Muslims aren't the problem, Islam is

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Breeding hate

That's the point wise old chap.

If something itself is utterly disgusting in a rather fundamental manner then it must be hated up until the point that the irrational people who believe in it 'see the light' and cease to do so.

Many times reason has been tried but reason and rational argument alone tend not to be very persuasive to the uneducated, irrational, masses.

Reply 301

Khadijah489

It seems to me that you are more dishonest in your replies as you are just assuming that there are more disbelievers in islam than there are believers. Did you research up on this to back up what you just said? How do you know for sure that there are more disbelievers than believers in islam?

Reply 302

Khadijah489

I hope that was a good thing lol

Reply 303

difeo

Original post by Khadijah489

I assume you have read the Quran since you say yourself that it is full of violent and unpleasant passages. So which parts do you think are violent and unpleasant because I'd really like to know what your talking about?

How about the bits that say apostates should be killed

Reply 304

BaconandSauce

Original post by Khadijah489

I'm not assuming anything at all I am simply stating facts and yes I did research this before I posted to get the exact figures but I already knew this to be the case.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_world

here is a pro muslim site that claim in 2030 (14 years away) muslim will make up 1\3rd of the world

It is expected that if present rate of increase of Muslim population continues that by 2030 One out of Three person will be Muslim. .

http://www.muslimpopulation.com/

as I said as it stands there are more people who don't believe in Islam than there are.

as I said you are being very dishonest in your replies and very lazy.

Reply 305

troubadour.

Original post by Khadijah489

It would help tremendously if you could bother to quote the people you're talking to.

Disbelievers in Islam? Surely that's a contradiction in terms? A disbeliever in Islam is, by definition, not following Islam. @BaconandSauce's point was that Muslims constitute around a quarter of the world's population and that your earlier claim referring to 'a minority of disbelievers' was false because a majority of the world's population doesn't follow Islam.

This doesn't require 'research' -- it's a simple matter of being up to date with your general knowledge, or failing that (as you have), Googling the approximate number of people in the world and then the approximate number of Muslims in the world and working out a percentage.

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 306

username1595471

Original post by Khadijah489

Your contradicting yourself there by saying that I haven't read the Quran, that's pretty stupid considering that I never denied violence in the first place but oh well. As for those passages, its there for a reason, as the Quran states that the disbelievers will get punished since they are simply not followers of Islam. Also, those passages don't solely reflect on the majority of people, its the minority, again.

Wow. What a beautiful religion. Countless billions of people from the last 1400 years will be perpetually tortured and burned just because they are 'simply not followers of Islam'. What a revolting thing to believe.

Reply 307

username2324383

I think the problem is the way some people (e.g ISIS) interpret Islam not Islam itself.

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Reply 308

BaconandSauce

Original post by difeo

How about the bits that say apostates should be killed

doesn't say that in the Quran it's in the hadith however the tafsir for verse 5:32 by Umar ibn Kathir implies killing non Muslims is OK as the restriction only applies to muslims.

And in the eyes of Muslims, all non-Muslims who reject Allah and Islam are “spreading corruption”(are thus enemies of Islam and cannot be innocent) and are legitimate targets to be killed. But it does imply (to Muslims) that killing another (innocent) Muslim would be synonymous to killing all mankind. (That, I believe was Muhammad’s intended meaning of that verse.)

Reply 309

BaconandSauce

Original post by samzy21

I think the problem is the way some people (e.g ISIS) interpret Islam not Islam itself.

Posted from TSR Mobile

But if the quran says crucifying people is an acceptable punishment and ISIS crucifies someone how can this be a miss-interpretation of the quran?

Reply 310

Khadijah489

Showing bigotry and prejudice towards the religion is quite sad really. Read up on it more, ask other people instead of assuming

Reply 311

BaconandSauce

Original post by Khadijah489

Showing bigotry and prejudice towards the religion is quite sad really. Read up on it more, ask other people instead of assuming

we are asking and your answers simply confirm what we know already

But nothing wrong with hating a set of ideas and you'll find you are in the minority here as the majority of the world don't believe in Islam

Reply 312

troubadour.

Original post by Khadijah489

Showing bigotry and prejudice towards the religion is quite sad really. Read up on it more, ask other people instead of assuming

No bigotry or prejudice has been shown. Are you going to retract your blundering statements now, or are you going to insist that you were right all along and try to hide behind the classic 'you're being mean/racist/bigoted/prejudiced' dodge?

Reply 313

username1595471

Original post by Khadijah489

Showing bigotry and prejudice towards the religion is quite sad really. Read up on it more, ask other people instead of assuming

You can't show bigotry and prejudice towards a belief system. That's absurd. If someone criticises aspects of Communism or Das Kapital, they're not 'being bigoted towards Communism' or 'prejudiced against Russians' or whatever. Criticising aspects of Islam or the quran is not even remotely the same thing as being prejudiced against Muslims, and the fact that you're trying to conflate them shows that you really don't have an argument here.

Reply 314

difeo

Khadijah is a troll or about 15 years old

Reply 315

username2324383

Original post by Achaea

I'm a Muslim and don't believe that the disbelievers will be punished just because they aren't Muslim. There could be a reason why God allowed there to be different religions. If someone has lived a good honest life then there is no reason for them not to be rewarded after death no matter what their beliefs are or what religion they follow or not follow. At the end of the day it is not for us humans to decide who will be punished or not, it is God's.

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Reply 316

username1595471

Original post by samzy21

I'm glad you believe that. That's a humane belief which I can totally get on board with. I'm pretty sure it's not supported by the Quran and other Islamic scripture though, unfortunately. But good for you.

Reply 317

BaconandSauce

Original post by Achaea

It's almost like she has a script

Reply 318

QE2

Original post by usi227

I'm a Pakistani Muslim and I can say without a doubt that many of the issues the Muslim community comes under fire for such as the "oppression of women" or "condoning of terrorism" are strictly prohibited in The Quran (Holy book).

Could you quote the ayat where "oppressing women" or "condoning terrorism" are strictly prohibited, because I can't remember them.
However, there are verses that permit the beating of disobedient wives (4:34), or the killing of those who refuse to submit to Islam (5:32-33)

A religion that promotes peace and in fact is translated as peace cannot surely encourage the kind of behaviour we are seeing these days.

"Islam" translates a "submission", not "peace".
Groups like ISIS use a literalist and unmodernised interpretation of teh Quran and sunnah, and most of their actions can be justified in this way, starting with concepts like Ibn Kathir's tafsir on 5:33, anyone who "opposes, contradicts or disbelieves", may be "killed, crucified, dismembered or exiled".
Obviously, there are Muslim scholars today who say that this is not what is meant by these passage, but those who believe that the QUran and sunnah are perfect, timeless and universal will insist that it was right the first time round and to try and reinterpret scripture simply to accommodate modern values and morality is an act of bidah.

Nowhere in The Quran does it mention that Muslims must practice in female genitalia mutilation. It is simply a cultural thing.

True, but it is also a practice that is accepted as Islamic by many Muslims, and is often spread and perpetuated by those who believe it to be an Islamic practice.
Consider Indonesia, which has one of the highest rates of FGM in the world. There was no cultural practice of FGM until the arrival of Islam in the 13th century, but now it is commonplace and the country's highest Islamic body called it "morally reccommended" and part of Islamic teaching.
Simply saying, "it is purely cultural and has nothing to do with Islam" is clearly false.