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2.2 means you're doomed it seems

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Original post by sadhukar
Dude, you cannot live on 19k in London...


Stop advertising poor positions especially in London. I live in Eastern Europe and there you would get at least 25k a year. But the cost of living is a lot cheaper here so it's the same as 45k at London.

If my country can pay that, the Great Britain can certainly overcome this.
Reply 101
Original post by sadhukar
Dude, you cannot live on 19k in London...


If you live by yourself, 19k is more than enough far more


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Original post by sadhukar
lol

Although I do understand your point; people with degrees from lower unis shouldn't be getting priority over 2:2's from top 5. But rest assured, they aren't! Banks don't consider you at all if you're not top 10.


Bank's aren't the only places to work though. Lots of medium sized firms for example just think a 2.1 from an ex-poly is equal to that of a Russell Group.
Original post by MasterSnake
Bank's aren't the only places to work though. Lots of medium sized firms for example just think a 2.1 from an ex-poly is equal to that of a Russell Group.


Who usually is the middle manager of that medium sized firm? That's right - the guy from an ex-poly. Atleast, most of the time anyway. That's why they remain managers of SME's. You see alot more (and very distinct) institutional discrimination the higher up you climb the companies list. For them, name brand is the easiest and most obvious discriminator against the good and the great.

Which isn't very fair because many people, especially for some reason Europeans, have the notion of "doing what makes me happy" rather than "doing what is best for my future" so you end up with alot of bright kids in lower tier unis whilst all the Asians with their "golden triangle or ivy, else I disown you" parents get in all the good ones.
Reply 104
Original post by freeurmind
A thread full of haters !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :smile:

The system is far from perfect, but it works ..

I chose all the hardest modules in my course because I enjoyed them, others chose to go down the easy route. SO WHAT !! That's the system deal with it.

Everybody knows getting good grades is harder at better uni's and employers know this aswell.

Find me one person with a 1st from london met at a top bank.








Dear Freeurmind,
im sure there are many successful london met graduates. You said that getting good grades is harder at better unis, it could be true or it could also be false but what i can tell you is that as a london met student it is not easy to get good marks. no matter what uni you go to if you want to achieve a high mark you need to work hard. a university is a university regardless of where you decide to go! it has to follow standards and lecturers dont give out first class degrees if you dont deserve one. so if you think that london met students can just walk out with a 1st or 2:1 degree easily than you know absolutely nothing about this university. You asked for one person working for a top bank, Shelley a 2012 london met graduate is now working for Bank of England
http://www.londonmet.ac.uk/news/latest-news/2012/may/career-in-the-bank-for-essex-girl-shelley.cfm
hopefully this answers your question.
Original post by roy19
Dear Freeurmind,
You said that getting good grades is harder at better unis, it could be true or it could also be false


Well if you read the thread, beginning to end it becomes apparent that yes it is true. Getting higher marks at better universities is harder.
Waa waa waa, you're all going to end up in nando's.
Original post by sadhukar
Dude, you cannot live on 19k in London...


Yes you can. My brother lives in London on £18k quite happily. And he travels to Cardiff to see his girlfriend at least once every two weeks. And he's got plenty of money left over.
Original post by SmallTownGirl
Yes you can. My brother lives in London on £18k quite happily. And he travels to Cardiff to see his girlfriend at least once every two weeks. And he's got plenty of money left over.

I lived in london as a student on around £9k/year but it was hard times :tongue:
Original post by roy19
Dear Freeurmind,
im sure there are many successful london met graduates. You said that getting good grades is harder at better unis, it could be true or it could also be false but what i can tell you is that as a london met student it is not easy to get good marks. no matter what uni you go to if you want to achieve a high mark you need to work hard. a university is a university regardless of where you decide to go! it has to follow standards and lecturers dont give out first class degrees if you dont deserve one. so if you think that london met students can just walk out with a 1st or 2:1 degree easily than you know absolutely nothing about this university. You asked for one person working for a top bank, Shelley a 2012 london met graduate is now working for Bank of England
http://www.londonmet.ac.uk/news/latest-news/2012/may/career-in-the-bank-for-essex-girl-shelley.cfm
hopefully this answers your question.


I didnt say going to london met is easy and when I said that about london met students I was generalizing to make a point.

But it definitely is harder to get better grades at uni that is a known fact and its not an opinion.
It may be hard to get good grades at london met, but University College London is harder, and Oxford is harder than both.
Original post by freeurmind
I lived in london as a student on around £9k/year but it was hard times :tongue:


Really? I'm hoping to go london soon and a scholarship means i'll hopefully get 9 +2 = 11k. I though that was loaaaadddds Why didn't you get a job?!?!? Please elaborate, thank you!
Original post by hecandothatfromran
Really? I'm hoping to go london soon and a scholarship means i'll hopefully get 9 +2 = 11k. I though that was loaaaadddds Why didn't you get a job?!?!? Please elaborate, thank you!

I'm exaggerating when I say it was hard, you can live a really good student life with £11k .. But relative to the rich kids, which london is full of, you're poor :biggrin:

I think minimum to live on would be £7k

Also I lived in central (Russell square - so a chunk of my money went on rent)
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by roy19
Dear Freeurmind,
im sure there are many successful london met graduates. You said that getting good grades is harder at better unis, it could be true or it could also be false but what i can tell you is that as a london met student it is not easy to get good marks. no matter what uni you go to if you want to achieve a high mark you need to work hard. a university is a university regardless of where you decide to go! it has to follow standards and lecturers dont give out first class degrees if you dont deserve one. so if you think that london met students can just walk out with a 1st or 2:1 degree easily than you know absolutely nothing about this university. You asked for one person working for a top bank, Shelley a 2012 london met graduate is now working for Bank of England
http://www.londonmet.ac.uk/news/latest-news/2012/may/career-in-the-bank-for-essex-girl-shelley.cfm
hopefully this answers your question.


No offence, but you might not be the brightest spark in the box. My manager went to City University, got a first whilst doing a part time job as a compliance adviser, then went on to Oxford. Also Bank of England is not a top bank, it's a governmental body and the pay is peanuts compared to the real top banks.

Lastly, your link returns a 404.

Original post by SmallTownGirl
Yes you can. My brother lives in London on £18k quite happily. And he travels to Cardiff to see his girlfriend at least once every two weeks. And he's got plenty of money left over.


I guess some people are just more frugal than me xD
Reply 113
Hi all,

I'd thought I'd share my experiences. I got a 2:2 degree was was rejected by many online application sites. It took me a year to find a company who would ask me for an interview.

Yes I believe you are completely screwed if you have a 2:2. Unless you want to poor quality job.
Some people do poorly at exams because they cannot do them well. Period. That results in ****ty grade. However, you have an opportunity to shine. Where are your apps, software you built during university? Truly passionate programmers don't just do coursework and then have fun all the other time. Have you tried applying for every internship after 1, 2 years? Also, there are aspiring programmers who show commitment and get some work at IT firms part-time. If you did not do this and not gained experience then of course no one is going to take you. Add the poor degree and the opportunities are limited.(yet if I were an employer, I would not consider 2:2 or even 3rd as a bad grade. There are phone interviews to filter bad hires. ).

As an example, my close friend graduated from university with low grade because all the time and effort was spent working for a company with experienced guys making top product. Now he's senior developer after two years at the company after university. Is he idiot because his grade is low? No. He saw an opportunity which yielded results. :smile:
I got a job regardless of my 2.2 now =D It's bloody hard but it's possible
That's good, are you happy with it or a short term solution?

Back to the original point, I must be in a minority. I dropped out of university only to return a couple years later, to a university ranked lower. At the time I didn't think it would really make a difference, but I'm sure it does. So what I'm saying is, I went to a lower ranked uni and I would tend to agree with OP.

I am set to graduate with a first, however I do not believe it is on par with a highly ranked computer science university. As someone else mentioned UCAS points are quite frequently used which are probably not going to be a factor for someone attending a higher ranked university. So I would say, **** rolls down hill. My point is, my course had a lot of people who struggled and they were not difficult or bleeding edge modules, their limiting factor will be lack of UCAS points.

Now that doesn't help someone with a 2:2, however, it should allow you to attempt to sell yourself. For example if your course is considerably more difficult you could indicate certain modules and what you produced on your CV, or link to projects on LinkedIn - which is becoming increasingly popular to gain employment.

I'd be surprised if your university did not count against you or help you; there was a time when job applications would state 'Russell group'. More recently I have seen "top 20 red-brick university". So while it may not be used at the initial stages, it may do later.

There are definitely flaws in the entire system, but they've been there for some time and will continue. If you attend a university who has a particularly strict and unforgiving classification system, you may worry about a 2:1. Likewise you could attend a modern university making a name for itself in your field, gain a 2:1 or first, but your lack of UCAS points (which caused you to attend such a university) will also prevent you from gaining employment - to an extent.

Though I only really think a 2:2 is problem for the large graduate schemes where you're competing with students from all across the UK and possibly further.
I'm resurrecting this old long dead thread just to sort of tie up some loose ends. And hopefully give some of you new grads who were in the same position as me; some sort of feedback/advice as how things all turned out.

Feedback
1) It turned out for the better
2) Things turned out arguably for the better - the grades I got didn't allow me to join one of those big sparkly grad schemes. Instead I ended up joining an SME. I stayed there for about a year where I learnt phenomenal amounts. The company was going places, but I really disliked the company culture there. I put my CV (updated with all my new experience) online, only to get a call from one of the software big boys (no names mentioned but they're big and blue). I've since been promoted twice within the org and am doing really well for myself. Salary wise I'm on around double/triple that of what many people who joined the grad schemes with.

Advice
1) Hone in on your soft skills! This is something I took for granted and didn't see as useful. Turns out, they're invaluable especially in IT where the majority of technical people don't possess massive amounts of them. I recommend reading Presentation Zen by Garr Reynolds. This will help you at interviews and when you start your job.

2) Take ANY job related to your field and use it to learn everything you possible can! I mean any job - even if it does sound super mundane and beneath you. As long as you can relate it back to your studies, you're golden. Personally my first job was in Dev ops, it wasn't something I'd ever planned on going into or even a role I really knew existed! But I learnt everything I could about it while I was there. Regularly I was doing 11/12 hours a day just to learn everything I could.

3) The traditional thinking is 'aim for something then do everything you can to do to achieve it'. Although I agree it works, the sad matter of reality is that very few people know what they want to do. Especially when you've scored a 2.2 like I did - you start to question things like whether academia or even IT is the right choice. So my advice to you is to talk to everyone in in every department in the company and really try to grasp what they do. Once you do that you'll find yourself in a far better position to make decisions.

Any new grads in the same position as I was (just missed out on a 2.1 from a Russel Group, and was finding myself not making cut offs) please feel free to shoot me a message.

Original post by beerbaitedballs
That's good, are you happy with it or a short term solution?

Back to the original point, I must be in a minority. I dropped out of university only to return a couple years later, to a university ranked lower. At the time I didn't think it would really make a difference, but I'm sure it does. So what I'm saying is, I went to a lower ranked uni and I would tend to agree with OP.

I am set to graduate with a first, however I do not believe it is on par with a highly ranked computer science university. As someone else mentioned UCAS points are quite frequently used which are probably not going to be a factor for someone attending a higher ranked university. So I would say, **** rolls down hill. My point is, my course had a lot of people who struggled and they were not difficult or bleeding edge modules, their limiting factor will be lack of UCAS points.

Now that doesn't help someone with a 2:2, however, it should allow you to attempt to sell yourself. For example if your course is considerably more difficult you could indicate certain modules and what you produced on your CV, or link to projects on LinkedIn - which is becoming increasingly popular to gain employment.

I'd be surprised if your university did not count against you or help you; there was a time when job applications would state 'Russell group'. More recently I have seen "top 20 red-brick university". So while it may not be used at the initial stages, it may do later.

There are definitely flaws in the entire system, but they've been there for some time and will continue. If you attend a university who has a particularly strict and unforgiving classification system, you may worry about a 2:1. Likewise you could attend a modern university making a name for itself in your field, gain a 2:1 or first, but your lack of UCAS points (which caused you to attend such a university) will also prevent you from gaining employment - to an extent.

Though I only really think a 2:2 is problem for the large graduate schemes where you're competing with students from all across the UK and possibly further.
People on here, who in many cases haven't even been to university, make out a 2.2 is the end of the world. Glad to see some more evidence that this is NOT the case. I know a few people from my uni who ended up with 2.2s and let's run through where they are now 1/2 years after graduating...

- Completed a professional industry qualification to mask his degree result. Now a Financial Analyst in the city earning 35k.
- Graduate Coder for an IT company earning somewhere in the late 20s
- Data analyst for an FMCG company earning 26k

Most graduate schemes require a 2.1 but what people neglect to mention is that hardly anyone gets on a graduate scheme. Lots of other decent quality jobs out there who aren't so fussy on grades.
You're totally right - I mean don't get me wrong. Moment the topic of university grades comes up in the workplace I do quickly become very sheepish.

However it really isn't that bad. I'm now a solutions architect earning in 50k+ bracket.

In a strange way, the 2.2 is an advantage as it forces you to gain a better scope of what's out there instead of doing what I was planning on doing before; which was to simply seen as the best thing to do by my parents and by my friends.

Put it this way, if I'd got a 2.1 I would have most likely ended up at a big tech company as a junior developer. I would have most likely done that for 2 years, not particularly enjoyed it; but endured it. After that I may have just continued on, or I may have shifted positions. Chances are though I wouldn't have learnt anywhere near the amount I've learnt now, nor would I be doing something I love as I am now.

Original post by sr90
People on here, who in many cases haven't even been to university, make out a 2.2 is the end of the world. Glad to see some more evidence that this is NOT the case. I know a few people from my uni who ended up with 2.2s and let's run through where they are now 1/2 years after graduating...

- Completed a professional industry qualification to mask his degree result. Now a Financial Analyst in the city earning 35k.
- Graduate Coder for an IT company earning somewhere in the late 20s
- Data analyst for an FMCG company earning 26k

Most graduate schemes require a 2.1 but what people neglect to mention is that hardly anyone gets on a graduate scheme. Lots of other decent quality jobs out there who aren't so fussy on grades.

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