Stop with the "who created God" argument it's bloody horrendous.

exactly, you both just disproved urself. because i was just trying to say the Big bang couldn't be the eternal first cause.

Occam's razor is probably appropriate to apply to this discussion, seeing as it has deviated from the original title.

Basically, the universe is here, it makes sense, as does the Big Bang in terms of bringing it about. There's a myriad of evidence to back this up. Adding a god into the equation though, is making the situation more complex than it needs to be, and thus he is probably not real.

This is veering off my point, but as an aside, I like to think that as primates - seeing as primates have hierarchical structures - we manufactured gods to place above us and give us a hierarchal structure.

Those are just my thoughts on the matter anyway.


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Occam's razor is probably appropriate to apply to this discussion, seeing as it has deviated from the original title.

Basically, the universe is here, it makes sense, as does the Big Bang in terms of bringing it about. There's a myriad of evidence to back this up. Adding a god into the equation though, is making the situation more complex than it needs to be, and thus he is probably not real.

This is veering off my point, but as an aside, I like to think that as primates - seeing as primates have hierarchical structures - we manufactured gods to place above us and give us a hierarchal structure.

Those are just my thoughts on the matter anyway.

If things require a creator in order to exist, then a creator also requires a creator.

that nothing at all would come to existence.

No disproval happened. Universe exists, god doesn't. Therefore, big bang is the eternal first cause. FTW!

Yeah, just leave, we know you flopped.

To be eternal is to be outside of time so to say the Big Bang has always been happening makes no sense or to say the Big Bang exists outside of time also makes no sense seeing as the theory was intended to prove the universe had a beginning (from God).

You have failed harder than a hard thing that's hard.

The prophet 'Richard Dawkins' has shown that the 'Flying Spaghetti Monster' is the cause of everything. It exists 'outside of the outside of time. Even god doesn't exist there.

As is stated in Levitrius 17a: 91q: "Am god an ah doan exist. Ya no am sayin?"

Idk how that relates to you saying the 'Big Bang' is the 'Eternal first cause' when it can't be. Whereas, God can be.

All you did was just spout some rubbish AGAIN because you couldn't back up yourself so you resort to LAME, OLD and really CRAPPY Pastafarian jokes because you love ridiculing and talking so much about a concept you don't even believe in...

hmmmmmmmmmmm

But...but...i've already proven that god can't be the eternal first cause because he only exists outside of time. The big bang can exist outside of the outside of time. That means god can't be the eternal first cause.

What you're regurgitating is just a new type of, "Tide goes in, tide goes out. Can't explain that!"

??? What?

All I am saying is that the Big Bang can't BE THE ETERNAL FIRST CAUSE which is was you said, simple. What are even talking about? The tide meme or what you're saying is rubbish/has nothing to do with it.

I never said just because the Big Bang isn't the eternal first cause it means that God is... You're just embarrassing yourself really..

??? What?
As I already disproved what you said, I don't even see what you're going on about. YOU WERE WRONG. You said 'Why can't the Big Bang be the Eternal first cause?' and I proved you wrong. It's fairly simple.

To be eternal is to exist outside of time. How can the Big Bang have always have been happening? - that makes no sense. ...........

I just believe it is God.

You're very sad indeed.

As already said by many atheists, the Big Bang shows how the universe formed not actually started.

To be eternal is to exist outside of time. How can the Big Bang have always have been happening? - that makes no sense. Just stop. You keep strawmanning but said before, you're only embarrassing yourself.

I never said because the Big Bang isnt the cause, it automatically means that God must be it. I just believe it is God. Stop strawmanning then using old and bad memes (that yes I have seen) just because you don't know what you're talking about.

Then you're talking to the wrong atheists. Even the Pope agrees that the big bang is how the universe started. He just believes god caused the big bang (which is a discussion for another topic).

You keep trying to push certain ideas without understanding what they mean: outside of time, strawmanning. You have no idea what any of these phrases mean.

You don't understand the Big Bang, clearly. But you do understand your own pseudo scientific "outside of time" malarkey?!?! I suppose it is easier to understand your own made up pseudo science than it is to understand peer reviewed science.

You people of faith have had your time. When you people were in charge we had the dark ages, burning witches, persecution of scientists.

You are of course free to believe in fairy tales but like I said, people of science will continue to advance human understanding while the old "God did it, innit" lot continue to try and hold us back.

The Big Bang theory is still the best explanation for the beginning of the universe. All you have to do is provide a repeatable, testable, valid experiment to add weight to your claims, otherwise you'll keep repeating "Um, err, god exists outside of time" and i'll repeat, "Well the big bang exists outside of the outside of time".

Big Bang 1 : god 0

God is one and only one possible explanation.

There are things we know.
There are things we know we do not know.
There are things we do not know that we don't know.

Invoking God as an explanation simply cuts off all other avenues of possibility.

The consequence is to stick fingers in both ears and say 'la lal la I'm not listening'.

Then you're talking to the wrong atheists. Even the Pope agrees that the big bang is how the universe started. He just believes god caused the big bang (which is a discussion for another topic).

You keep trying to push certain ideas without understanding what they mean: outside of time, strawmanning. You have no idea what any of these phrases mean.

You don't understand the Big Bang, clearly. But you do understand your own pseudo scientific "outside of time" malarkey?!?! I suppose it is easier to understand your own made up pseudo science than it is to understand peer reviewed science.

You people of faith have had your time. When you people were in charge we had the dark ages, burning witches, persecution of scientists.

You are of course free to believe in fairy tales but like I said, people of science will continue to advance human understanding while the old "God did it, innit" lot continue to try and hold us back.

The Big Bang theory is still the best explanation for the beginning of the universe. All you have to do is provide a repeatable, testable, valid experiment to add weight to your claims, otherwise you'll keep repeating "Um, err, god exists outside of time" and i'll repeat, "Well the big bang exists outside of the outside of time".

Big Bang 1 : god 0

If the Big bang exists outside of the time, then it never happened. It is physical so you're just wasting your time because God does exist outside of time.

The definition of eternity, isn't pseudoscience, it's just physics - eternity isn't a lot of time, it's existing outside of time. But even if it isn't and it is a lot of time, that still makes sense for God but NEVER and it CAN'T make sense for the Big Bang.

You really don't understand what eternal first cause means, how can the Big bang be eternal or exist outside of time?

If you're criticising someone for holding the belief, why do you think hypocrisy makes you look any better? You really just look like a fool that can't accept you got proven wrong.

You asked 'Why can't the Big Bang be the eternal first cause?' and as said, I proved you wrong

You know nothing of your own logic which simply contradicts itself. In terms of science, the Big Bang is to the beginning of the universe what evolution is to abiogenesis.