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Original post by Zerforax
I didn't think our pressing was that effective first half tbh - it seemed Sevilla's tactics to play long which we dealt with comfortably. I think there were only a few occasions where we won the ball high up the pitch. Often when we won the ball the ref blew his whistle.


Once we scored the goal, they were rattled and our pressing was far more effective but we didn't capitalise on that. Sevilla's long ball meant we couldn't press properly but as you said we dealt with it well anyway. Second half, we can analyse it all we want but we have to accept that their midfield was better than ours and we just couldn't deal with it. The game today just summed up our season and highlighted issues we already know we have.
(edited 7 years ago)
Of course, tonight is disappointing.

Moreno wasn't good enough all night long - especially the equaliser - but it's concerning that that shift in momentum caused by 20 seconds at the start of the second half led us to completely lose our heads. One goal shouldn't become three goals - but we let it.

And Moreno isn't entirely culpable for that.

Mignolet can do better for the second, but as a whole team, we were outclassed in that second half. In truth, we were outclassed the entire match bar the 25 minute - half time period. Sevilla are ruthlessly efficient, they have a winning mentality, and they have leaders. Coke was exceptional tonight, as too was Ganeiro.

That's what we lack: leaders. Milner will run all night long for you, but in our back line, it's only Toure who I know has what it takes to win. When a 35-year-old, who is likely leaving, is your man mountain at the back, you've got to worry. I thought Lovren showed a shrewdness tonight, and a decent game management in taking that early booking, but he lost his head - along with many others.

In truth, Klopp probably needs an entire new back line - bar Clyne and Lovren. I can't imagine we'll retain Sakho after the lack of professionalism and unreliability he has shown. Moreno hasn't been good enough for some time, but with no European football next season, will he take being a back-up? We've got Smith, Flanagan, Gomez. Ideally, I'd look to get a new left-back - and one who isn't as prone to these kamikaze mistakes.

Can wasn't bad, but he was nowhere near good enough. Coutinho and Firmino were completely anonymous. Sturridge made great runs, took his goal exquisitely, and looks confident heading to the Euros. It's just a shame that goal didn't set the tone for the night - because Sturridge, along with maybe Toure, were the only two who I felt deserved to be on the winning side tonight.

I felt Klopp got his substitutes right, but I question the timing. Origi struggled to impact the game, and ideally, I'd have introduced him later. I wanted Allen - and a sense of control - to be introduced at half-time. Klopp started with a very positive system and formation, but we were overrun for parts of the first-half and I sensed that if Sevilla got a goal the tide would turn.

And turn it did. They completely turned the game on its head, and we allowed ourselves to be swept away by their momentum. That can't happen again.

It's disappointing - not just for our fans and players, but in particular, Klopp and Toure. Once again, they are the nearly men. It's a sad farewell for the latter.

But, two finals with this squad. Klopp hasn't had a summer transfer window yet. His record of cup final wins - just 17% - isn't good enough. You wonder whether that's in his head, and played with his decision making tonight. I'm confident he can lead us to bigger, better things, though. No CL next season is a shame - a real shame - but on we go. We've lost finals before, we'll lose them again. We'll win plenty, too. At least we keep getting there.
Reply 7622
The ref was shocking, these ones from Europe seem to forget that it's a contact sport. Regardless we collapsed in the second half so can't have any complaints. I'm happy with just reaching two finals in Klopp's first season in all honesty, onwards and upwards. At least having no European football next season means we can be competitive in the league.
Reply 7623
Just gonna read the last couple of pages before i sleep, need a good laugh:wink:
Reply 7624
Was not dissapointed:h:
Reply 7625
What the **** was that attempt by Sturridge at the end to try and get on the end of Milner's pass? He either has lost all of his pace (literally all of it) or he just doesn't trust his hamstring at full pelt. Either way, it was pathetic. It's a cup final ffs.

Allen should have been brought on a lot earlier - it was clear the ball was just not sticking about five minutes into the second half. We kept handing it to Sevilla who came with attack after attack. There was nobody in our side who could consistently find a red shirt and it was a matter of time before the second goal came. **** knows what Klopp was thinking.

Moreno should be second choice at best. Toure was fantastic and deserves another year.

Coutinho has bags of talent but he's not consistent enough and is a fairy physically. For our supposedly best player, he was absolutely anonymous, and is too often for my liking. I wouldn't be surprised if Klopp went and gradually revamped our whole front line into a far more robust force.

Fair play to Sevilla, they were by far the better team. But where was the grit and determination we saw against Dortmund in the second half? Losing is one thing, but losing so tamely is even worse.

Gutting to be so close to CL football and now to have nothing. Whichever way you want to dress it up, we put our eggs into one basket and have royally ****ed up. Will Gotze come to a club with no European football? A club that has been consistently mid table for the last 6 or 7 seasons? It's difficult to be optimistic right now.
(edited 7 years ago)
Reply 7626
Original post by samir12
I'm not sure why we weren't as effective pressing as we were in the first half (maybe the long ball tactic backfired on them) but Sevilla passed the ball really well, their second goal was class. We just weren't able string a couple of passes really and resorted to hoofing the ball up.


I feel like a deep lying play maker should be one of our priorities this summer. Except for Allen (who Klopp seemingly doesn't trust) we have nobody who can control the game from the middle. For all of Can's industry, he isn't that player. Nor is Henderson.

Xhaka looks like he would have been perfect, but Arsenal are in there already and I doubt we'd be able to attract him anyway.
Original post by Pn94
Will Gotze come to a club with no European football? A club that has been consistently mid table for the last 6 or 7 seasons? It's difficult to be optimistic right now.


gotze was not going to come to liverpool with or without champions league
bayern is building a winning squad to win CL so i doubt he will leave
Granted, some of the officiating didn't help last night, but they absolutely got the third goal decision correct. It was a shame to see Klopp and our bench behave like they did in the aftermath to that, to be honest. I realise tensions are high though.
Thought the referee was superb yesterday. Webb said he felt the ref got every big decision correct. Not really sure how you can argue against any big decisions really.
Maybe Klopp was reacting like that because he was realising his season was no more successful than Brandans would have been...
Original post by Lúcio
Thoughts on Liverpool winning the Europa League?


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Being 100% serious now, Coutinho is no doubt the most overhyped player in England right now. Absolutely silent all game. How he got nominated for ypoty is absolutely beyond me
Original post by Pn94
What the **** was that attempt by Sturridge at the end to try and get on the end of Milner's pass? He either has lost all of his pace (literally all of it) or he just doesn't trust his hamstring at full pelt. Either way, it was pathetic. It's a cup final ffs.


Don't worry, he'll be gone in the Summer anyway. Klopp doesn't like him or his mentality, and tbh, who would.
I'm not surprised that Sturridge isn't 100% there in terms of his sprinting. It's going to take time considering how long injuries have kept him out. Frankly it might never come back - look at Torres who has had to rethink his game to a degree and worked for some time to get some pace back.

I feel bad for Moreno - yes he has defensive issues but we've known that. Rodgers is more culpable for coming into a new season with Moreno, an untested Gomez and Enrique who was never going to play. Unlucky that Gomez suffered such an injury and Flanagan didn't make it back as originally expected.

However if Moreno isn't on the pitch, we don't score that first goal. The run by Moreno moves the CB across to give Sturridge the gap to score. His attacking contributions (even if not directly regular enough) should not be ignored considering he helps us stretch the pitch. He helps create space for players like Coutinho. You put a defensive player behind Coutinho and Coutinho will look much worse and be less involved - Moreno always gives him an option. Let's not forget that Moreno turns 24 this summer - he's still got a couple of years imo to improve his defensive game. Very few fullbacks can do both attack and defend exceptionally well. There will be 15-25 games next season when we need an attacking fullback rather than a defensive one because teams are sitting deep against us. I'd be looking to rotate between 2 fullbacks - Moreno and someone defensive based on who we are playing.
You lost to Sevilla.
Original post by Zerforax

I feel bad for Moreno - yes he has defensive issues but we've known that.


Same.

It's easy to throw a player under the bus at times like this - and Moreno wouldn't be in my first XI next season if I could help it - but we are, fundamentally, all in this together.

We win together, we lose together. We must never stand still and always look forward. We need to improve, remain optimistic, hopeful. Otherwise what's the point in even following the sport?
Original post by Zerforax
I'm not surprised that Sturridge isn't 100% there in terms of his sprinting. It's going to take time considering how long injuries have kept him out. Frankly it might never come back - look at Torres who has had to rethink his game to a degree and worked for some time to get some pace back.

I feel bad for Moreno - yes he has defensive issues but we've known that. Rodgers is more culpable for coming into a new season with Moreno, an untested Gomez and Enrique who was never going to play. Unlucky that Gomez suffered such an injury and Flanagan didn't make it back as originally expected.

However if Moreno isn't on the pitch, we don't score that first goal. The run by Moreno moves the CB across to give Sturridge the gap to score. His attacking contributions (even if not directly regular enough) should not be ignored considering he helps us stretch the pitch. He helps create space for players like Coutinho. You put a defensive player behind Coutinho and Coutinho will look much worse and be less involved - Moreno always gives him an option. Let's not forget that Moreno turns 24 this summer - he's still got a couple of years imo to improve his defensive game. Very few fullbacks can do both attack and defend exceptionally well. There will be 15-25 games next season when we need an attacking fullback rather than a defensive one because teams are sitting deep against us. I'd be looking to rotate between 2 fullbacks - Moreno and someone defensive based on who we are playing.


We can't wait for a 24 year old fullback to sort out his defensive issues, we are better off playing him as a winger if he can't defend. He should already know how to defend by now, no excuses for that poor headed clearance and getting nutmegged yesterday. I can forgive him being caught high up the pitch because that is what's going to happen when a fullback goes forward but he is capable of other defensive cockups which happens regardless of whether he is high up or defending deep.

I agree with we need to sign another fullback but not sure if we need a defensive one, we could get an attacking one without the defensive errors?
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Mackay
Same.

It's easy to throw a player under the bus at times like this - and Moreno wouldn't be in my first XI next season if I could help it - but we are, fundamentally, all in this together.

We win together, we lose together. We must never stand still and always look forward. We need to improve, remain optimistic, hopeful. Otherwise what's the point in even following the sport?


I'm still a fan of Moreno - he might lose you the odd game but he'll also win you some games. I can't see us getting rid this summer when we're already a LB short but no doubt Klopp and the team will work extensively with him.

Original post by samir12
We can't wait for a 24 year old fullback to sort out his defensive issues, we are better off playing him as a winger if he can't defend. He should already know how to defend by now, no excuses for that poor headed clearance and getting nutmegged yesterday. I can forgive him being caught high up the pitch because that is what's going to happen when a fullback goes forward but he is capable of other defensive cockups which happens regardless of whether he is high up or defending deep.


There were plenty of players who had poor headed clearances yesterday other than Moreno too. I guess that is my point - I don't think you can have just 11-14 players who win you a title on a regular basis (unless you are lucky like Leicester). When you open up to the numbers to 20+ players, are we really saying we'd rather have a defensive fullback instead of Moreno against a side like Bournemouth or Boro at Anfield?
Original post by Zerforax
x


I have got to know that Liverpool lost the final against Sevilla yesterday. What a pitty. I have really crossed my Fingers for that team, firstly I like Klopp as a coach and secondly the third victory by Sevilla in a row gets boring.
Original post by Zerforax
I'm still a fan of Moreno - he might lose you the odd game but he'll also win you some games. I can't see us getting rid this summer when we're already a LB short but no doubt Klopp and the team will work extensively with him.



There were plenty of players who had poor headed clearances yesterday other than Moreno too. I guess that is my point - I don't think you can have just 11-14 players who win you a title on a regular basis (unless you are lucky like Leicester). When you open up to the numbers to 20+ players, are we really saying we'd rather have a defensive fullback instead of Moreno against a side like Bournemouth or Boro at Anfield?


There is a reason why he is singled out a lot, other players don't make those errors as often as he does especially in the big games. We can sign a like for like fullback without those errors to compete with him. Maybe Gomez can be that defensive fullback for the big games? He made errors against United and West Ham but he has shown promise at such a young age and needs time to mature.
(edited 7 years ago)

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