I think we need to start reconsidering our relationship with ISIS?
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Honestly, though I would like to condone making peace and giving them a second chance; there comes a point when we have to consider sacrificing any chance of immediate peace, for the sake of maintaining peace in the long-term.
Yes, we probably could negotiate with them now. Considering they're in a losing position, they most likely would agree to sit at a negotiating table. However, that would only achieve immediate peace for a short while. Eventually, some former ISIS members would probably decide to restart their revolution; and when they've got direct access to our politicians(while negotiating), they could cause a lot of trouble, and we would just end up having an even worse war.
Yes, we probably could negotiate with them now. Considering they're in a losing position, they most likely would agree to sit at a negotiating table. However, that would only achieve immediate peace for a short while. Eventually, some former ISIS members would probably decide to restart their revolution; and when they've got direct access to our politicians(while negotiating), they could cause a lot of trouble, and we would just end up having an even worse war.
Original post by john2054
i have my ways
Original post by RobML
I say we forge evidence of ISIS members betraying their cause in order that they be destroyed by infighting
This seems to be happening already
They are turning on themselves (as it the way of the savage) and the more seeds of mistrust we can sow the better
Our stand, as of people of logic, reason, intelligence and liberal modernism, should be unyielding, swift and decisive action to end ISIS once for all, with force if necessary.
Religious extremism and violence, just like any other kind of hateful act, shouldn't be tolerated and should be punished in full accordance to values of human rights and secular equality of all. There was a once a man who bragged he was untouchable, who wanted to subjugate a continent in the dark reigns of racism, hate and violence. The reason he failed, the reason he was brought down because people refused to stand down in their darkest hour and fought back.
Thus, when ISIS is concerned - no negotiations, no concessions, no stalling, only immediate and immediate action and justice.
Religious extremism and violence, just like any other kind of hateful act, shouldn't be tolerated and should be punished in full accordance to values of human rights and secular equality of all. There was a once a man who bragged he was untouchable, who wanted to subjugate a continent in the dark reigns of racism, hate and violence. The reason he failed, the reason he was brought down because people refused to stand down in their darkest hour and fought back.
Thus, when ISIS is concerned - no negotiations, no concessions, no stalling, only immediate and immediate action and justice.
Looks like Lord Halifax is back from the dead. 
This is what comes of brainless pacifism.
This is what comes of brainless pacifism.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Mathemagicien
Except that the more the West interferes with ISIS, the more blame we get from the Muslim community, and the more likely we are to have terrorist attacks in the UK.
Kind of a agree but with that community we are dammed if we do and dammed if we don't
We are dammed anyway so may as well be dammed and protected at the same time
Is this your actual oppinion or is this a troll thread?
If not, then this is regressive naivity at its best. Whats next? Lets reconsider our relationship rapists and murderers aswell? (Coincidentally, that also applies to ISIS). With that mentality its no wonder that the West is being dissolved from the inside.
The only relationship we need to reconsider with ISIS is how many Kg of TNT needs to be put on every square meter of ISIS territory.
If not, then this is regressive naivity at its best. Whats next? Lets reconsider our relationship rapists and murderers aswell? (Coincidentally, that also applies to ISIS). With that mentality its no wonder that the West is being dissolved from the inside.
The only relationship we need to reconsider with ISIS is how many Kg of TNT needs to be put on every square meter of ISIS territory.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Mathemagicien
Its questionable whether the existence of ISIS puts us in any more danger. Atm, they are probably too busy fighting Assad to send bombers our way, and they do a good job of getting our terrorists killed, but when ISIS collapses a lot of them will return to Europe.
The inherent danger of accepting an increase in muslim migrants to the west should be obvious to you.
But they are already here and it's only a matter of time before the next atrocity happens.
But I suspect they know they are already bested and are on their way home as we speak.
Original post by john2054
What i mean is that these are people's brothers fathers and sons, and they are now in a losing position. And i am the first to point out that the terrible things they have done, are unacceptable. But they are still human beings, and we need to move on.
A lot of bad things have done, but this is a demographic we have demonized and driven in to a corner. Rather than to continue to hurl bombs and bullets at down, i think now is the time to sit down with the isis high command and negotiate a truce, okay?!?
A lot of bad things have done, but this is a demographic we have demonized and driven in to a corner. Rather than to continue to hurl bombs and bullets at down, i think now is the time to sit down with the isis high command and negotiate a truce, okay?!?
This is the worst attempt at trolling I've ever seen
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by john2054
What i mean is that these are people's brothers fathers and sons, and they are now in a losing position. And i am the first to point out that the terrible things they have done, are unacceptable. But they are still human beings, and we need to move on.
A lot of bad things have done, but this is a demographic we have demonized and driven in to a corner. Rather than to continue to hurl bombs and bullets at down, i think now is the time to sit down with the isis high command and negotiate a truce, okay?!?
A lot of bad things have done, but this is a demographic we have demonized and driven in to a corner. Rather than to continue to hurl bombs and bullets at down, i think now is the time to sit down with the isis high command and negotiate a truce, okay?!?
it is like asking us to reconsider our relationship with herpes.
these scum must be ground under our heels. that is all they deserve.
Original post by john2054
What i mean is that these are people's brothers fathers and sons, and they are now in a losing position. And i am the first to point out that the terrible things they have done, are unacceptable. But they are still human beings, and we need to move on.
A lot of bad things have done, but this is a demographic we have demonized and driven in to a corner. Rather than to continue to hurl bombs and bullets at down, i think now is the time to sit down with the isis high command and negotiate a truce, okay?!?
A lot of bad things have done, but this is a demographic we have demonized and driven in to a corner. Rather than to continue to hurl bombs and bullets at down, i think now is the time to sit down with the isis high command and negotiate a truce, okay?!?
i understand what you're saying. and its a good idea, in theory. unfortunately. isis are no way willing to sit and compromise, what needs to be done is a better iraqi government cos rn it's non-existent.
also the whole sects issue, thats the main reason for so many muslims dying, few weeks ago i saw a video of these men chucking a bomb in a shia mosque filled with women because of hatred and sects. more needs to be done than sitting and having a chat tbh
Sadly, ISIS cannot be bargained with, nor can they be reasoned with. They will not stop until the end. ISIS is to Islam what the KKK is to Christianity. A bunch of vile tyrants who, although making up a tiny proportion of muslims, have so much impact on the perception of Islam worldwide. They will never agree to peace talks. It's a noble gesture, but ultimately a futile one.
another great idea from the left wing communityOriginal post by GiyasU
ISIS is not a military movement in my eyes, its an evil cult, that preaches misconceptions. However they have succeeded in terms of brainwashing people not only by believing their ideology but also about the meaning of jihad. Jihad is not the struggle against non-believers but about the inner struggle of ones sins.
http://islamicsupremecouncil.org/understanding-islam/legal-rulings/5-jihad-a-misunderstood-concept-from-islam.html?start=9
http://islamicsupremecouncil.org/understanding-islam/legal-rulings/5-jihad-a-misunderstood-concept-from-islam.html?start=9
It is good that modernist Islamic movements are attempting to address these issues, but disingenuity and mendacity are not the best approaches.
This explains it more fully that the glib attempt at redefinition you posted.
https://islamqa.info/en/20214
Original post by *Alisha*
They don't represent Islam
You don't approve of theirs, and they probably don't approve of yours.
Original post by QE2
They represent one particular interpretation of Islam. Just as you do.
You don't approve of theirs, and they probably don't approve of yours.
You don't approve of theirs, and they probably don't approve of yours.
We need to negotiate with them as a means to an end. By all means send in the snipers and smart bombs to the locations of the isis vip, to take out the leaders after the negotiations are over. But only then.
For as much as you mostly prepubscent tsr users may love to whack the straw pinata, but whilst there are civilised areas we are carpet bombing, innocents are going to die.
I agree that this isn't the same scale a problem as it has been with iraq and afghanistan, but still the point remains.
Every innocent that dies, from either side is an innocent too many.
I cry everytime i watch those beheading videos, and if you haven't seen one yet, i dare you to google it. just don't then come running back to me with hatred in your eyes.
Because hatred won't solve this problem. We need to feel pity on them. This of them as a deviant. They need our help, not our bullets!?!
This sounds quite similar to Nevile Chamberlain and Winston Churchill. Nevile wanted to reason during WW2 but Winston Churchill did not agree... Without Winston Churchill's convincing speeches on victory for Britain, Winston Churchill wouldn't of been elected to be prime minister and Britain wouldn't be the way it is today.
Just an example of how reasoning isn't the best solution.
Just an example of how reasoning isn't the best solution.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by john2054
We need to negotiate with them as a means to an end. By all means send in the snipers and smart bombs to the locations of the isis vip, to take out the leaders after the negotiations are over. But only then.
For as much as you mostly prepubscent tsr users may love to whack the straw pinata, but whilst there are civilised areas we are carpet bombing, innocents are going to die.
I agree that this isn't the same scale a problem as it has been with iraq and afghanistan, but still the point remains.
Every innocent that dies, from either side is an innocent too many.
I cry everytime i watch those beheading videos, and if you haven't seen one yet, i dare you to google it. just don't then come running back to me with hatred in your eyes.
Because hatred won't solve this problem. We need to feel pity on them. This of them as a deviant. They need our help, not our bullets!?!
For as much as you mostly prepubscent tsr users may love to whack the straw pinata, but whilst there are civilised areas we are carpet bombing, innocents are going to die.
I agree that this isn't the same scale a problem as it has been with iraq and afghanistan, but still the point remains.
Every innocent that dies, from either side is an innocent too many.
I cry everytime i watch those beheading videos, and if you haven't seen one yet, i dare you to google it. just don't then come running back to me with hatred in your eyes.
Because hatred won't solve this problem. We need to feel pity on them. This of them as a deviant. They need our help, not our bullets!?!
Carpet bomb? The Russians have been. The UK couldn't carpet bomb even if it wanted to.
Spoiler
The RAF's Tornado GR4s, Typhoon FGR4s & Reaper RPAS are armed only with precision guided weapons. We don't have enough assets or money to carpet bomb anyone.
Do you know how many civilians have been killed by UK air strikes? Zero.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by john2054
We need to negotiate with them as a means to an end. By all means send in the snipers and smart bombs to the locations of the isis vip, to take out the leaders after the negotiations are over. But only then.
For as much as you mostly prepubscent tsr users may love to whack the straw pinata, but whilst there are civilised areas we are carpet bombing, innocents are going to die.
I agree that this isn't the same scale a problem as it has been with iraq and afghanistan, but still the point remains.
Every innocent that dies, from either side is an innocent too many.
I cry everytime i watch those beheading videos, and if you haven't seen one yet, i dare you to google it. just don't then come running back to me with hatred in your eyes.
Because hatred won't solve this problem. We need to feel pity on them. This of them as a deviant. They need our help, not our bullets!?!
For as much as you mostly prepubscent tsr users may love to whack the straw pinata, but whilst there are civilised areas we are carpet bombing, innocents are going to die.
I agree that this isn't the same scale a problem as it has been with iraq and afghanistan, but still the point remains.
Every innocent that dies, from either side is an innocent too many.
I cry everytime i watch those beheading videos, and if you haven't seen one yet, i dare you to google it. just don't then come running back to me with hatred in your eyes.
Because hatred won't solve this problem. We need to feel pity on them. This of them as a deviant. They need our help, not our bullets!?!
I cry everytime i watch those beheading videos
Original post by john2054
you mostly prepubscent tsr users
Condescension on the basis of an unmeritorious qualification like age isn't going to help make your point, especially when it's false as well as fallacious. A majority of TSR's traffic comes from people that are 25 or older (source).
Every innocent that dies, from either side is an innocent too many.
I cry everytime i watch those beheading videos, and if you haven't seen one yet, i dare you to google it. just don't then come running back to me with hatred in your eyes.
I cry everytime i watch those beheading videos, and if you haven't seen one yet, i dare you to google it. just don't then come running back to me with hatred in your eyes.
So, peace at any price? Appealing to emotion isn't helping your case either.
You clearly have a very poor understanding of ethics if you think that appeasement isn't going to cost more innocent lives in the long run than the current strategy.
Because hatred won't solve this problem. We need to feel pity on them. This of them as a deviant. They need our help, not our bullets!?!
Get real. These aren't people who can be or are willing to be negotiated with; what you are arguing for is technically even more misguided than what your counterparts in the 1930s argued for, since the Nazis were at least willing to negotiate peace.
(edited 7 years ago)
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