I've already written enough, I'm not going to reiterate my point any further.
Just to address your attacks on mrlittlebigman, Kabolin. I think they are completely out of line, and betray a lot about your insecurities and level of maturity.
I was the one who started this thread, and I'm not middle aged. I'm 28 at the moment, going on 29 - so it's been 10 years since I've taken any interest in what's going on in Pharmacy, just as being young seems to be something you hold in high regard. Hopefully I still qualify.
You don't seem to refute any of the points made about the future of Pharmacy, you'd just rather not hear them, and seemingly especially not from someone with much more experience than you. This is the worst sort of reaction you could have. Every year in Pharmacy is luckier than the year that went before it, you've probably still got 'some time' so long as you're realistic about what your future holds if you stay with community Pharmacy. The people who are really going to be in trouble are the people who are applying this year, the people who will be graduating into the market with 25% less community Pharmacies. They will really see their future whipped away, because it's the next 5 years when things will fall apart.
Kabolin, I don't know where you're doing your pre-reg. I'm going to play the numbers game and bet probably for a large multiple, in community Pharmacy. It wasn't until I started locuming (briefly) that I realised just how sheltered and insulated Pharmacists who work inside these big chains are. Especially now the Drug Tariff is off the pre-reg exam, there seems to be little, if any understanding of how Pharmacy is funded, when for any business this is just as important as the clinical role. You can give out all of the first rate clinical advice you want, but if you're not making any money doing it you wont be giving it out for long. This seems to be completely lost on your average big chain employee, who in my experience doesn't give any thought at all to whether or not any money is actually being made.
These people are probably the fodder that are getting left in the 'profession' - and when the independents start going bankrupt, conveniently all of the community Pharmacists will then be shielded from the nasty, confusing Pharmacy contract and all of the confusing payment....and they too wont have a clue when they're heading right for the iceberg. '6% cuts? I wonder how head office is going to absorb that! Lol'. If you work for a big chain (which I suspect you wont admit to now regardless, but anyway) you really should start trying to investigate how a community Pharmacy makes money. Think about why you are there - it's not for the patient, regardless of what that nice, slick poster in your breakroom says. You are there because a multinational company which has **** all to do with patient care is making money from you being there. If you don't know how much money is being paid for every single act you are doing in the dispensary then find out. What's a practice payment and what does it cover? What's the per item dispensing fee? How much do you get for an MUR? What about a CVD Risk Assessment?
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I'll give you one thing though, Kabolin. Your pointless personal attack did make me smile, because you really do seem to be like a lamb to the slaughter. You criticise the 'moaning' and negativity of 'middle aged' Pharmacists and never stop to wonder why these people are so universally negative and middle aged. I'm not middle aged (yet, although ironically I do now look at university students and their predictable 'pub crawls' and cringey, predictable naievity about life in much the way you seem to view people who are older and more experienced than you! I loved it at the time though, and I thought I was someone special too....) and I have managed to work it out.
They've seen more than us, so they know just how bad it's already got. You know what's the most stark difference between me and Pharmacists twenty years older than me? Just how well off they are. They almost always have a lifestyle that is very likely to be out of the reach of your average community Pharmacist, even extrapolating from how it was when I was there. They were middle class, they lived next to G.Ps and solicitors. Their children went to private school. Many of them owned their own business to do this, but plenty just seemed to have locumed, or managed a store and had a solid salary and bonus each year. If you stay in community Kabolin, you'll be living on a new build estate with a shared driveway, if you're lucky (hopefully your parents are wealthy and they can cushion the fall in your standard of living). These guys have noticed just how poor the prospects today in Pharmacy are, and I agree many of them are just looking to sit out their careers.
Do you know why? They can afford to. It's not that they 'can't handle' this new clinical future that you seem to think they're desperate to avoid. They have spotted how **** the job is becoming, the salaries are falling through the floor, most will still be on old contracts and so have no incentive to move, and they know their pensions are untouchable and are, you're quite right, just waiting to retire. Retire on a pension that will probably equal a salary that you or I will end up working 40 hours a week for!
You don't hear much moaning from this group, not really. Why should you? They've won. mrlittlebigman has won. He was the one being paid double what you were. He went to university for nothing, graduated into a land of affordable housing, and earned the equivalent of double what you'll be starting on. Pharmacy has treated him well, and with the pension he'll leave with (which you'll keep working to pay
) he has got nothing to worry about. He's sitting out the clock, just like I would be. So when you speak to a Pharmacist in their late 40s they tend to not care, they're past caring. They've got the experience to know what's about to happen, they know there are no 'solutions' to this. Most of them are selfish, they don't give a ****. They recognise that you're ****ed certainly, but they're not about to waste energy trying to get you to realise. The fact that MrLBM has actually bothered to point out to you just what an awful career move you are about to make is actually pretty generous of him, all things considered. I was lied to, and deceived, just the same as you were and I got away by the skin of my teeth before the whole thing collapsed. You? You might struggle a bit more (lets see what that starting salary offer is, eh?), MrLBM has won and is about to holiday 6 months of the year. Who's the one who should be moaning about Pharmacy?!
I could go on all night, but it's perfectly clear that you don't want to hear it. That's fine I guess, the multiples need people with their heads in the sand, too proud to leave to a better paying job because 'I'm a professional' whilst turning their nose up at a manager of Aldi...just don't ask where your area manager studied Pharmacy, because he'll probably look at you blankly and then talk about how he started out managing a Carphone Warehouse, before threatening you with a performance review unless you get those 400 MURs done, and you'll do them as well because you're his bitch, and there are thousands of other students getting churned out of university who would do your job for less, you'll just keep eating his **** so long as you have your ridiculous snobbery about being a Pharmacist.
I mean really, a Pharmacist looking down on anyone! You're going to be a shopkeeper! I was a shopkeeper! You just stick the sticker on the boxes all day. Don't delude yourself that you're anything more, and in future a robot will be doing the things that you used to get up and put your tie and shiny trousers on in the morning to do.
Do you know why no one has an 'answers' to this problem? It's because community Pharmacy has had it. We are never going to get paid good money to stick a sticker on boxes, and the 2005 'services' future was based around Pharmacy still being a 'profession' and run in a professional way by people who cared about the future of Pharmacy. Except by then it was run by retail groups who wanted to 'sell' as much of everything, including clinical services which the profession would have to use to justify its future existence. 2005 was the time for solutions, some were proposed, and they failed. We cocked it up. No one has an answers because there's nothing more we can do, except take a massive pay cut. Those who are intelligent, motivated and skilled enough will leave, as they are already doing (I was never a brilliant academic, and I am the last of 10 or so friends I graduated with who went into community to have left) - those who are too scared, or unable to leave will be stuck.
Lastly, I don't know what your family background is, and consequently what you wanted for yourself and your own children when you got older. My parents weren't 'professionals', a Pharmacist in their day would have been way better off, but I grew up in a large detatched house with grounds, in a lifestyle WAY out of reach of a couple of community Pharmacists today. I want my children to have a better quality of life than I did, hence why I got out, and why I am going to continue to move away from that sinking ship. It's possible that you're someone who grew up in a less affluent family, and for you £25k/year is a great salary, and your family would be proud of how you'd done. In which case, good on you! Life is supposed to be about doing better each time.
Just understand that Pharmacists used to be middle class, and so those pursuing it expected a certain lifestyle to accompany their hard work, hopefully a better standard of living than they had experienced growing up. This is something all of us Generation Y'ers are having to come to terms with, but in Pharmacy it'll be a particularly savage blow over the coming 5 years. Still Kabolin, you keep burying your head in the sand and bemoaning anyone who tries to warn others from charging off the same cliff as you. If the Conservatives end up reforming benefits you'll end up meeting that Aldi manager after all, whilst you collect the trolleys in the car park for your JSA
To Mr LittleBigMan- enjoy your retirement! I hope you don't suffer from erectile dysfunction (or vaginal dryness, I suppose you can't assume too much from a screen name), and if you do try not to smirk at Kabolin's Primark trousers as he hands you that bag of Cialis that a robot packed up. Thank you for taking the time to pop in and at least try and add to what I said. I've got no doubt you've seen a lot more than I have in Pharmacy, you've been here 20 years longer than I have and so will have had much better insight as well as experience of back when it actually was a profession. Whilst you've clearly ruffled old Kabolin's feathers, I suspect he doesn't realise what middle age looks like when you've got the sort of income Pharmacy used to afford you, so I suspect his assumptions about you are way short of the mark. Plus I have some sympathy, I was a pre-reg not TOO long ago, and I remember thinking I knew it all, and thinking everyone older than me were dinosaurs holding the profession back. Then after a year or so realised that 'No, they have just been around long enough to know what works, what doesn't and recognise the danger signs'. I think it's universally agreed that the deluded fools who still believe there's a future in 'services' are the real pain in the arse in Pharmacy, fortunately I haven't had to hear a proper Pharmacist say that in a while, just our pre-reg friend here.
To any current, or potential Pharmacy students - I'm not saying DON'T do Pharmacy, but you are almost certainly intelligent enough to do something else. I applied to university attracted by courses which had 'a career path', it seemed sensible at the time. Do something you are passionate about instead. Obviously be realistic, if your passion is shampooing dogs or reading about the history of Welsh feminism then Ok, you should probably grit your teeth through a more traditional degree instead, but if you are considering Pharmacy then studying Chemistry, or Biology or even Pharmacology will open up many more varied and interesting career paths than you will have as a Pharmacy degree (recruiters know what those are, unlike a Pharmacy degree!) and in the future the pay is likely to be even better.
DO NOT FOCUS ON STARTING SALARY. Huge, huge mistake. Even ignoring the plummeting Pharmacist salaries, this was a bad idea. I fell for it. Pharmacist starting salary was, in the past, very good. £40k+ in some cases, 5 years ago. However that's it, odds are if you were good you'd retire on £48k. You'd never go anywhere, whereas the Chemistry graduate who started on £25k ends on £80k, and has flexible working, and a much stressful job. Pharmacy has always caught out the unwary like that, and in the future the starting salary you see today will be completely wrong.
Lastly, if you do decide that a career in Pharmacy is for you, but then realise it's not but you're too far along to change - leave ASAP. It's only getting worse, as I said most recruiters (even within fields you'd assume would be 'close') simply wont know what to make of an MPharm degree. You will struggle to hop out of University into anything else. Try and get a years Pharmacist experience under your belt, take a managerial job if you can handle it it (you wont be able to, but grit your teeth and pull your hair out, just to get 'management' on your CV) and then start trying to take sideways steps in NHS roles. This is likely your only way out.
For those determined to stay in - prepared for a future of £23k/year and fierce competition for that.
Good Luck Guys!