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le religion of peace
How are these guys getting into Europe ? Surely it's easy to notice someone coming from Syria or somewhere at the airports
Original post by Frank Underwood

You should be extremely happy that the vast majority of Muslims are good, tolerant people. Otherwise you'd see dozens of these sorts of attacks every few days.

You expect me to be grateful that not all Muslims are violent extremists that want to kill me?


What kind of warped, cuck-based apologist bs is this.
Original post by OddFuturez
How are these guys getting into Europe ? Surely it's easy to notice someone coming from Syria or somewhere at the airports

Home grown terrorists.


Not much can be done about the Muslims born in Europe that become extremists and hate the west and civilians, sadly.
Original post by OddFuturez
How are these guys getting into Europe ? Surely it's easy to notice someone coming from Syria or somewhere at the airports



Many are "refugees".
Original post by QE2
Wondered how long it would be before someone brought this verse up.
At least you had the honesty to quote it in full. Most Muslims miss out the "unless it be for murder or fasad" bit!
However, you forgot to mention the next verse, which details who may be killed, what for, and how.
"Indeed, the penalty for those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger and strive upon earth to cause corruption is none but that they be killed or crucified or that their hands and feet be cut off from opposite sides or that they be exiled from the land." 5:33

If we consult Ibn Kathir
http://www.alim.org/library/quran/AlQuran-tafsir/TIK/5/32
we see that "wage war" is described as including "opposition, contradiction and disbelief".
He also describes "fasad" as meaning "disbelief and acts of disobedience"
http://www.qtafsir.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=436

So, as we can see, taken in context and with the benefit of exegesis by classical Islamic scholars, that verse actually supports the killing of those who oppose Islam, disbelieve or disobey god's law.

Now, obviously, there will be people who reject the work of such scholars, and form their own interpretations - as they are entitled to do - but it is somewhat naive to claim that such DIY interpretations carry more weight with the Ummah than possibly the most widely used and accepted of all the tafsir.

Dealt with this one already.


Hi there,
I don't follow such a scholar so I can't comment on his interpretations of the Quran
They use Hanbali school of thought in Saudi Arabia and not Ismail Ibn Kathir so solely citing his work is careless.
I need to go now I have Biology work to do but it was nice to hear that you are well educated on one of the more extremer Shafi'i school of thoughts and quoting one scholars perception of Islam.
Thank you

Allah/ God bless you
NK
Original post by Frank Underwood
So basically, you're telling me what we should go around spamming sarcastic and ignorant comments about Islam instead of trying to tackle the divisions within Islam itself?


I have spammed nothing. I have not made an ignorant or sarcastic comment. I made two analogies that I would hope even someone like you could comprehend

You want me to solve the divisions in Islam lmfao.. I am not GOD - I simply want people to understand the truth behind these attacks which is that they would not come about without Islam. Its THAT SIMPLE
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by sunni money
You expect me to be grateful that not all Muslims are violent extremists that want to kill me?


What kind of warped, cuck-based apologist bs is this.


I'm just saying that there are 1.5 billion Muslims on this planet, and evidently the vast majority of them do not want to kill you, otherwise you would have been killed long ago.
Original post by Betelgeuse-
I have spammed nothing. I have not made an ignorant or sarcastic comment. I made two analogies that I would hope even someone like you could comprehend


And now you're resorting to personal insults.

Don't kid yourself, you made two sarcastic comments about Islam which are not helping the situation at all. If anything, it's contributing to the influx of racism which is helping recruit these extremists into terrorists.
Reply 709
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QE2
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Original post by NK18444
Did Hitlers acts have anything to do with Catholicism?
Perhaps a little, but they had far more to do with the ideology in Mein Kampf, which was formed via a number of influences.

Did Myra Hindley and Ian Brady's acts have anything to do with Christianity?
No. But neither of them claimed that they did. :confused:

These inhumane idiots have a warped perception of religion. Terrorism is not Islamic or Christian.
Can't disagree. But that's not really the issue. It is whether their motivation is ideological, and if it is, what is that ideology?
The answer is pretty clear.
Original post by Frank Underwood
I'm just saying that there are 1.5 billion Muslims on this planet, and evidently the vast majority of them do not want to kill you, otherwise you would have been killed long ago.

But a very large proportion hold vile views and a worryingly large number do wish me harm and see me as a legitimate target of 'revenge' because I am a citizen of the West.


The 95% of a group that don't want to kill me is of no respite when the 5% that do are in my neighbourhood (hypothetical numbers).
Original post by sunni money
But a very large proportion hold vile views and a worryingly large number do wish me harm and see me as a legitimate target of revenge because I am a citizen of the West.


The 95% of a group that don't want to kill me is of no respite when the 5% that do are in my neighbourhood (hypothetical numbers).


You're a victim of right-wing scaremongering.
Original post by Frank Underwood
And now you're resorting to personal insults.

Don't kid yourself, you made two sarcastic comments about Islam which are not helping the situation at all. If anything, it's contributing to the influx of racism which is helping recruit these extremists into terrorists.


Wrong on every count yet again. I hope for your sake you are a young kid, 17 or under

Class dismissed
Original post by Onde
Aren't the terrorist attacks endorsed in the quran and carried out by Muhammad sufficient to undermine Islam, in particular the first pillar of Islam?


lmao please explain and I will be happy to assist you?
Original post by sunni money
But a very large proportion hold vile views and a worryingly large number do wish me harm and see me as a legitimate target of 'revenge' because I am a citizen of the West.


The 95% of a group that don't want to kill me is of no respite when the 5% that do are in my neighbourhood (hypothetical numbers).


The people of Afghanistan and Iraq also thought of themselves as targets of the West.

Don't be so dramatic about how you feel like a target. People from 3rd world countries face the threat of terrorism and western intervention right at their doorstep every goddam day , just like you feel like that about isis.
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Original post by Rk2k14
Agree that radicalisation must be tackled and that just because someone refers to himself as the caliph, it is not the view of the rest of the religion.


thats true, historically a caliph had to kill a lot of people before he was recognised as undisputed caliph ( , Mu‘awiyah for example). that is the islamic tradition, IS are very much in keeping with that
Original post by Frank Underwood
You're a victim of right-wing scaremongering.

Wrong.

In a 2007 Pew Research poll in response to a question on whether suicide bombing and other forms of violence against civilian targets to defend Islam could be justified in Europe:

•

(36 vs 64) 64% of Muslims in France believed it could never be justified, 19% believed it could be justified rarely, 10% sometimes, and 6% thought it could be justified often.

•

(30 vs 70) 70% of Muslims in Britain believed it could never be justified, 9% believed it could be justified rarely, 12% sometimes, and 3% thought it could be justified often.

•

(17 vs 83) 83% of Muslims in Germany believed it could never be justified, 6% believed it could be justified rarely, 6% sometimes, and 1% thought it could be justified often.

•

(31 vs 69) 69% of Muslims in Spain believed it could never be justified, 9% believed it could be justified rarely, 10% sometimes, and 6% thought it could be justified often.

In mainly Muslim countries:

•

(55 vs 45) 45% of Muslims in Egypt believed it could never be justified, 25% believed it could be justified rarely, 20% sometimes, and 8% thought it could be justified often.

•

(39 vs 61) 61% of Muslims in Turkey believed it could never be justified, 9% believed it could be justified rarely, 14% sometimes, and 3% thought it could be justified often.

•

(57 vs 43) 43% of Muslims in Jordan believed it could never be justified, 28% believed it could be justified rarely, 24% sometimes, and 5% thought it could be justified often.

•

(72 vs 28) 28% of Muslims in Nigeria believed it could never be justified, 23% believed it could be justified rarely, 38% sometimes, and 8% thought it could be justified often.

•

(31 vs 69) 69% of Muslims in Pakistan believed it could never be justified, 8% believed it could be justified rarely, 7% sometimes, and 7% thought it could be justified often.

•

(29 vs 71) 71% of Muslims in Indonesia believed it could never be justified, 18% believed it could be justified rarely, 8% sometimes, and 2% thought it could be justified often.


It doesn't look like 99.9-0.1% to me, the average in Europe is about 70-30%, and that gets (far) uglier in Muslim countries.
Original post by Betelgeuse-
Wrong on every count yet again. I hope for you're sake you are a young kid, 17 or under


'wrong on every count again' - great explanation, I think you're the under 17 year old here, given that you can't formulate a basic counterargument without insulting me.
Original post by missfats
The people of Afghanistan and Iraq also thought of themselves as targets of the West.

Don't be so dramatic about how you feel like a target. People from 3rd world countries face the threat of terrorism and western intervention right at their doorstep every goddam day , just like you feel like that about isis.
Posted from TSR Mobile


people in 3rd world are at more danger from islamic groups than anyone else. where is there a significant western intervention currently going on?

western interventions are generally required BECAUSE of unchecked islamist groups operating there
Original post by missfats
The people of Afghanistan and Iraq also thought of themselves as targets of the West.

Source?


Not targets of Saddam Hussein's vile dictatorship? Not targets of the Taliban's racism or Islamism?


The West never deliberately targeted/targets civilians. The West intervenes to help civilians abroad, and we get hatred from Taliban-apologists like you for our efforts.


Don't be so dramatic about how you feel like a target. People from 3rd world countries face the threat of terrorism and western intervention right at their doorstep every goddam day , just like you feel like that about isis.

Western intervention is no "threat", it is their only chance of salvation for many civilians in such hell-holes.

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