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Leaving the EU ruin our special relationship with the USA

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Original post by Venusian Visitor
NATO is outdated anyway. Russia is not a threat.


Its helped keep the peace, ofc Russia is a potential threat with over 300 n nuclear weapons. Ukraine shows its quite willing to interfere in another state an am sure those on the Russian border feel exactly the same.
By ending our special relationship we could be involved in less wars and destabilization of the Middle East?
Original post by Chutzpah
By ending our special relationship we could be involved in less wars and destabilization of the Middle East?


Not really because it wouldnt end. We still have common views, interests and values and would be a US ally whether or not we had joined the EU or not. Foreign policy is something thats ddecided mostly on a national basis. EU policy is mostly on consensus.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by 999tigger
Its helped keep the peace, ofc Russia is a potential threat with over 300 n nuclear weapons. Ukraine shows its quite willing to interfere in another state an am sure those on the Russian border feel exactly the same.


I see you've swallowed the Western media kool-aid. The West has even more nuclear weapons, why are we not a threat to Russia? Russia is being painted as the bad guy just because it has weapons with which to defend itself. How many countries have we invaded compared to Russia? Why is it when Russia does it they are "evil" but when we do it we are "heroes". Russia invaded Ukraine for a reason, ethnic Russians were being mistreated by the pro-Western Ukranian government. The West spun it as a "general invasion of Europe" to scare Baltic states into buying more F-16s. That's what NATO is, a cash cow for the USA. Countries in it have to buy Western military gear so the West profits.
Original post by Venusian Visitor
I see you've swallowed the Western media kool-aid. The West has even more nuclear weapons, why are we not a threat to Russia? Russia is being painted as the bad guy just because it has weapons with which to defend itself. How many countries have we invaded compared to Russia? Why is it when Russia does it they are "evil" but when we do it we are "heroes". Russia invaded Ukraine for a reason, ethnic Russians were being mistreated by the pro-Western Ukranian government. The West spun it as a "general invasion of Europe" to scare Baltic states into buying more F-16s. That's what NATO is, a cash cow for the USA. Countries in it have to buy Western military gear so the West profits.


I never said we werent, the fact is Russia is a threat to us. Nope the Europeans are quite capable of making their own weapons. Russias neighbours are quite used to being invaded and occupied by Russia. Not soemthing you are easily going to forget or do you reimagine history as well?
Original post by 999tigger
I never said we werent, the fact is Russia is a threat to us. Nope the Europeans are quite capable of making their own weapons. Russias neighbours are quite used to being invaded and occupied by Russia. Not soemthing you are easily going to forget or do you reimagine history as well?


The Soviet union occupied Eastern Europe, not the Russian Federation.
Original post by Venusian Visitor
The Soviet union occupied Eastern Europe, not the Russian Federation.


Your point being?
Original post by Ambitious1999
If Britain leaves the EU then the US could fall out with Britain for the first time since the American civil war. It could lead to our expulsion from NATO that would leave Britain exposed to external threats such as terror and force Britain to form a relationship with Russia.

Right, because a pro-Russian nuclear weapon state splitting Europe in two and dominating sea access to it via the Atlantic is probably just what American strategists want.
Original post by 999tigger
Your point being?


Russian Federation is not a threat


Original post by Observatory
Right, because a pro-Russian nuclear weapon state splitting Europe in two and dominating sea access to it via the Atlantic is probably just what American strategists want.

We need to drop this "us vs them" bull. The Russians are being very helpful in fighting ISIS, even France is de-facto allied with them now. They are not that different to us anymore. Only the USA still hates them and insists we play along.
Leaving the EU will just be very awkward thing to do for a UK overall, especially considering the fact that UK will need to join the EEA regardless.
Original post by Venusian Visitor
We need to drop this "us vs them" bull. The Russians are being very helpful in fighting ISIS, even France is de-facto allied with them now. They are not that different to us anymore. Only the USA still hates them and insists we play along.

Fine, but so what? So long as the US sees Russia as a rival - even if it is wrong to do so - pushing Britain into Russia's camp would be a catastrophe for the US.
Original post by Venusian Visitor
Russian Federation is not a threat
We need to drop this "us vs them" bull. The Russians are being very helpful in fighting ISIS, even France is de-facto allied with them now. They are not that different to us anymore. Only the USA still hates them and insists we play along.


No they arent, they are just looking after their own interests(which they quite rightly should do). Just as the EU and the UK can look after its own interests. Its obvious who we have more in common with, who we share a history with, who shares our values.
Obama has already ruined the "special relationship".
if anything it would heighten the special relationship when we have more reason to work with them and not europe if they're going to be left butt-hurt
Original post by The_Opinion
Me. Obama will not even be the President by the time (if) the UK leaves the EU, even his party may not be in charge.

Also, his statement does not pass the first test of if information should be trusted / listened to, the common sense / realistic test. There are so many reasons why what he is saying is utter BS, that I needn't even begin to state them.


Ok. If you say so. So you seem to assume the USA will be begging us to sell our stuff into their country. And presumibly in return we would allow them free access to the UK for American companies? I mean, that is how deals work no? You give something in order to get it.

I really don't know where this idea comes from that the world is begging to trade with the UK. You only need to see how free trade with China has crippled our Steel industry. Is that really the future?
Original post by Venusian Visitor
NATO is outdated anyway. Russia is not a threat.


Try telling that to the Ukraine and other former Soviet states. And then there was the matter of the Malaysian plane myseriously shot down.

Why do you keep wittering on about Russia in EU threads? Start your own thread.
Original post by ByEeek
Ok. If you say so. So you seem to assume the USA will be begging us to sell our stuff into their country. And presumibly in return we would allow them free access to the UK for American companies? I mean, that is how deals work no? You give something in order to get it.

I really don't know where this idea comes from that the world is begging to trade with the UK. You only need to see how free trade with China has crippled our Steel industry. Is that really the future?


You cannot compare US trade with that of China. The US is economically developed unlike China, thus the competition is much fairer. Wen both the UK and US lose company, they move to lesser developed countries, not back and forth between developed nations.

But yet, trade between the US and UK is mutually beneficial, a trade deal would be worked out in no time.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by ByEeek
Try telling that to the Ukraine and other former Soviet states. And then there was the matter of the Malaysian plane myseriously shot down.

Why do you keep wittering on about Russia in EU threads? Start your own thread.


Russia is no threat to the UK. What she does in relation to former Soviet states is a different issue, quite frankly I don't care what happens to them, and neither do most of the people in the UK.
Original post by The_Opinion
Russia is no threat to the UK. What she does in relation to former Soviet states is a different issue, quite frankly I don't care what happens to them, and neither do most of the people in the UK.


Not even if they are members of Nato or they are free democracies?
Original post by 999tigger
Not even if they are members of Nato or they are free democracies?


In a word no. Lets use Brazil as an example (a country both of us probably have no affiliation with), if Russia were to invade Brazil, I am not willing to risk my life, or the lives of my family member and friends to defend Brazil. If you are winning to die, that's your choice, but I would like to ask which family members you would be willing to sacrifice in such a situation? (This last question was if you would chose to defend Brazil).

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