50
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koza
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Does this mean we can at long last get rid of the Welsh?
Don't particularly like the guy but this time, he's hit the nail on the head.
...why is this only about muslim "women", though?
A perfect policy from a leader who is all about image and appearance.

Those on the right see it as a clamp down on immigration, those on the left see it as liberating oppressed women...

Whether it will actually make any difference I think is unlikely, but I don't think Cameron, or voters, actually give a **** if it does.
Reply 54
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koza
2
Original post by sleepysnooze
...why is this only about muslim "women", though?


Ahhhhh ****, so not the Welsh. :frown:
Original post by sleepysnooze
...why is this only about muslim "women", though?


Treatment of women in Muslim communities is generally awful due to the nature of Islam and the countries it originates from. In my town, a large majority of the special school places are taken up by the children of Pakistani immigrants - this overrepresentation arises from the inbreeding as illiterate cousins etc are essentially sold into marriage then shipped over and are unable to learn the language and leave the house.

This treatment of women is solely unique to Islam - no other religion in the UK would even dare treat women like this. Islam, as a religion is almost entirely against our western, christian values and should rightly be forced to change by the government to bring it in line.
Looks like chaoticbutterfly has been ripped apart.

One of the main issues with integration though is the bombing/intervention of their home countries. I do agree with most of the intervention, but if you lived in America and then moved to England and we bombed America of course you wouldn't want to integrate. Even if they are fighting Jihadists or Fascists, they still make impact and will feel more than just collateral damage to them.

As much as I dislike Gordon Brown, he does make sense with this point.
Original post by Kieselguhr
Treatment of women in Muslim communities is generally awful due to the nature of Islam and the countries it originates from. In my town, a large majority of the special school places are taken up by the children of Pakistani immigrants - this overrepresentation arises from the inbreeding as illiterate cousins etc are essentially sold into marriage then shipped over and are unable to learn the language and leave the house.

This treatment of women is solely unique to Islam - no other religion in the UK would even dare treat women like this. Islam, as a religion is almost entirely against our western, christian values and should rightly be forced to change by the government to bring it in line.


well that's true but I thought we were talking about language? you mean that only women are shipped here an not men? well fair enough
our "christian" values...? like what? are they the same "christian" values as central africa? or are they "secular european values"?
Original post by Kieselguhr
Treatment of women in Muslim communities is generally awful due to the nature of Islam and the countries it originates from. In my town, a large majority of the special school places are taken up by the children of Pakistani immigrants - this overrepresentation arises from the inbreeding as illiterate cousins etc are essentially sold into marriage then shipped over and are unable to learn the language and leave the house.

This treatment of women is solely unique to Islam - no other religion in the UK would even dare treat women like this. Islam, as a religion is almost entirely against our western, christian values and should rightly be forced to change by the government to bring it in line.

I think it is more of a cultural thing rather than islam. You have described a culture that people from specific parts of the world follow, but african muslims (which has a greap proportion if muslims >45% do not marry their cousins and are pretty liberated.
People always mix islam and culture up and use a proportion of people to represent islam. In sudanese and kenyan culture the women are quite liberated, and they are still muslims. It isnt islamic guidelines that oppresses women it is culture which does this, so you shouldnt confuse the two.
And to mention Islam had inheritance for women 1400 years ago and this only came about in 1882 in the UK.
Women were also educated and set up trust funds for universities and women only started being educated at formal education colleges in the 18th century in England.
Also, in islam, women had the right to divorce 1400 years ago, whereas this is a recent occurence in the western world.
Education is very important on Islam, be it make or female and the cultures which restrict this are going against the teachings of Islam.
So blame not the religion but the culture.
I think I will actually look more into Islam as it is an interesting religion.
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Reply 59
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Ahem-
9
I know what will give us "one nation".. Marxism.

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