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West Midlands Police Considers Allowing The Burka

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Original post by ivybridge
"our side" is what, exactly? My side is the right to wear whatever the **** you want and believe in anything you ****ing want. That's what this country has stood for, for many years now. Don't like it? Sod off out then.
correct

e.g. police officers should be allowed to wander around in the nude while on duty, provided they wear adequate identification

the only problem is : where would they pin their badges ?
Original post by mariachi
correct

e.g. police officers should be allowed to wander around in the nude while on duty, provided they wear adequate identification

the only problem is : where would they pin their badges ?


Not the faintest clue why people compare modest dress, normal clothing, and overly-modest religious dress to nudity. Where even is the comparison? It's nowhere.
Original post by ivybridge
Not the faintest clue why people compare modest dress, normal clothing, and overly-modest religious dress to nudity. Where even is the comparison? It's nowhere.
well, you are for absolute freedom, and defending
Original post by ivybridge
the right to wear whatever the **** you want

so, is wearing just a pair of earrings OK ?

and please, define what constitutes "normal clothing"
Original post by mariachi
well, you are for absolute freedom, and defending
so, is wearing just a pair of earrings OK ?

and please, define what constitutes "normal clothing"


I am not in favour of absolute freedom at all. How does defending the right to wear what you want providing it doesn't cause rational offence or harm, suddenly mean I'm pro-everything? There are limits. It depends on the law and each individual what they see as the limits, however. And I respect that but I don't have to agree with people who have a different opinion on those limits.

In my opinion, no.

Normal clothing - just day-to-day standard attire for the majority, you know, like shirts/t-shirts/skirts/trousers/joggers/shorts/whatever.
Original post by ivybridge
Uh, yes they do, pal. And Muslim terrorism does not equals Muslim. It equals muslim terrorism. By you saying that, you're more or less condemning them either way - they're damned if they do and damned if they don't. You are the problem.

Nope. Muslim terrorism is a product of Islam and Muslim communities. I'm not a part of either of them.
Original post by ivybridge
I am not in favour of absolute freedom at all. How does defending the right to wear what you want providing it doesn't cause rational offence or harm, suddenly mean I'm pro-everything? There are limits. It depends on the law and each individual what they see as the limits, however. And I respect that but I don't have to agree with people who have a different opinion on those limits.

In my opinion, no.

Normal clothing - just day-to-day standard attire for the majority, you know, like shirts/t-shirts/skirts/trousers/joggers/shorts/whatever.
there is no "normal clothing" in the absolute

each specific situation has some sort of dress code, and it can vary hugely (nudist beach/reception at Buckingham Palace.

The law simply tries to apply some sort of common standard : and this evolves with the times and the state of public opinion

for this reason, posting catch phrases and defending

Original post by ivybridge
the right to wear whatever the **** you want
means nothing at all

people have fought wars about clothing rules. Especially when clothes indicate belonging to some group, they may be a political as well as a religious statement

we cannot ignore those aspects : and the devil, as usual, is in the detail
Original post by ivybridge
This is literally the most draining debate - it's like talking to a brick wall
please, feel free to take advantage of the wonderful late-summer weather

best
Original post by ivybridge
So being a muslim instantly means = terrorism? Right, grow the **** up and get some basic education. That's not how it works. If anybody's to blame for the rise of Islamic extremist terrorism, it's the West, and our actions in the Middle East.


Surely the blame for Islamic terrorism lies on Islam? Without Islam, there would be no Islamic terrorism.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Trapz99
Surely the blame for Islamic terrorism lies on Islam?


by this logic, we should blame christians for the KKK
Original post by ivybridge
If anybody's to blame for the rise of Islamic extremist terrorism, it's the West, and our actions in the Middle East.
so, it's not the terrorists who are to blame, it's the "West". Understood.

yes, do enjoy the sunshine.
Original post by Trapz99
Surely the blame for Islamic terrorism lies on Islam? Without Islam, there would be no Islamic terrorism.


No. Not entirely. It's about the fact it's terrorism. Not Islamic. the IRA and many other organisations caused much higher rates of devastation in the world than any Islamic group to date. But nobody ever whinges about the religion, skin colour, or origin of those groups and they pleasantly forget the statistics.

Original post by mariachi
so, it's not the terrorists who are to blame, it's the "West". Understood.

yes, do enjoy the sunshine.


"blame for the RISE of Islamic EXTREMIST TERRORISM".
Reply 71
Original post by mariachi
so, it's not the terrorists who are to blame, it's the "West". Understood.

yes, do enjoy the sunshine.

He is like a Jew defending Nazis.
Original post by ivybridge

"blame for the RISE of Islamic EXTREMIST TERRORISM".
understood

we Westerners are to blame only for the "RISE of Islamic EXTREMIST TERRORISM", while Islam is to blame for its "normal" level and qualities

thanks for the specification
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by ivybridge
My best friend is a practising muslim... so is his family... I have never been accepted with more love and respect in my life other than by my boyfriend's family.

It wasn't muslims refusing to stand in solidarity with the Orlando LGBT community after the attacks - it was far-right extremists and Christian pastors.


There were Christian pastors that stood in solidarity with the victims and there were others that did not. There were Muslims who stood in solidarity with the victims and also some Muslims who did not. So I don't see why you're trying to suggest that Muslims somehow cared more than Christians about the Islamic terror attack in Orlando.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Josb
He is like a Jew defending Nazis.


This, there is no better example than what this user and people of similar ilk do.
Original post by ivybridge
No. Not entirely. It's about the fact it's terrorism. Not Islamic. the IRA and many other organisations caused much higher rates of devastation in the world than any Islamic group to date. But nobody ever whinges about the religion, skin colour, or origin of those groups and they pleasantly forget the statistics.



Source?
Original post by mariachi
understood

we Westerners are to blame only for the "RISE of Islamic EXTREMIST TERRORISM", while Islam is to blame for its "normal" level and qualities

thanks for the specification


You are actually thick, like, it's not even funny how poor your literary comprehension is.

Original post by Trapz99
There were Christian pastors that so good in solidarity with the he victims and there were others that weren't. There were Muslims who stood in solidarity with the victims and also some Muslims who did not. So I don't see why you're trying to suggest that Muslims somehow cared more than Chrsitians about the Islamic terror attack in Orlando.


Christian Churches did not come out and openly support the victims whereas the leading Imam of the local Muslim community in Orlando made a speech and offered support to the whole LGBT community. They took steps to SHOW their support, and to SHOW that the one guy, who was US born and bred by the way, does not represent the genuine Muslim community. That was so incredibly important and yes of course, some supported, some didn't, but it was Christian pastors and and organisations that harmed the community, that abused the victims. Pastors saying "Orlando is safer because a few paedophiles have been killed by the Lord and it's just a shame he didn't finish the job", and Churches picketing the funerals of victims.

I'm not suggesting they did more, I'm suggesting, because it's how it was, that the local Islamic community actually stood up and shouted their support and made it known. The Christian community did not.
Original post by Trapz99
Source?


[video]https://www.facebook.com/ThisIsZinc/videos/526501877550483/[/video]

Just one that presents the stats.
Original post by ivybridge
You are actually thick, like, it's not even funny how poor your literary comprehension is..
this is a very interesting point

it vastly adds to the arsenal of your impressive arguments

best
Original post by ivybridge
You are actually thick, like, it's not even funny how poor your literary comprehension is.



Christian Churches did not come out and openly support the victims whereas the leading Imam of the local Muslim community in Orlando made a speech and offered support to the whole LGBT community. They took steps to SHOW their support, and to SHOW that the one guy, who was US born and bred by the way, does not represent the genuine Muslim community. That was so incredibly important and yes of course, some supported, some didn't, but it was Christian pastors and and organisations that harmed the community, that abused the victims. Pastors saying "Orlando is safer because a few paedophiles have been killed by the Lord and it's just a shame he didn't finish the job", and Churches picketing the funerals of victims.

I'm not suggesting they did more, I'm suggesting, because it's how it was, that the local Islamic community actually stood up and shouted their support and made it known. The Christian community did not.


The Muslim community obviously should do that since a supposedly Muslim man carried out the attack and therefore they should distance themselves from that. Since a Christian did not carry out this attack, the churches did not really have a huge responsibility to say or do anything.

Many Christian pastors across America did criticise the attacks and stood firm in their belief that gays should not be killed. Many churches offered free funerals for the dead.

https://www.churchtimes.co.uk/articles/2016/17-june/news/world/religious-leaders-unite-in-horror-at-orlando-massacre

http://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/us/2016/june/orlando-churches-condemn-attack-offer-sympathy-to-victims

Of course there were pastors at praised the attack, but many pastors did not and instead offered sympathy to the victims and prayed for them.
(edited 7 years ago)

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