The Student Room Group

Does rape culture exist? (POLL)

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Original post by birdie95
Not of rape, but of rape culture.
As I've already said, rape culture is made up of many different features and is constantly evolving.
And you've just added strength to my point - that is one of the features of rape culture - the belief that if it happens to a man, it is acceptable. I've never said that is acceptable and sexual assault on males is in fact one of the prominent features of today's rape culture because males are facing the same challenges women did back in 1975 - stigmatization, shame, and victim blame.


Rape isn't something that is made up of many different features, it is like saying we live in a murder culture because people punch each other, threaten violence and people say things like you should of just hit them back.
Original post by joecphillips
Rape isn't something that is made up of many different features, it is like saying we live in a murder culture because people punch each other, threaten violence and people say things like you should of just hit them back.


Rape as an act isn't made up of features - but rape as a concept is, and rape culture certainly is. If I was threatened with murder on a nearly daily basis I would most definitely say we live in a murder culture or at least, a violent one. As it is, I've never been threatened with murder nor have I been attacked.
For example, I am threatened with rape on a daily basis when gaming, by really young kids. If I was a man, they wouldn't use this threat. It's worrying that children of the age of 10 think rape is an acceptable threat to use against a woman.
Original post by birdie95
Rape as an act isn't made up of features - but rape as a concept is, and rape culture certainly is. If I was threatened with murder on a nearly daily basis I would most definitely say we live in a murder culture or at least, a violent one. As it is, I've never been threatened with murder nor have I been attacked.
For example, I am threatened with rape on a daily basis when gaming, by really young kids. If I was a man, they wouldn't use this threat. It's worrying that children of the age of 10 think rape is an acceptable threat to use against a woman.


So your argument is a bunch of kids are nasty online.
Do you believe these are credible threats or just kids online trying to act big? When they grow up people realise that stuff isn't accepted.

Latest statistics say there are 33,431 Incidents of rape (police recorded) and overall 99,609 incidents of sexual offences

Compared with 403,957 incidents of violent crime with injury and 480,909 incidents of violent crime without injury.

http://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/bulletins/crimeinenglandandwales/yearendingseptember2015#violent-crime
Original post by joecphillips
So your argument is a bunch of kids are nasty online.
Do you believe these are credible threats or just kids online trying to act big? When they grow up people realise that stuff isn't accepted.

Latest statistics say there are 33,431 Incidents of rape (police recorded) and overall 99,609 incidents of sexual offences

Compared with 403,957 incidents of violent crime with injury and 480,909 incidents of violent crime without injury.

http://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/bulletins/crimeinenglandandwales/yearendingseptember2015#violent-crime


If you're claiming my entire argument is a bunch of kids are nasty online then you're disregarding everything I have said prior?
Does it matter? It's not just kids, it's grown men too. When are they going to grow up? Or are rape threats to be taken lightly, because you know - it's only rape. If someone threatened to murder me online I would certainly say it would be a big deal regardless of age.
1) police recorded is a big factor - many, many rape victims, especially males, never report their assault to police.
2) your argument here is that violent crime (which encompasses a HUGE amount of offences) happens more (or is reported more) therefore, rape isn't a problem.
Original post by birdie95
If you're claiming my entire argument is a bunch of kids are nasty online then you're disregarding everything I have said prior?
Does it matter? It's not just kids, it's grown men too. When are they going to grow up? Or are rape threats to be taken lightly, because you know - it's only rape. If someone threatened to murder me online I would certainly say it would be a big deal regardless of age.
1) police recorded is a big factor - many, many rape victims, especially males, never report their assault to police.
2) your argument here is that violent crime (which encompasses a HUGE amount of offences) happens more (or is reported more) therefore, rape isn't a problem.


I have never said rape isn't a problem, go find somewhere I have said oh rape isn't a problem.

And other victims don't come forward? we can only judge on the available FACTUAL evidence

Are you saying that there is a majority or a sizeable minority who think it is ok? If you think that go actually talk to people.

Have you considered just muting the gobby kids on games who talk like that, I've been threatened online that is what I did.
Original post by birdie95
Who would think of a fetish situation when it clearly isn't mentioned? As someone who does political research using questionnaires with the public, I think the question is about as clear as it could be. There's no suggestion it's anything other than sex.
You seem to be in denial that any male would think non-consensual sex is okay. We know that rape does undeniably happen, so clearly there are people who do agree with that.


Well seeing I'm someone who's also had to collect and analyse sociological data via questionnaires myself, they very fact you would get people responding to the "if a woman says no to sex, is that rape?" in a manner of 'it depends on the situation' would prove it's not quite clear cut. Unless you know the exact manner this study was undertaken you cannot comment in the slightest on the reasoning for their answer.

I highly doubt those 23% literally think it's okay to rape a woman. However with the data provided you can in no way, shape or form suggest a reason for that answer. It's the basic difference between a quantitative and qualitative study that they teach at basic AS level.

At the moment you're making an unsupported statement which has no more relevance than me saying I disagree.

It's the main reason stat dropping without any relevant investigation into the reasons 'why' is highly discouraged.

Am I in denial that some men think it's okay? I don't think anyone bar someone who could be classed as mentally ill could think such a thing is okay. People however still do things they know to be wrong. However what I do get annoyed by is questionable statistics, collected in a bias manner without any form of cross examination being use to demonize an entire gender.
Original post by joecphillips
I have never said rape isn't a problem, go find somewhere I have said oh rape isn't a problem.

And other victims don't come forward? we can only judge on the available FACTUAL evidence

Are you saying that there is a majority or a sizeable minority who think it is ok? If you think that go actually talk to people.

Have you considered just muting the gobby kids on games who talk like that, I've been threatened online that is what I did.


If there are 99,000 incidents of sexual assault then yes of course there must be a minority of people who think it is okay - and that's not including the people who continue to construct a society where bodies are gendered and owned.
Of course I mute abusive players - but muting them doesn't get rid of their views or mean they don't continue to believe that its acceptable. The fact that they are saying those things in the first place is the issue, not how I deal with that fact.
Or of course.. it is my fault for not immediately muting people on games.. unfortunately you can't mute people in the street or in nightclubs or in the safety of your own home who threaten your sexual safety either.
Original post by birdie95
If you're claiming my entire argument is a bunch of kids are nasty online then you're disregarding everything I have said prior?
Does it matter? It's not just kids, it's grown men too. When are they going to grow up? Or are rape threats to be taken lightly, because you know - it's only rape. If someone threatened to murder me online I would certainly say it would be a big deal regardless of age.
1) police recorded is a big factor - many, many rape victims, especially males, never report their assault to police.
2) your argument here is that violent crime (which encompasses a HUGE amount of offences) happens more (or is reported more) therefore, rape isn't a problem.


He's saying we're much more likely to live in a culture of violence and murder than rape culture based merely on the proportions of claimed actions undertaken.

Questioning validity of feminist claims concerning rape does not equal stating rape is not a problem and to be quite honest it's a very obvious diversionary tactic.

The whole idea of a 'rape culture' does not fit into any realistic or current definition of culture. The only way it does is if you then try and change the definition of culture.
Original post by DanB1991
Well seeing I'm someone who's also had to collect and analyse sociological data via questionnaires myself, they very fact you would get people responding to the "if a woman says no to sex, is that rape?" in a manner of 'it depends on the situation' would prove it's not quite clear cut. Unless you know the exact manner this study was undertaken you cannot comment in the slightest on the reasoning for their answer.

I highly doubt those 23% literally think it's okay to rape a woman. However with the data provided you can in no way, shape or form suggest a reason for that answer. It's the basic difference between a quantitative and qualitative study that they teach at basic AS level.

At the moment you're making an unsupported statement which has no more relevance than me saying I disagree.

It's the main reason stat dropping without any relevant investigation into the reasons 'why' is highly discouraged.

Am I in denial that some men think it's okay? I don't think anyone bar someone who could be classed as mentally ill could think such a thing is okay. People however still do things they know to be wrong. However what I do get annoyed by is questionable statistics, collected in a bias manner without any form of cross examination being use to demonize an entire gender.


But the question wasn't 'dependent on the situation'. And that goes to say that any question asked in any questionnaire is irrelevant and can't be used as evidence because, you know, in the respondents head they may have 'added' or elaborated context to the question that was never put there by the researcher.
You find it 'highly unlikely' those 23% of men think rape is okay, does that mean you don't think ANY of those men think it is okay? or half of them?
Original post by birdie95
Absolutely yes
Not just in every day society but especially in the military (particularly the U.S military) where many military staff still think of rape as a tactic/strategy, and not a crime. The invasion of Iraq and the war crimes that occurred there not only show the elements of rape culture that are stagnant within society and military but also the colonial and imperialist undertones of it. Today there was an article about the fact that a Spanish judge asked a rape victim 'if she tried closing her legs'. I think that's pretty strong evidence of the rape culture in Europe and other places today.


If they were to bring back hanging I`d lose no sleep if that judge were to be the first in line. Men/psychopaths with that attitude to the victims of rape don`t even deserve to be considered human.

You don`t even begin to discover how many men think rape is ok by asking them. It does n`t even start there! All my posts are immediately deleted as consequence to my handling the truth. They are deleted by men! Rape is common in marriage - Males, as females, tend to a sexual ownership mindset. The difference is that when males have sex taken from them many try their hardest to take it back. Surveys are useless here, as most of the men that forcefully maintain sexual activity don`t consider it as rape, not even as being genuinely forceful. It`s very common, the female moves beds, but the male follows. Most of the men that "think rape is ok" are likely either unaware of it, that they think this, or otherwise, in denial. The survey would have to be subliminal!

You can find me at www. amazon philosophy/much younger/older partners/friendships/romance.com
As I`ve said, men, likely the enemy, are deleting all of my posts. Bird is with me, but then she`s not male.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by DanB1991
He's saying we're much more likely to live in a culture of violence and murder than rape culture based merely on the proportions of claimed actions undertaken.

Questioning validity of feminist claims concerning rape does not equal stating rape is not a problem and to be quite honest it's a very obvious diversionary tactic.

The whole idea of a 'rape culture' does not fit into any realistic or current definition of culture. The only way it does is if you then try and change the definition of culture.


Quite honestly I think we do have a culture of violence, especially within the media and entertainment industries..
but irregardless, by claiming you have to change the definition of culture to discuss rape culture is rather odd. Does that mean there isn't rape culture in Eastern countries like the others were saying?
Should a theory such as 'new wars' be disregarded because in order to understand it, the definition of war must change?
Original post by birdie95
If there are 99,000 incidents of sexual assault then yes of course there must be a minority of people who think it is okay - and that's not including the people who continue to construct a society where bodies are gendered and owned.
Of course I mute abusive players - but muting them doesn't get rid of their views or mean they don't continue to believe that its acceptable. The fact that they are saying those things in the first place is the issue, not how I deal with that fact.
Or of course.. it is my fault for not immediately muting people on games.. unfortunately you can't mute people in the street or in nightclubs or in the safety of your own home who threaten your sexual safety either.


Of course there is a minority I said sizeable minority, there is a minority of people who deny the holocaust does that mean we have a culture of holocaust deniers.

People are entitled to their views, do you want thought crime laws as well?

You have said they are kids have you never said anything that you now realise was wrong?
When they grow up the majority will realise that they are wrong.

There will always be scumbags who will break the law that is a fact that does not mean that the behaviour is accepted when people come across it
Original post by joecphillips
Of course there is a minority I said sizeable minority, there is a minority of people who deny the holocaust does that mean we have a culture of holocaust deniers.

People are entitled to their views, do you want thought crime laws as well?

You have said they are kids have you never said anything that you now realise was wrong?
When they grow up the majority will realise that they are wrong.

There will always be scumbags who will break the law that is a fact that does not mean that the behaviour is accepted when people come across it


Assaulting people isn't a view! It's a crime. As is threatening people. I have never threatened anyone, no. I've never threatened to commit violence/crime on anyone. And I also said not all of them are kids.
Yet when my housemate was showing people pictures of nudes sent to him, not one guy in a house of six said anything against it. That's a majority to me.
A majority that accepts the fact that other men think of women as own-able, even if they don't agree with it themselves.
Original post by birdie95
If there are 99,000 incidents of sexual assault then yes of course there must be a minority of people who think it is okay - and that's not including the people who continue to construct a society where bodies are gendered and owned.
Of course I mute abusive players - but muting them doesn't get rid of their views or mean they don't continue to believe that its acceptable. The fact that they are saying those things in the first place is the issue, not how I deal with that fact.
Or of course.. it is my fault for not immediately muting people on games.. unfortunately you can't mute people in the street or in nightclubs or in the safety of your own home who threaten your sexual safety either.


:facepalm: So you don't see the hypocrisy here?

You don't understand why such people say such things in the first place. It's offences/threats aimed at an individual with the gender been used to personalise the offence. Not them offending them because of their gender.

Women tend to be offended with charged sexual language, mostly because violence against women by men is seen as worse in many respects worse than rape. By comparison they will tell other men they will have sex with their parents/siblings/relatives, beat them up, kill them etc. Due to homophobia a man will generally not say they will rape another man unless they want to actively play on that individuals own homophobic fears.

People know online abuse is a serious issue, but once again it's hardly a gendered issue. There's also a suggestion of 'open door syndrome', aka women are used to being treated politely (thus opening doors etc) and in person offences in general are much rarer and usually instead aimed at men (even then most abuse is women on women). Online, the consensus is, despite your real life gender and even if the abuser knows your gender, social rules online are genderless. Aka your gender will not decide per se if you receive abuse online or not, more as the actual content. Day to day, men receive similar levels of abuse online, if not slightly more, In real life however men receive drastically higher levels of physical and verbal abuse than women, even if you include rapes/sexual assaults etc.

Also are you also suggesting physical safety is less than a issue than sexual safety?

It's been suggested in studies numerous times stereotypical rapes is often about dominance and control. Just in the same manner assaults between two males or two females is about dominance and control. If you start viewing stereotypical rape as mostly a violent act before sexual then realistically a rape threats are no different in reality to a threat of physical violence.

Then you have the really basic fact online humour is extremely more dark than in real life. Rape and child abuse is about as dark as you can go seeing murder is allowed in mainstream comedy thus it's popularity online.
Original post by DanB1991
:facepalm: So you don't see the hypocrisy here?

You don't understand why such people say such things in the first place. It's offences/threats aimed at an individual with the gender been used to personalise the offence. Not them offending them because of their gender.

Women tend to be offended with charged sexual language, mostly because violence against women by men is seen as worse in many respects worse than rape. By comparison they will tell other men they will have sex with their parents/siblings/relatives, beat them up, kill them etc. Due to homophobia a man will generally not say they will rape another man unless they want to actively play on that individuals own homophobic fears.

People know online abuse is a serious issue, but once again it's hardly a gendered issue. There's also a suggestion of 'open door syndrome', aka women are used to being treated politely (thus opening doors etc) and in person offences in general are much rarer and usually instead aimed at men (even then most abuse is women on women). Online, the consensus is, despite your real life gender and even if the abuser knows your gender, social rules online are genderless. Aka your gender will not decide per se if you receive abuse online or not, more as the actual content. Day to day, men receive similar levels of abuse online, if not slightly more, In real life however men receive drastically higher levels of physical and verbal abuse than women, even if you include rapes/sexual assaults etc.

Also are you also suggesting physical safety is less than a issue than sexual safety?

It's been suggested in studies numerous times stereotypical rapes is often about dominance and control. Just in the same manner assaults between two males or two females is about dominance and control. If you start viewing stereotypical rape as mostly a violent act before sexual then realistically a rape threats are no different in reality to a threat of physical violence.

Then you have the really basic fact online humour is extremely more dark than in real life. Rape and child abuse is about as dark as you can go seeing murder is allowed in mainstream comedy thus it's popularity online.


Men actually receive more abuse online and women are more likely to abuse women online.
http://www.pewinternet.org/2014/10/22/online-harassment/
Original post by joecphillips
Men actually receive more abuse online and women are more likely to abuse women online.
http://www.pewinternet.org/2014/10/22/online-harassment/


Urgh my english in that post is horrific.... so many mistake...time for bed me thinks.
Original post by birdie95
Quite honestly I think we do have a culture of violence, especially within the media and entertainment industries..
but irregardless, by claiming you have to change the definition of culture to discuss rape culture is rather odd. Does that mean there isn't rape culture in Eastern countries like the others were saying?
Should a theory such as 'new wars' be disregarded because in order to understand it, the definition of war must change?


By large I wouldn't say there is a public rape culture in eastern countries. It's still a highly abhorrent crime in those area's, if not more so than in the west. In many eastern countries it's often seen as a crime worse than murder!

However the main difference it how the gauge men and womens guilt concerning the act and women are still seen as property. That means many men, despite opposing rape, still believe it is okay to rape their own 'property'. Even then still the minority commit it and it's extremely questionable to call it a rape culture per se.

By comparison certain parts of africa you could almost certainly agree something resembling a rape culture exists. But then I don't think an in depth study in mens opinions on the matter in africa really exist. The main reason I resist using rape culture in these situations is the sociological examples given to explain rape culture is aimed mostly at the western world. Certain parts of the definition definitely do not fit into eastern or african cultures, for example rape being used as an extreme form of punishment akin to capital punishment would not fit into rape culture.

Original post by birdie95
Yet when my housemate was showing people pictures of nudes sent to him, not one guy in a house of six said anything against it. That's a majority to me.
A majority that accepts the fact that other men think of women as own-able, even if they don't agree with it themselves.


Women do that too you know? Does that mean women think they own the guys body?
(edited 8 years ago)
Reply 177
Not sure if such a culture exists in any part of the world but I am certainly sure it does not exist in the western world.
It exists for fat and ugly females.
(edited 8 years ago)
Reply 179
Original post by birdie95
Assaulting people isn't a view! It's a crime. As is threatening people. I have never threatened anyone, no. I've never threatened to commit violence/crime on anyone. And I also said not all of them are kids.
Yet when my housemate was showing people pictures of nudes sent to him, not one guy in a house of six said anything against it. That's a majority to me.
A majority that accepts the fact that other men think of women as own-able, even if they don't agree with it themselves.


What does your house mate showing people nude pics have to do with rape? Nothing wrong with showing people of mature age adult content. If you don't like it speak up and say you don't want to see it, this has nothing to do with rape.

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