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Original post by Frank Underwood
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I am not denying anything. You chose to make an inference and I have explained that my post was general. I think I would know the purpose of my own post better than you.

Furthermore, if I had been "caught out" then I would have deleted my post, but I haven't. It's still there for anyone reading this thread to see. The fact you refuse to accept this isn't my problem.
Original post by Plantagenet Crown
I am not denying anything. You chose to make an inference and I have explained that my post was general. I think I would know the purpose of my own post better than you.

Furthermore, if I had been "caught out" then I would have deleted my post, but I haven't. It's still there for anyone reading this thread to see. The fact you refuse to accept this isn't my problem.


Okay, show me one other person, who within 2 pages of your 'general statement' said a) "criticising Islam is criticising its followers" and b) "Islam is peaceful" in the same post.

If you do this, I'll accept my idiocy and I'll walk away admitting you to be correct and that i'm stupid.
Original post by Frank Underwood
Okay, show me one other person, who within 2 pages of your 'general statement' said a) "criticising Islam is criticising its followers" and b) "Islam is peaceful" in the same post.

If you do this, I'll accept my idiocy and I'll walk away admitting you to be correct and that i'm stupid.


But I never said anyone else made this point. What I'm saying is that many people read this thread, probably with the same thought that you have and so a general post is better to get this point across to a wider audience. Especially as your exchanges with other people on here have been largely inflammatory and fruitless meaning most readers are likely to skip over it.

Besides, I have reiterated the point to you in the last few pages or so and you are still not addressing it.
Original post by Plantagenet Crown
But I never said anyone else made this point. What I'm saying is that many people read this thread, probably with the same thought that you have and so a general post is better to get this point across to a wider audience. Especially as your exchanges with other people on here have been largely inflammatory and fruitless meaning most readers are likely to skip over it.

Besides, I have reiterated the point to you in the last few pages or so and you are still not addressing it.


Damn, I guess you can't.

Care to deny it for a sixth time?
Original post by admonit
Now you can open a criminal case against Islam. Should Islam be arrested before the trial? :cool:
Islam is just a name of religion. Sacred scripts are just texts (for non-believers). You cannot blame them and cannot fight them. You can blame and fight only people.
completely wrong

you can criticise Islam and oppose it just like you can criticise and oppose Communism (or Nazism, or Scientology, or, for what matters, Liberalism or Catholicism , or Veganism etc)

ideologies can and should be criticised and blamed, if they advocate behaviour and actions which, in your opinion, would be negative for certain categories of people and for society as a whole

you can fight violent, abhorrent "sacred texts" by exposing them, showing how they can inspire people to commit crimes, even if (and especially so) if you believe there is absolutely no "superior truth" embodied in them

with regard to religions, we could e.g. remember that "most evil persons are capable of committing horrible crimes, but to make good people commit horrible crimes, you need religion"

I would add also "or ideologies" to the above quote. For these reasons, I think that we should all criticise and oppose Islam (at least, until a serious reform is undertaken and completed)

best
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Frank Underwood
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Care to refuse to accept it for the sixth time?
Original post by Plantagenet Crown
Care to refuse to accept it for the sixth time?


So if I make an general post saying "people refuse to accept it when they're wrong six times" out of the blue on this thread, would you honestly think I'm referring to a wider audience?

It's blatant that you were attacking my argument, which I'm fine with, but when you don't even have the courage to quote me directly it is just insulting. Keep your anti-Islamic views out of this place, I wouldn't be surprised if half of the radicalisations in the UK and USA are caused by Islamophobia.
Original post by Frank Underwood
So if I make an general post saying "people refuse to accept it when they're wrong six times" out of the blue on this thread, would you honestly think I'm referring to a wider audience?


False analogy, as that is extremely specific whereas the comment I made is a very commonly spouted claim on TSR, not just by you which is why it's general.

It's blatant that you were attacking my argument, which I'm fine with, but when you don't even have the courage to quote me directly it is just insulting. Keep your anti-Islamic views out of this place, I wouldn't be surprised if half of the radicalisations in the UK and USA are caused by Islamophobia.


It is fine to be anti-Islamic as once again, Islam is an ideology (not a person) that can be attacked and criticised to our hearts' content.

Islamaphobia is a disingenuous term intended to stifle debate and shut people up which is exactly what you're trying to do on this thread, but it won't work. Screaming "you're a bigoted islamaphobe" or some version thereof to anyone who mocks Islam has been done to death and no longer has the taboo effect it once did.
Original post by Frank Underwood
Because I generally ignore complete idiots.

I can't believe I have to spell EVERYTHING out for you dumb people.

Islam is the most discriminated against TODAY, in the PRESENT.

but I can trust one of you idiots to bring up the holocaust like that is still happening


One of the examples I used was a modern day example sweetheart.
Original post by Frank Underwood
You could stop being a pussy and just call me an idiot.
I have reported you several times because of the insults you have repeatedly directed at other posters - "idiot" in particular

So, unfortunately, I am not in a position to call you an "idiot".

Sorry that I will have -albeit grudgingly- to disappoint you

Best
Original post by Plantagenet Crown
False analogy, as that is extremely specific whereas the comment I made is a very commonly spouted claim on TSR, not just by you which is why it's general.



It is fine to be anti-Islamic as once again, Islam is an ideology (not a person) that can be attacked and criticised to our hearts' content.

Islamaphobia is a disingenuous term intended to stifle debate and shut people up which is exactly what you're trying to do on this thread, but it won't work. Screaming "you're a bigoted islamaphobe" or some version thereof to anyone who mocks Islam has been done to death and no longer has the taboo effect it once did.


You're criticising Islam based on the fact that there are extremist interpretations of it, and that it implies that violence is sometimes justified in the defence of Islam.

Why not criticise other religions about this stuff? Others are just as extreme sometimes. The only possible explanation is because of the terror attacks which are committed in the name of Islam.

This directly implies that you would be admitting that you're critical of Islam because of the actions of ISIS. But ISIS does not follow Islam, they follow their own, warped, twisted and evil interpretation of Islam, something entirely different to which 1.5 billion Muslims worldwide subscribe.

So you can admit that the terrorists, who don't even follow the religion correctly, have scared you into criticising Islam, or you can tell me why you find Islam so scary.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by MrsSheldonCooper
One of the examples I used was a modern day example sweetheart.


Okay, let me rephrase my argument. Islam is the most discriminated alongside western culture.
Original post by Frank Underwood
Keep your anti-Islamic views out of this place.
on the contrary

anti-Islamic views are perfectly at their place on TSR, and -I would say- on this thread in particular

Best
Original post by Frank Underwood
Okay, let me rephrase my argument. Islam is the most discriminated alongside western culture.


Because they're both incompatible!

Islam is shockingly backward and many people in the West realise that.
Original post by Hydeman
But I rather like being a cat. I'm so well-looked after. :h:



Well, we are making some progress on the self-awareness front, aren't we? :smile:

I'll do you this favour anyway, because I'm nice: you're a complete* (forgetting your own words -- tsk tsk :wink:) idiot.


Turns out someone (no prizes for guessing :wink: ) reported this post. Didn't know that calling someone an idiot on request was against the rules. Pathetic, if a little amusing coming from somebody who's been abusively ranting against people for the last several pages. :lol:
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by MrsSheldonCooper
Because they're both incompatible!

Islam is shockingly backward and many people in the West realise that.


They're not incompatible, we have been living with peaceful Muslims for decades.

And even if Islam and democracy have contradictory tenets, it doesn't justify hate speech against them, it doesn't justify segregating Muslims, it doesn't even justify fearing Islam. There are so many religions outside of Islam which theoretically should be 'incompatible' with the west based on their teachings, but everyone focuses on Islam. Hinduism, for example, says that killing is justified by the king if he feels that Hinduism is threatened. But you seem to have ignored that, and Christianity has a lot of killing as well, so many religions have equally extreme ideas. But you focus on Islam.

I think it's more to do with the terrorists scaring you into thinking that their extreme interpretation of Islam is what true Islam is.
Original post by Hydeman
Turns out someone (no prizes for guessing :wink: ) reported this post. Didn't know that calling someone an idiot on request was against the rules. Pathetic, if a little amusing coming from somebody who's been abusively ranting against people for the last several pages. :lol:


Trust me, people can get warnings for less.
Original post by Frank Underwood
you can tell me why you find Islam so scary.
OK, once again:

because it advocates violent, unjust behaviour

it advocates killing apostates, adulterers

it allows executing war prisoners, "those who spread corruption in the land"

it allows inhuman physical punishments (cutting off limbs, stoning, crucifixion)

it discriminates against non-Muslims, women, homosexuals

it provides for confusion between religion and State

we could go on and on : Islam's entire political programme and legal framework is abhorrent ; and its moral content is dubious at the best (a life for a life, slavery, sex with slaves, polygamy etc etc)

so, why on Earth should we stop criticising Islam ? no reason at all

best
Original post by Frank Underwood
They're not incompatible, we have been living with peaceful Muslims for decades.

And even if Islam and democracy have contradictory tenets, it doesn't justify hate speech against them, it doesn't justify segregating Muslims,.
and here we go again. Conflating Muslims and Islam

But, who on this thread is advocating to segregate Muslims, or expressing hate against them in general ?

absolutely no one.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Frank Underwood
They're not incompatible, we have been living with peaceful Muslims for decades.

And even if Islam and democracy have contradictory tenets, it doesn't justify hate speech against them, it doesn't justify segregating Muslims, it doesn't even justify fearing Islam. There are so many religions outside of Islam which theoretically should be 'incompatible' with the west based on their teachings, but everyone focuses on Islam. Hinduism, for example, says that killing is justified by the king if he feels that Hinduism is threatened. But you seem to have ignored that, and Christianity has a lot of killing as well, so many religions have equally extreme ideas. But you focus on Islam.

I think it's more to do with the terrorists scaring you into thinking that their extreme interpretation of Islam is what true Islam is.


Does Hinduism call for the stoning of homosexuals and the murder of apostates? I'm a Hindu and I can tell you that the concept of apostasy doesn't exist in Hinduism because it's progressive enough to believe in religious pluralism.

Christianity, fair enough, it does mention certain things like you have mentioned. I'll give you that. There are countries that follow Islam and take some of their rules literally. Look at Saudi Arabia for yourself. Believes atheists to be terrorists, Hindus and Jews to be devil worshippers. Have stoned and whipped people. Have crucified teenagers for speaking about human rights. This is an Islamic country which takes Islam very seriously.


Can you think of a Christian country that does that?

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