Criticising Islam and anti-Muslim bigotry...

Actually, the religious institutions of Christianity (and to some extent, Islam) helped preserve knowledge. One might even say the the church is really one of the only reasons intellectualism survived during the middle ages.



You fail to see the relevance of this? Either you're deliberately lying, or just too foolish to see the relevance thereof.

So their refusal or inability to critically think what they are being spoon fed is an excuse?

so, there is no general rule : can we have a precise idea of the exact beliefs that single individual Muslims hold ? yes, at the moment, most of them are peaceful people, who don't seem to embody any particular threat to our society : but how will this evolve in the future, especially when numbers might increase, and with numbers requests and expectations for "special treatment" ?

these are all serious considerations, that we cannot simply dismiss with a whisk of the hand, accusing people of Islamophobia or bigotry. And the concept itself of "bigotry" is, in my view, of very little help

in my view, the only standard can be the law : we are free to dislike, oppose, and even hate whatever and whomever we wish , within the limits of the law

calls to violence or discrimination are of course punishable by existing legislation : and "bigotry" hardly constitutes a workable concept, in this context

best

Until they are aware of the other sides of the argument, yes.
I would not condemn the illiterate goatherd in remote, rural Afghanistan for his intolerant views because he has no sense of context against which to judge it.
But then, am I now displaying the "soft racism of low expectation" that I criticise others for?

It's a bit of a minefield isn't it (inappropriate pun not intended).

We base our laws on our moral values, not the other way around.

our moral values differ widely. Our law is what unites us.

I agree with you, but that is one aspect that is wrong with religion - it is indoctrination. It doesn't encourage people to think outside the box.

while I personally agree, in my view the main problem is that religions claim some sort of special status, which differentiates them from secular ideologies : while, in my view, they are in essence the same, and should be treated in the same way

Our moral conclusions may differ wildly, but our moral axioms do not. Laws do not unite us; one may disagree with laws that one deems unjust.

You're essentially saying hatred for most Muslims is justified on the grounds that they associate with a religion you deem abhorrent. That's anti-Muslim bigotry.

Looks like you've found a way of resolving the turmoil; the OP, and subsequently any distinctions you've made between hatred of Islam vs hatred of followers of Islam is no longer valid.

Having something against Muslims based on the assumption that they believe in all of the things you mentioned above is bigotry for a simple reason and that is: you do not know.

What is the relevance of some aspects of Christianity being good? Especially those that exist outside of it...

What was their motive for preserving it? Why didn't they spread it? Why did they discriminate against women?

So what was the point of this thread in the first place if you think that anti-Muslim bigotry is fine on the basis of "their beliefs", which would not be the same for every Muslim anyway, considering how divided Muslims are with regards to sects and belief systems?

Maybe because the will to act upon the goodness would not be as prevalent without some religion.

Consequentialism doesn't care for motives and intentions. I merely disputed your historically inaccurate assertions about religion being a non-factor in the advancement of sciences.

I already answered this when inhuman asked me the exact same question.

I thought that Islam has nothing to do with race, so you contradict yourself when you call it "soft racism".

Furthermore, am I to automatically assume when I meet a Christian that they believe that Gays are evil and are to be put to death? Or that any Jew I meet believes that gentiles are inferior and can be treated as such? After all, that's what their religious books teach.

Or if I just assume that they are decent human beings (as most people are) and treat them as such, is that "soft racism"? The fact of the matter is that much like the other two faiths, most Muslims have not read the Qur'an. They are told by their imams to pray, fast, be good to their parents and their neighbours and so forth, that's what religion is to them. Or they have memorised it in Arabic but can't understand the language, or they interpret it in such a way that it comes across as much more tolerant than it is in it's original form and without all of the mental linguistics.

Who the hell wants to make fun out of another religion its just not right!!!

Who the hell wants to make fun out of another religion its just not right!!!