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whom and why do people become ex-muslims?
I'm truly curious to know as to why people are leaving the folds of islam and I would mainly like the views of ex-muslims but others are welcome( sorry for my rudeness.) I myself am a muslim but I would like to see your views on this matter and again I really don't mean to be rude but I've never come across ex-muslims before I only came across an ex-muslim in the RAMADHAN 2016 thread where the person was asking whether or not they were the only one not to fast in Ramadhan when their family is muslim. (something along those lines) so today.your views would really be appreciated. thanks!
(edited 7 years ago)
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You can go on the ex-Muslim thread: http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=3156455
(edited 7 years ago)
I'm not a Muslim but I know a few ex Muslims.
One of them left Islam because she came out as a lesbian to her family and gave up on wearing the hijab so they took her to an imam to be "cured" and when that didn't work, they kicked her out because she went against the Quran and was being haraam. She moved in with her aunt who was pretty chilled out about her being a lesbian but after that experience, my friend left Islam and she very rarely speaks to her family.
It's sad how some ex Muslims get so much hate from their family tbh.
One of them left Islam because she came out as a lesbian to her family and gave up on wearing the hijab so they took her to an imam to be "cured" and when that didn't work, they kicked her out because she went against the Quran and was being haraam. She moved in with her aunt who was pretty chilled out about her being a lesbian but after that experience, my friend left Islam and she very rarely speaks to her family.
It's sad how some ex Muslims get so much hate from their family tbh.
Ex Muslim here.
Read the Quran myself along with many hadith.
To simplify it down it came down to a few different reasons
1. Scientific errors in the Quran as well as explaining our existence and the existence of our university via science. The concept of a deity became more and more easy to reject when you become more educated within science.
2. Morality - How immoral the Quran actually is and how not only hypocritical but how contradicting it is.
3. Looking at Islam from an outside perspective, you will never understand or even be able to acknowledge the faults in Islam if you're looking at it from an insiders prospective. I'm sure you can see all the faults in Christianity or even atheism - as you're critically analysing them with no bias (to some degree).
In short the main reason I left Islam comes down to Islam itself (The Quran) and Science.
I should also mention that I'm Bi.
This actually had little impact on my decision to leave, before I was a very religious person who use to pray and beg to be "fixed". I even swore to myself that If I couldn't get help to cure myself I would live in secret and marry a women ASAP.
Read the Quran myself along with many hadith.
To simplify it down it came down to a few different reasons
1. Scientific errors in the Quran as well as explaining our existence and the existence of our university via science. The concept of a deity became more and more easy to reject when you become more educated within science.
2. Morality - How immoral the Quran actually is and how not only hypocritical but how contradicting it is.
3. Looking at Islam from an outside perspective, you will never understand or even be able to acknowledge the faults in Islam if you're looking at it from an insiders prospective. I'm sure you can see all the faults in Christianity or even atheism - as you're critically analysing them with no bias (to some degree).
In short the main reason I left Islam comes down to Islam itself (The Quran) and Science.
I should also mention that I'm Bi.
This actually had little impact on my decision to leave, before I was a very religious person who use to pray and beg to be "fixed". I even swore to myself that If I couldn't get help to cure myself I would live in secret and marry a women ASAP.
(edited 7 years ago)
Because they don't believe in the Qu'ran's teachings or any of the beliefs. A lot of Western Muslims leave Islam as they feel as if they cannot do anything they want (drinking, having pre martial sex etc) or "having fun." Leaving Islam has big implications, you can say goodbye to your family, to a certain extent, friends and part of your life as you will be cast over with a blind eye and never forgiven for your sins. Being Muslim myself, I'm ashamed that some Muslims go to the extreme of killing their own child for leaving Islam. That is wrong on so many levels.
Original post by offhegoes
Whom?
8/10 for effort, 2/10 for execution.
8/10 for effort, 2/10 for execution.
Execution?
Original post by Sapphire8495
I'm truly curious to know as to why people are leaving the folds of islam and I would mainly like the views of ex-muslims but others are welcome. I myself am a muslim but I would like to see your views on this matter and I really don't mean to be rude but I've never come across ex-muslims before I only came across an ex-muslim in the RAMADHAN 2016 thread where the person was asking whether or not they were the only one not to fast in Ramadhan when their family is muslim. (soething along those lines).your views would really be appreciated. thanks!
Whom: people who no longer adhere to the Muslim ideology.
Why: this is a broader topic. For me personally, I was raised to feel afraid of the consequences of not praying or being a 'bad Muslim'. So I came to associate Islam with negativity and feeling scared.
As a female, I was denied the same freedoms my brother had, simply for the sake of being a 'good Muslim girl'. And so I came to resent religion, and eventually accepted that I simply don't agree with or believe in the principles of Islam.
For others, (and this isn't just exclusive to Islam) seeing the evils of the world, and personal suffering can really make someone reconsider whether or not God exists - if God is omnibenevolent, then surely he wouldn't subject His people to any type of pain or evil? But there is an immense amount of suffering in the world, for no 'good reason', as some religious believers try to argue.
For others, (and this isn't just exclusive to Islam) seeing the evils of the world, and personal suffering can really make someone reconsider whether or not God exists - if God is omnibenevolent, then surely he wouldn't subject His people to any type of pain or evil? But there is an immense amount of suffering in the world, for no 'good reason', as some religious believers try to argue.
I understand completely were your coming from, but I've always been taught at school that this "immense amount of suffering in the world" is to help these people to have a higher status in Paradise
as my teacher said today when I was being told off for shouting "What the hell?" when I got hurt and my teacher said I should be saying allahuakbar or something and that when we get hurt we get more reward
what are your views on this? Personally I was more than a little peed off as it wasn't my fault I hurt myself it was the person sitting next to mes fault who decided to send me flying to the other side of the classroom with a single nudge.
I understand completely were your coming from, but I've always been taught at school that this "immense amount of suffering in the world" is to help these people to have a higher status in Paradise
as my teacher said today when I was being told off for shouting "What the hell?" when I got hurt and my teacher said I should be saying allahuakbar or something and that when we get hurt we get more reward
what are your views on this? Personally I was more than a little peed off as it wasn't my fault I hurt myself it was the person sitting next to mes fault who decided to send me flying to the other side of the classroom with a single nudge.
Original post by Sapphire8495
For others, (and this isn't just exclusive to Islam) seeing the evils of the world, and personal suffering can really make someone reconsider whether or not God exists - if God is omnibenevolent, then surely he wouldn't subject His people to any type of pain or evil? But there is an immense amount of suffering in the world, for no 'good reason', as some religious believers try to argue.
I understand completely were your coming from, but I've always been taught at school that this "immense amount of suffering in the world" is to help these people to have a higher status in Paradise
as my teacher said today when I was being told off for shouting "What the hell?" when I got hurt and my teacher said I should be saying allahuakbar or something and that when we get hurt we get more reward
what are your views on this? Personally I was more than a little peed off as it wasn't my fault I hurt myself it was the person sitting next to mes fault who decided to send me flying to the other side of the classroom with a single nudge.
Well I'd say - what guarantee do we have that we will have a paradise to make up for all our suffering? I think that any reward we will deserve will be given to us within our lifetime. And if God was truly kind why would there be ANY suffering at all?
That seems reasonable - I'd be annoyed too in your situation. Again, I'd say WHY does God want people to be hurt/suffer. If God was 100% good then there would be no rapists, or murderers, or indeed annoying people who touch you and get you into trouble.
.
Although I wouldn't say I'm no longer a Muslim, in the western world so many beliefs in the Quran are dated and hypocritical. I hate how degraded it makes women, or the beliefs on sexuality.
I myself feel like as a female it restricts what I'm "allowed" to do, so it made me quite rebellious and realise these beliefs aren't what are important. I live in a area where there are very few other Muslims, so most of my friends are atheists and am so used to not caring about views. However, there can be racism towards Muslims which I experienced when I first started high school, which I no longer care about.
However, I do like to believe in Allah and heaven, and there come times in my life where when I'm desperate I will pray, and I do Ramadan and fast as I feel I need to for my families sake, but I doubt if there is such as heaven I will go there, as so much of what the Quran says is wrong I have done.
I myself feel like as a female it restricts what I'm "allowed" to do, so it made me quite rebellious and realise these beliefs aren't what are important. I live in a area where there are very few other Muslims, so most of my friends are atheists and am so used to not caring about views. However, there can be racism towards Muslims which I experienced when I first started high school, which I no longer care about.
However, I do like to believe in Allah and heaven, and there come times in my life where when I'm desperate I will pray, and I do Ramadan and fast as I feel I need to for my families sake, but I doubt if there is such as heaven I will go there, as so much of what the Quran says is wrong I have done.
This is my own brief account of apostasy...
"Well to mention just a few thoughts that caused me to doubt and drift me away from Islam; The lack of evidence for many of the absurd and wild claims Islam and Muslim apologists make, evolution/creationism, other flaws in Islamic scripture, questionable, oppressive and harmful rulings/practices and why an omnipotent deity, dispatched his final revelation to all humanity (via a 7th century superstitious and presumably illiterate Arab), in a region/time, with not much of an established culture of producing much written records or widespread literacy, in an antiquated language to which the vast majority of humanity, throughout human history have never been familiar with. A terrible method of communication I believe, unless the author of the Quran was just a mere fallible human, like a certain 7th century Arab, in which case such a method of communication (and content) is understandable, given the cultural contacts, limited abilities and fallibility of humans i.e. 7th century Arabs.
If this, presumably highly intelligent deity, so desires that all humanity acknowledges his existence and proceed for us to worship, then in his omniscience he knows just what it would take to convince every single individual and remove all doubts and in his omnipotence he could easily achieve that and his ideal outcome, for God is not incompetent, limited in his abilities or fallible. Unless of course, "God" is a certain 7th century Arab; in which case it's understandable why such an approach is not taken."
"Well to mention just a few thoughts that caused me to doubt and drift me away from Islam; The lack of evidence for many of the absurd and wild claims Islam and Muslim apologists make, evolution/creationism, other flaws in Islamic scripture, questionable, oppressive and harmful rulings/practices and why an omnipotent deity, dispatched his final revelation to all humanity (via a 7th century superstitious and presumably illiterate Arab), in a region/time, with not much of an established culture of producing much written records or widespread literacy, in an antiquated language to which the vast majority of humanity, throughout human history have never been familiar with. A terrible method of communication I believe, unless the author of the Quran was just a mere fallible human, like a certain 7th century Arab, in which case such a method of communication (and content) is understandable, given the cultural contacts, limited abilities and fallibility of humans i.e. 7th century Arabs.
If this, presumably highly intelligent deity, so desires that all humanity acknowledges his existence and proceed for us to worship, then in his omniscience he knows just what it would take to convince every single individual and remove all doubts and in his omnipotence he could easily achieve that and his ideal outcome, for God is not incompetent, limited in his abilities or fallible. Unless of course, "God" is a certain 7th century Arab; in which case it's understandable why such an approach is not taken."
(edited 7 years ago)
Given you're interested in the causes of apostasy, I would also like to add this.
In concerning apostates, knowing what Islamic scripture states, the common position amongst Muslims (both in the past and today) and the laws of Muslim majority states and the reaction they often produce i.e. ostracism, fines, harassment, imprisonment and at the very extreme, execution - which we are well reminded both by the apologists attempting to justify our persecution and sadly of the unfortunate deaths of rival Muslims, viewed as 'apostates/blasphemers' by ISIS.
Essentially, leaving Islam is not an easy decision, or at least for the overwhelming majority of us apostates. Thus much thought would likely be given to what Islam entails and why one should commit apostasy, before one can consider themselves to have left Islam. Those who leave Islam do so because they value the truth. Leaving Islam is carried out as a result of a long journey to seek the truth concerning the faith.
But expectedly, many Muslim apologists attempt to belittle Apostates and understand apostasy via such fallacious and tiring Ex-Muslim cliches as; "You left to do haram i.e. premarital sex, drugs, alcohol, to party. Family problems, No true muslim fallacy, Corrupted by the west, Yall Christian/Hindu fundamentalists, Self hating brown folks" etc.
(It appears someone was already quick to utilize one such cliche).
This reluctance by many Muslims to admit to their being 'Valid reasons' for apostasy (of which I expect); can be easily explained. Muslims have the presupposition Islam is 'perfect'. This pro-islamic bias, results in them being incapable of admitting to their being 'valid reasons', for apostasy. Why would they indicate Islam is a flawed superstition, by admitting to their being 'valid reasons' for apostasy? Islam to them is perfect. Hence, it's common to hear butthurt, insecure and frustrated Muslim apologists resort to such stereotypes of Apostates as that mentioned earlier.
(Whatever helps a Muslim apologist sleep at night, anything to keep their delusions alive)
In concerning apostates, knowing what Islamic scripture states, the common position amongst Muslims (both in the past and today) and the laws of Muslim majority states and the reaction they often produce i.e. ostracism, fines, harassment, imprisonment and at the very extreme, execution - which we are well reminded both by the apologists attempting to justify our persecution and sadly of the unfortunate deaths of rival Muslims, viewed as 'apostates/blasphemers' by ISIS.
Essentially, leaving Islam is not an easy decision, or at least for the overwhelming majority of us apostates. Thus much thought would likely be given to what Islam entails and why one should commit apostasy, before one can consider themselves to have left Islam. Those who leave Islam do so because they value the truth. Leaving Islam is carried out as a result of a long journey to seek the truth concerning the faith.
But expectedly, many Muslim apologists attempt to belittle Apostates and understand apostasy via such fallacious and tiring Ex-Muslim cliches as; "You left to do haram i.e. premarital sex, drugs, alcohol, to party. Family problems, No true muslim fallacy, Corrupted by the west, Yall Christian/Hindu fundamentalists, Self hating brown folks" etc.
(It appears someone was already quick to utilize one such cliche).
This reluctance by many Muslims to admit to their being 'Valid reasons' for apostasy (of which I expect); can be easily explained. Muslims have the presupposition Islam is 'perfect'. This pro-islamic bias, results in them being incapable of admitting to their being 'valid reasons', for apostasy. Why would they indicate Islam is a flawed superstition, by admitting to their being 'valid reasons' for apostasy? Islam to them is perfect. Hence, it's common to hear butthurt, insecure and frustrated Muslim apologists resort to such stereotypes of Apostates as that mentioned earlier.
(Whatever helps a Muslim apologist sleep at night, anything to keep their delusions alive)
(edited 7 years ago)
I agree with Nimrank. It's similar to Christianity. Identical almost actually. People kept stripping away things from it so they could get on with their lives in our bountiful society and not be held back by belief. It is not at all typical of Christians in this nation as is typical in the common Islamic family. They tend to be more strict, more zealous, heavily practicing, etc. I suspect most Muslims gain more independence if either their family is relaxed, which often isn't the case, or they move out and become independent. Most Christians will simply believe in God, heaven, pray, etc as comfort thoughts and some may have went to church and did stuff, etc because their grandparents made them and so on.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Sapphire8495
I'm truly curious to know as to why people are leaving the folds of islam and I would mainly like the views of ex-muslims but others are welcome( sorry for my rudeness.) I myself am a muslim but I would like to see your views on this matter and again I really don't mean to be rude but I've never come across ex-muslims before I only came across an ex-muslim in the RAMADHAN 2016 thread where the person was asking whether or not they were the only one not to fast in Ramadhan when their family is muslim. (something along those lines) so today.your views would really be appreciated. thanks!
You are only Muslim because your parents were muslims and brought you up in Islam. Had your parents been christians you'd be a christian. You can deny it all you want and claim you'd have converted to Islam immediately but in all probality you wouldn't have.
The Muslims that leave as another person on here said, are able to look at Islam with an unbiased/outside perspective. Not everyone is able to do that.
When it all comes down to it, there are growing number of ex-muslims in the western world. Some Muslims feel restricted by their religion, and feel as if their non religious friends are leaving them behind.
Everyone wants to fit in. When it comes down to it, it's a lack of Imman (Faith) . Well that's what i think.
I as a Muslim never get involved in Arguements about Islam on the Net. I don't know the reason why, but i doubt a few words by me will change the way a person has been living and thinking their whole lives.
People hate Islam because it's different, i accept the fact it's different, and truly believe in it.
I've in tried putting myself in the shoes of the females who think Islam values men over females. I still love and believe in the religion.
People think knowlege gives them a reason to not believe, ask yourself this.
Why are their scienticst who are much smarter and have knowlege which you only wish to achieve, yet they still have faith in their religion? Be it, Jewish, Christian and so on...
The idea of Knowlege>Faith is wrong.
Arrogance, has something to do with it aswell. I don't mean to generalise but i will, lol.
Most ex-muslims are asians, why?
Their parents are Muslims who came from a third world country, and their education was not great.
So the children of those parents gain knowlege with the help of the UK goverment, and they become slightly arrogant and wish to see the world in a different prospective.
The religion which their uneducated parents follow seems less apealing to them as they become more knowlegable. So they find some ******** reason to leave the religion. They all so become restricted and sligtly jealous of the people who have reached their level of education. They feel restricted and want to seem more sophisticated. Not all of them, most of them.
So if you're getting slightly butthurt and are going to try to point out the intentional spelling errors i've made, you fit in this catagory.
I know i'm being aggressive as to the way i'm phrasing my points, i apologise.
Neverthewess, i know of some ex-muslims who did just this.
Well I'd say - what guarantee do we have that we will have a paradise to make up for all our suffering? I think that any reward we will deserve will be given to us within our lifetime. And if God was truly kind why would there be ANY suffering at all?
That seems reasonable - I'd be annoyed too in your situation. Again, I'd say WHY does God want people to be hurt/suffer. If God was 100% good then there would be no rapists, or murderers, or indeed annoying people who touch you and get you into trouble.
.
This is a clear example.
Why is their suffering in the world if God exists?
Suffering is a test. A test which tests your faiths, and makes you question God himself. I don't have immense knowledge about Islam, but what little i know has motivated me more into finding more about Islam. It's a never ending cycle.
If there was no bad in the world, would there be good?
Just because you can't have your rewards in this lifetime, it does not mean you can't have it in the next.
I think of it like this, If God exists i have a chance of going to Heaven, whilst you have 0 chance as you left the religion. And you will be punished for that, which hurts my heart as a fellow human.
On the slim chance that God does not exists, i have missed out on Alcohol. I have lived a structured life...
Will Science punish me for not believing in it?
No
Why take this huge gamble, If you converted to another religion, you would have a higher chance. But most relgions discourage the drinking of alcohol anyways....
You see where i'm coming from. I'm no where near an ideal Muslim, but when i see an acting Muslim, which does not have a care about what others think, at that momment , i wish i could be her/him.
I love my religion, i hate when people disrespect it. It hurts me to the core, yet i don't bother arguing with them as i know that they have their own beliefs and don't fear the consequences of mine.
I am Happy to be a Muslim.
Lol, so many spelling errors. I swear a lot, listen to Music which i know is haram and do many bad deeds on a daily basis.
I just hope my faith becomes stronger.
That's my only concern.
My advice to anyone, don't let anyone influence you on your decisions.
Thank you for reading my only serious post.
Everyone wants to fit in. When it comes down to it, it's a lack of Imman (Faith) . Well that's what i think.
I as a Muslim never get involved in Arguements about Islam on the Net. I don't know the reason why, but i doubt a few words by me will change the way a person has been living and thinking their whole lives.
People hate Islam because it's different, i accept the fact it's different, and truly believe in it.
I've in tried putting myself in the shoes of the females who think Islam values men over females. I still love and believe in the religion.
People think knowlege gives them a reason to not believe, ask yourself this.
Why are their scienticst who are much smarter and have knowlege which you only wish to achieve, yet they still have faith in their religion? Be it, Jewish, Christian and so on...
The idea of Knowlege>Faith is wrong.
Arrogance, has something to do with it aswell. I don't mean to generalise but i will, lol.
Most ex-muslims are asians, why?
Their parents are Muslims who came from a third world country, and their education was not great.
So the children of those parents gain knowlege with the help of the UK goverment, and they become slightly arrogant and wish to see the world in a different prospective.
The religion which their uneducated parents follow seems less apealing to them as they become more knowlegable. So they find some ******** reason to leave the religion. They all so become restricted and sligtly jealous of the people who have reached their level of education. They feel restricted and want to seem more sophisticated. Not all of them, most of them.
So if you're getting slightly butthurt and are going to try to point out the intentional spelling errors i've made, you fit in this catagory.
I know i'm being aggressive as to the way i'm phrasing my points, i apologise.
Neverthewess, i know of some ex-muslims who did just this.
Original post by selvisin
I understand completely were your coming from, but I've always been taught at school that this "immense amount of suffering in the world" is to help these people to have a higher status in Paradise
as my teacher said today when I was being told off for shouting "What the hell?" when I got hurt and my teacher said I should be saying allahuakbar or something and that when we get hurt we get more reward
what are your views on this? Personally I was more than a little peed off as it wasn't my fault I hurt myself it was the person sitting next to mes fault who decided to send me flying to the other side of the classroom with a single nudge.
as my teacher said today when I was being told off for shouting "What the hell?" when I got hurt and my teacher said I should be saying allahuakbar or something and that when we get hurt we get more reward
what are your views on this? Personally I was more than a little peed off as it wasn't my fault I hurt myself it was the person sitting next to mes fault who decided to send me flying to the other side of the classroom with a single nudge.
Well I'd say - what guarantee do we have that we will have a paradise to make up for all our suffering? I think that any reward we will deserve will be given to us within our lifetime. And if God was truly kind why would there be ANY suffering at all?
That seems reasonable - I'd be annoyed too in your situation. Again, I'd say WHY does God want people to be hurt/suffer. If God was 100% good then there would be no rapists, or murderers, or indeed annoying people who touch you and get you into trouble.
.
This is a clear example.
Why is their suffering in the world if God exists?
Suffering is a test. A test which tests your faiths, and makes you question God himself. I don't have immense knowledge about Islam, but what little i know has motivated me more into finding more about Islam. It's a never ending cycle.
If there was no bad in the world, would there be good?
Just because you can't have your rewards in this lifetime, it does not mean you can't have it in the next.
I think of it like this, If God exists i have a chance of going to Heaven, whilst you have 0 chance as you left the religion. And you will be punished for that, which hurts my heart as a fellow human.
On the slim chance that God does not exists, i have missed out on Alcohol. I have lived a structured life...
Will Science punish me for not believing in it?
No
Why take this huge gamble, If you converted to another religion, you would have a higher chance. But most relgions discourage the drinking of alcohol anyways....
You see where i'm coming from. I'm no where near an ideal Muslim, but when i see an acting Muslim, which does not have a care about what others think, at that momment , i wish i could be her/him.
I love my religion, i hate when people disrespect it. It hurts me to the core, yet i don't bother arguing with them as i know that they have their own beliefs and don't fear the consequences of mine.
I am Happy to be a Muslim.
Lol, so many spelling errors. I swear a lot, listen to Music which i know is haram and do many bad deeds on a daily basis.
I just hope my faith becomes stronger.
That's my only concern.
My advice to anyone, don't let anyone influence you on your decisions.
Thank you for reading my only serious post.
Original post by LastMinReviseGuy
When it all comes down to it, there are growing number of ex-muslims in the western world. Some Muslims feel restricted by their religion, and feel as if their non religious friends are leaving them behind.
Everyone wants to fit in. When it comes down to it, it's a lack of Imman (Faith) . Well that's what i think.
I as a Muslim never get involved in Arguements about Islam on the Net. I don't know the reason why, but i doubt a few words by me will change the way a person has been living and thinking their whole lives.
People hate Islam because it's different, i accept the fact it's different, and truly believe in it.
I've in tried putting myself in the shoes of the females who think Islam values men over females. I still love and believe in the religion.
People think knowlege gives them a reason to not believe, ask yourself this.
Why are their scienticst who are much smarter and have knowlege which you only wish to achieve, yet they still have faith in their religion? Be it, Jewish, Christian and so on...
The idea of Knowlege>Faith is wrong.
Arrogance, has something to do with it aswell. I don't mean to generalise but i will, lol.
Most ex-muslims are asians, why?
Their parents are Muslims who came from a third world country, and their education was not great.
So the children of those parents gain knowlege with the help of the UK goverment, and they become slightly arrogant and wish to see the world in a different prospective.
The religion which their uneducated parents follow seems less apealing to them as they become more knowlegable. So they find some ******** reason to leave the religion. They all so become restricted and sligtly jealous of the people who have reached their level of education. They feel restricted and want to seem more sophisticated. Not all of them, most of them.
So if you're getting slightly butthurt and are going to try to point out the intentional spelling errors i've made, you fit in this catagory.
I know i'm being aggressive as to the way i'm phrasing my points, i apologise.
Neverthewess, i know of some ex-muslims who did just this.
Well I'd say - what guarantee do we have that we will have a paradise to make up for all our suffering? I think that any reward we will deserve will be given to us within our lifetime. And if God was truly kind why would there be ANY suffering at all?
That seems reasonable - I'd be annoyed too in your situation. Again, I'd say WHY does God want people to be hurt/suffer. If God was 100% good then there would be no rapists, or murderers, or indeed annoying people who touch you and get you into trouble.
.
Everyone wants to fit in. When it comes down to it, it's a lack of Imman (Faith) . Well that's what i think.
I as a Muslim never get involved in Arguements about Islam on the Net. I don't know the reason why, but i doubt a few words by me will change the way a person has been living and thinking their whole lives.
People hate Islam because it's different, i accept the fact it's different, and truly believe in it.
I've in tried putting myself in the shoes of the females who think Islam values men over females. I still love and believe in the religion.
People think knowlege gives them a reason to not believe, ask yourself this.
Why are their scienticst who are much smarter and have knowlege which you only wish to achieve, yet they still have faith in their religion? Be it, Jewish, Christian and so on...
The idea of Knowlege>Faith is wrong.
Arrogance, has something to do with it aswell. I don't mean to generalise but i will, lol.
Most ex-muslims are asians, why?
Their parents are Muslims who came from a third world country, and their education was not great.
So the children of those parents gain knowlege with the help of the UK goverment, and they become slightly arrogant and wish to see the world in a different prospective.
The religion which their uneducated parents follow seems less apealing to them as they become more knowlegable. So they find some ******** reason to leave the religion. They all so become restricted and sligtly jealous of the people who have reached their level of education. They feel restricted and want to seem more sophisticated. Not all of them, most of them.
So if you're getting slightly butthurt and are going to try to point out the intentional spelling errors i've made, you fit in this catagory.
I know i'm being aggressive as to the way i'm phrasing my points, i apologise.
Neverthewess, i know of some ex-muslims who did just this.
Well I'd say - what guarantee do we have that we will have a paradise to make up for all our suffering? I think that any reward we will deserve will be given to us within our lifetime. And if God was truly kind why would there be ANY suffering at all?
That seems reasonable - I'd be annoyed too in your situation. Again, I'd say WHY does God want people to be hurt/suffer. If God was 100% good then there would be no rapists, or murderers, or indeed annoying people who touch you and get you into trouble.
.
This is a clear example.
Why is their suffering in the world if God exists?
Suffering is a test. A test which tests your faiths, and makes you question God himself.
While I respect your opinion, I think it may surprise you to know that my parents both are qualified to teach Islamic studies, so a lack of knowledge about Islam isn't why I left the religion.
My argument would be why does God need to feel assured as to whether or not humans believe in Him?
Also, what would you say about the children who are starving to death? Or people who get killed in natural disasters. Is God testing them too? It just seems awfully cruel to me.
Original post by selvisin
This is a clear example.
Why is their suffering in the world if God exists?
Suffering is a test. A test which tests your faiths, and makes you question God himself.
While I respect your opinion, I think it may surprise you to know that my parents both are qualified to teach Islamic studies, so a lack of knowledge about Islam isn't why I left the religion.
My argument would be why does God need to feel assured as to whether or not humans believe in Him?
Also, what would you say about the children who are starving to death? Or people who get killed in natural disasters. Is God testing them too? It just seems awfully cruel to me.
Why is their suffering in the world if God exists?
Suffering is a test. A test which tests your faiths, and makes you question God himself.
While I respect your opinion, I think it may surprise you to know that my parents both are qualified to teach Islamic studies, so a lack of knowledge about Islam isn't why I left the religion.
My argument would be why does God need to feel assured as to whether or not humans believe in Him?
Also, what would you say about the children who are starving to death? Or people who get killed in natural disasters. Is God testing them too? It just seems awfully cruel to me.
Oh no, i meant i don't have a lot of knowledge about Islam. Not you.
God is God, god created us and if Gods creation could think on the same level of God, we would all be Gods.
Religion starts from the basis of believing, believeing does not mean you can't question.
Why do we pray? But question God himself, and why he created Humans and animals and this universe would mean we were acting as if we were on the same level of God.
I recall therw being an ayah( a verse from the quran) which discusses this.
''My giving is a word and My punishment is a word. When I want a thing to happen I merely say to it `Be!’ and it is.”)”
This ayah hit me in the heart when i heard it being recited, we don't have the authority to question Allahs existence. We simply believe, FAITH. Allah explains to us and we listen.
When your a child do you ask why your parents why their your parents? No
You simply accept as it is. However, you can question your parents actions, Islam teaches you not to, but most people do.
I know it's a bad analogy and has a lot of flaws, i'm trying to make you understand, not make this a competition of some sort.
Children who suffer a painful death will be sent to heaven, greatest rewards possible. If i was given a choice to die like that, i would choose to. Allah simply has different plans for me.
I know it breaks the heart, when you see children dying. But every child who dies who has not hit puberty goes to heaven, no exception. People who die in natural disasters, you die they die. Death is unavoidable thing, you sound like you detest the concept of death itself. Death and life is a package, they come together. If you have the joy of life, and you have death as a counter fit.
If i walk outside and die because of a heart attack, will you feel as sorry as you would for me as you have for people who died in a natural disaster?
If we all recieved a notice we were going to die, death would not be as scary.
tbh, i fear death as it is right now, i'm not acting how a muslim should.
But if i was practising , i would not fear it.
The people who get cancer and recieve a notice of their approx death , are much better off. I would pray, and pray, and pray and become the best acting Muslim.
You're denying reality as how it is. Hope you place your faith somewhere.
I would never force my views on to anyone, i never usually even bother sharing the correct reasoning of Islam as i think someone else would.
You helped me become more open about my religion, for that i thank you.
Good luck to you.
Original post by LastMinReviseGuy
People think knowlege gives them a reason to not believe, ask yourself this.
Why are their scienticst who are much smarter and have knowlege which you only wish to achieve, yet they still have faith in their religion? Be it, Jewish, Christian and so on...
Why are their scienticst who are much smarter and have knowlege which you only wish to achieve, yet they still have faith in their religion? Be it, Jewish, Christian and so on...
Most are atheist.
Touchy subject.
Best way to summarise it sometimes restricts me on what I want to do
Best way to summarise it sometimes restricts me on what I want to do
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