Bernie Sanders is a Socialist Marxist; why are people supporting him ?

Sanders was active in the Trotskyist Socialist Workers Party in the 1980's. This was a party that supported the same ideology of Soviet mass murderers, how could he possibly compete in an American general election ?

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/01/30/bernie-s-past-with-the-far-far-far-left.html

http://nypost.com/2016/01/16/dont-be-fooled-by-bernie-sanders-hes-a-diehard-communist/

(edited 8 years ago)

Scroll to see replies

Reply 1

Hasbara Habibi

previously sharing the same ideology as people who did bad things doesn't make him complicit in those bad things

and he is clearly not currently a 'socialist marxist' as your thread title misleadingly states

Reply 2

Frank Underwood

The same extrapolation can associate Trump to Hitler

Spoiler

Reply 3

RarestPepe

Original post by Frank Underwood

The same extrapolation can associate Trump to Hitler

But Sanders was LITERALLY in a Communist party..

Reply 4

Hasbara Habibi

Original post by RarestPepe

But Sanders was LITERALLY in a Communist party..

emphasis on the "was"

Reply 5

Frank Underwood

Original post by RarestPepe

But Sanders was LITERALLY in a Communist party..

I just Googled the party, I can't even find a wikipedia page, let alone something to suggest it is communist.

In my opinion from a skim-read, its the writer trying to discredit Sanders. He has a lot of political experience, which Trump lacks.

Reply 6

ChaoticButterfly

because his socialist ideas are appealing to people

You can argue that Trotyskism would end up just the same as Russia did, or that Trotsky helped create the groundwork for Stalinism but Trotksyist groups were generally opposed to Stalinism, that's the whole point.

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 7

RetiredAccount89

Original post by RarestPepe

I was sperm in a testicle in the 1980s.

People change an awful lot in 30 years.

Reply 8

Aristotle's' Disciple

Division fallacy. Or circumstantial ad hominem? Take your pick, anyway socialist marxism isn't outright communism so don't try and label it so. And what's that got to do with his political stance right now in any case?

Reply 9

Frank Underwood

Original post by RarestPepe

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialist_Workers_Party_(United_States)

Ideology:
Communism
Marxism
Castroism

It's funny that you blindly attack communism like its the enemy, to be honest it's a half-decent idea but in practice it does not work well.

Reply 10

AlmightyJesus

well, I mean, peter hitchens was a trotskyist in the past but now he's definitely not - I wouldn't say somebody was something just because they were in the past.
but he obviously is a socialist.

I mean, I was actually once a member of my local socialist party, but now I'm a right wing libertarian...I'm good proof of a revolution of beliefs

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 11

tengentoppa

His voters probably neither know or care.

In the same way people ignore the fact that Trump used to praise Clinton and say he preferred the Democratic party

In the same way people forget that Clinton used to be opposed to gay marriage

Sanders is currently standing on a social democrat model, which obviously draws traction with the working class, the same source Trump taps into.

Reply 12

mojojojo101

Maybe it's because the alternatives are, for a start, terrible.

Maybe it's because they are sick of big business being able to completely subvert the political process by buying off politicians.

Maybe it's because they would like the US to be a fairer more compassionate place to bring up their children.

Maybe they just don't like the status quo very much.

Either way, it can only be a positive that you can't automatically shut someone out of a debate by going 'WAH, WAH, BUT UR A COMMUNIST THO, U SUPPORT STALIN THO, WHA, WHA'

Reply 13

BenC1997

Original post by RarestPepe

You think Trotskyite groups supported the Stalinist USSR? Read a book.

Reply 14

RarestPepe

Original post by BenC1997

You think Trotskyite groups supported the Stalinist USSR? Read a book.

You should read about the millions of deaths caused by Lenin-Trotsky policies..

Reply 15

BenC1997

Original post by RarestPepe

You should read about the millions of deaths caused by Lenin-Trotsky policies..

I can fully accept that many people have died in Communist states due to their policies, I'm questioning what part Trotsky has to play in this. The USSR was not a Trotskyite state, nor was/is China, Cuba, Vietnam...

Reply 16

KingBradly

Socialism isn't an inherently evil idea. It just invites evil and gives evil people far too much power.

I think Bernie is ok though. I think he's for real and I think he really cares. He's not like Corbyn, a rather puritanical adolescent proud-to-be-humble paradox. Bernie has a real sense of diplomacy. He'd get my vote.

Reply 17

garfeeled

Original post by AlmightyJesus

Is he really. I mean he has out right come out against government ownership of the means of production which leaves left libertarianism and social anarchism. And basically it's not obvious. If he is a genuine socialist of some form he has pulled of the greatest pretence in history in that as far as I can see he has never voted for such policies.

Reply 18

AlmightyJesus

Original post by garfeeled

are you implying that in order for a person to call themselves a socialist, they must support government ownership even while social equality can be secured via other means? government ownership would be a more marxist route towards that goal

Reply 19

VV Cephei A

Naive people jumping on the free stuff bandwagon, they don't particularly care what political philosophy he identifies himself under, as long as they can do less work and get more from others.