Hard brexit here we come!
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Original post by Davij038
Now we can:
Abolish Tarriffs
Slash Corporation tax
Stop wasting money on areas outside the South East (and foreign aid)
Massively Cut immigration.
Leave the ECHR
Make JR Mogg Governor of the Bank of England
Leave NATO and forge a partnership with Trump and Putin
Scrap all H&S regulation
Scrap maternity pay
Outlaw unions
Bring back Death penalty
Compulsory National Service
Knight Nigel Farage
Spend £59 million on a royal yacht
Scrap the BBC Nationalise the Daily Mail
Cut welfare and force claimants to do hard manual labour
Give our police guns
...
And other common sense measures
Abolish Tarriffs
Slash Corporation tax
Stop wasting money on areas outside the South East (and foreign aid)
Massively Cut immigration.
Leave the ECHR
Make JR Mogg Governor of the Bank of England
Leave NATO and forge a partnership with Trump and Putin
Scrap all H&S regulation
Scrap maternity pay
Outlaw unions
Bring back Death penalty
Compulsory National Service
Knight Nigel Farage
Spend £59 million on a royal yacht
Scrap the BBC Nationalise the Daily Mail
Cut welfare and force claimants to do hard manual labour
Give our police guns
...
And other common sense measures
Original post by Jammy Duel
Is that like the severe suffering of the last 6 months?
No, your currency collapsing and your main industry planning relocations was just the warm-up before Brexit actually happens.
Original post by NickLCFC
Wow.
This level of Anglophobia is simply unacceptable in 2017.
This level of Anglophobia is simply unacceptable in 2017.
Calling you lot out for the evident nationalism, arrogance, xenopobia, and unfeelingness isn't Anglophobia, it's an easy and factual observation to make for Europe and the rest of the world. Now you're reaping what you sow.
Original post by TitanicTeutonicPhil
Calling you lot out for the evident nationalism, arrogance, xenopobia, and unfeelingness isn't Anglophobia, it's an easy and factual observation to make for Europe and the rest of the world. Now you're reaping what you sow.
What are you basing those allegations on? All I've seen so far as you having a major chip on your shoulder. And FYI, I'm sure I speak for most Leavers when I say that I'm quite fond of Europe, and want the European people to flourish without the EU yoking them down.
Original post by astutehirstute
Yes you do help your brothers. They didn't want to take in all those Muslims, so you get to have them all! Marvellous.
Wait till later this year and you get to take another million!
Can you say Freedom of Movement? Can you say, Common European Border?
Can you say Wilkommen another million Muslim (not rapey at all) men?
Wait till later this year and you get to take another million!
Can you say Freedom of Movement? Can you say, Common European Border?
Can you say Wilkommen another million Muslim (not rapey at all) men?
Ah, another deplorable islamophobe!
Yeah, we took in (close to) a million Muslims, and will take in more. Because we're good people, not cynical nationalists. And because our country can actually take the load, unlike yours.
The fact that you bring up rape shows how uneducated you are about the topic (and probably academically too), so do stfu before I need to embarrass you any more.
Original post by jape
What are you basing those allegations on?
A majority of the British population voting to leave the EU following a campaign run purely on nationalism and xenophobia. Your most-read newspapers perpetuating hostility towards the EU, Europe, and immigrants. Having lived in and visited the UK many times. Comments on TSR.
Did you know that the UK is the only country in the world to have a 'banter' culture? All you're doing is putting each other down 'for fun'. That really speaks volumes about the climate and general sentiment in your society. Hostility, dog-eat-dog, us-against-them. Disgusting. Most languages don't even have an equivalent of 'banter'. Why would you want to tease and put down others, let alone your friends, for no reason? Why do you feel the need to put yourself above others? Phantom limb pains of a lost empire?
Original post by jape
And FYI, I'm sure I speak for most Leavers when I say that I'm quite fond of Europe, and want the European people to flourish without the EU yoking them down.
You don't. You really don't. Have you spoken to other Leavers?
The EU isn't yoking anyone down. It's to everyone's benefit, and you very soon will wish you were still in it.
This thread is hilarious
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Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by midnightice
Over 90% of businesses in the UK do not export to the EU, yet they are bound by all of its regulation. 10 years ago the UK exported over 50% of its goods and services to the EU, now it's 44% and on a constant downward path. It makes no sense to apply all EU regulation to our entire domestic economy if our trade is increasingly elsewhere in the world.
Since when was 42% of exports a small number? The US is only 18% and comes with a whole set of regulations. So if we create our own, that is yet another cost to business.
So are you suggesting we abandon EU rules on quality and safety and start producing cheap crap? Most EU regulation is good for consumers (us). It stops us being exploited by businesses.
Which regulations in particular offend you so much? I have yet to here a red tape protagonist like you name one.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Davij038
Wow, yes exactly. Hence Vote Leave generally being a waste of time. Glad you got there eventually.
So because a lot of things that aren't government policy and most people don't want can be done in the EU it makes it a waste to leave the EU so we can do the things that people actually want us to do?
Posted from TSR Mobile
It strikes me May is heading for the same trap Cameron found himself in.
She had originally planned a Brexit white paper. That could have discussed what we could realistically obtain and number crunch some consequences of this.
May has now rejected this in favour of a "motherhood and apple pie" speech with no attempt to manage expectations on the part of the public.
May may say that "no deal is better than a bad deal" but in the real world no politician ever comes back empty-handed. Either a deal is made or talks will continue. Saying you are unable to make a deal, is tantamount to an invitation to be replaced by someone else who promises he or she will get a deal.
When the eventual deal is published, people are going to work out what the deal means for them. There is going to be a groundswell of opposition from a lot of different groups who are not going to see this as an opportunity but rather as a threat. That opposition is going to be focussed.
Whether May thinks she can pitch this on the basis of "this deal or WTO rules", but surely the other EU states are not going to play that game. They are surely going to say that it is not too late to call the whole thing off. It is one of the unwritten rules of the EU club, occasionally broken, that EU members do not interfere in the politics of other member states. Particularly with the example of Putin in front of them, EU leaders are surely not going to give May the opportunity to "spin" the deal as she wants.
She had originally planned a Brexit white paper. That could have discussed what we could realistically obtain and number crunch some consequences of this.
May has now rejected this in favour of a "motherhood and apple pie" speech with no attempt to manage expectations on the part of the public.
May may say that "no deal is better than a bad deal" but in the real world no politician ever comes back empty-handed. Either a deal is made or talks will continue. Saying you are unable to make a deal, is tantamount to an invitation to be replaced by someone else who promises he or she will get a deal.
When the eventual deal is published, people are going to work out what the deal means for them. There is going to be a groundswell of opposition from a lot of different groups who are not going to see this as an opportunity but rather as a threat. That opposition is going to be focussed.
Whether May thinks she can pitch this on the basis of "this deal or WTO rules", but surely the other EU states are not going to play that game. They are surely going to say that it is not too late to call the whole thing off. It is one of the unwritten rules of the EU club, occasionally broken, that EU members do not interfere in the politics of other member states. Particularly with the example of Putin in front of them, EU leaders are surely not going to give May the opportunity to "spin" the deal as she wants.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by nulli tertius
It strikes me May is heading for the same trap Cameron found himself in.
She had originally planned a Brexit white paper. That could have discussed what we could realistically obtain and number crunch some consequences of this.
May has now rejected this in favour of a "motherhood and apple pie" speech with no attempt to manage expectations on the part of the public.
May may say that "no deal is better than a bad deal" but in the real world no politician ever comes back empty-handed. Either a deal is made or talks will continue. Saying you are unable to make a deal, is tantamount to an invitation to be replaced by someone else who promises he or she will get a deal.
When the eventual deal is published, people are going to work out what the deal means for them. There is going to be a groundswell of opposition from a lot of different groups who are not going to see this as an opportunity but rather as a threat. That opposition is going to be focussed.
Whether May thinks she can pitch this on the basis of "this deal or WTO rules", but surely the other EU states are not going to play that game. They are surely going to say that it is not too late to call the whole thing off. It is one of the unwritten rules of the EU club, occasionally broken, that EU members do not interfere in the politics of other member states. Particularly with the example of Putin in front of them, EU leaders are surely not going to give May the opportunity to "spin" the deal as she wants.
She had originally planned a Brexit white paper. That could have discussed what we could realistically obtain and number crunch some consequences of this.
May has now rejected this in favour of a "motherhood and apple pie" speech with no attempt to manage expectations on the part of the public.
May may say that "no deal is better than a bad deal" but in the real world no politician ever comes back empty-handed. Either a deal is made or talks will continue. Saying you are unable to make a deal, is tantamount to an invitation to be replaced by someone else who promises he or she will get a deal.
When the eventual deal is published, people are going to work out what the deal means for them. There is going to be a groundswell of opposition from a lot of different groups who are not going to see this as an opportunity but rather as a threat. That opposition is going to be focussed.
Whether May thinks she can pitch this on the basis of "this deal or WTO rules", but surely the other EU states are not going to play that game. They are surely going to say that it is not too late to call the whole thing off. It is one of the unwritten rules of the EU club, occasionally broken, that EU members do not interfere in the politics of other member states. Particularly with the example of Putin in front of them, EU leaders are surely not going to give May the opportunity to "spin" the deal as she wants.
A key difference is that Cameron walking away from the table would have been a total failure, may doing the same is not, it's a slight failure but mostly can be easily spun as success.
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Original post by Jammy Duel
A key difference is that Cameron walking away from the table would have been a total failure, may doing the same is not, it's a slight failure but mostly can be easily spun as success.
Posted from TSR Mobile
Posted from TSR Mobile
It won't be that easy to spin.
Labour and the Liberals will predictably say "its a failure". Big Nige will say he could have got a deal. Sources close to various cabinet ministers will explain the "mistakes" that May made which means she was unable to secure a deal. European politicians will set out the terms of the very generous offer which May rejected. If they are well crafted May will have difficulty saying what is wrong with those proposals. What is generally wrong with diplomatic offers is not what is written on the paper, but what is not written and criticising the omissions often involves what can't be said, because it implies a lack of good faith on the part of the other side.
Original post by Drewski
Maybe, maybe not.
But at least we won't have to carry countries like Greece. Enjoy that.
But at least we won't have to carry countries like Greece. Enjoy that.
A full Greek default would still impact us - the global banks are all interlocked in their Greek sovereign debt load and the impacts of bank failures in Europe will still clobber us hard. Then the taxpayer would as usual be informed that they would be bearing the impact and the traders and bankers who made millions from all the dodgy debt deals would be relaxing in their tax havens on their yachts.
Original post by nulli tertius
It strikes me May is heading for the same trap Cameron found himself in.
She had originally planned a Brexit white paper. That could have discussed what we could realistically obtain and number crunch some consequences of this.
May has now rejected this in favour of a "motherhood and apple pie" speech with no attempt to manage expectations on the part of the public.
May may say that "no deal is better than a bad deal" but in the real world no politician ever comes back empty-handed. Either a deal is made or talks will continue. Saying you are unable to make a deal, is tantamount to an invitation to be replaced by someone else who promises he or she will get a deal.
When the eventual deal is published, people are going to work out what the deal means for them. There is going to be a groundswell of opposition from a lot of different groups who are not going to see this as an opportunity but rather as a threat. That opposition is going to be focussed.
Whether May thinks she can pitch this on the basis of "this deal or WTO rules", but surely the other EU states are not going to play that game. They are surely going to say that it is not too late to call the whole thing off. It is one of the unwritten rules of the EU club, occasionally broken, that EU members do not interfere in the politics of other member states. Particularly with the example of Putin in front of them, EU leaders are surely not going to give May the opportunity to "spin" the deal as she wants.
She had originally planned a Brexit white paper. That could have discussed what we could realistically obtain and number crunch some consequences of this.
May has now rejected this in favour of a "motherhood and apple pie" speech with no attempt to manage expectations on the part of the public.
May may say that "no deal is better than a bad deal" but in the real world no politician ever comes back empty-handed. Either a deal is made or talks will continue. Saying you are unable to make a deal, is tantamount to an invitation to be replaced by someone else who promises he or she will get a deal.
When the eventual deal is published, people are going to work out what the deal means for them. There is going to be a groundswell of opposition from a lot of different groups who are not going to see this as an opportunity but rather as a threat. That opposition is going to be focussed.
Whether May thinks she can pitch this on the basis of "this deal or WTO rules", but surely the other EU states are not going to play that game. They are surely going to say that it is not too late to call the whole thing off. It is one of the unwritten rules of the EU club, occasionally broken, that EU members do not interfere in the politics of other member states. Particularly with the example of Putin in front of them, EU leaders are surely not going to give May the opportunity to "spin" the deal as she wants.
Very well put.
I think inevitably it will either come back to Parliament or another referendum with huge analysis of all the crappy consequences of a full single market dump and massive panic in the country.
That won't be a bad thing either, because the eccentric victory of the post-Thatcher Tory Hard Right on what for them was a central issue and for everyone else was a yawnathon over national opinion will inevitably prove disastrous for everyone except some city traders and a few hedge funds and foreign oligarchical interests - should we really allow this tiny minority of well funded mad hats to plunge us into oblivion?
Original post by TitanicTeutonicPhil
Ah, another deplorable islamophobe!
Yeah, we took in (close to) a million Muslims, and will take in more. Because we're good people, not cynical nationalists. And because our country can actually take the load, unlike yours.
The fact that you bring up rape shows how uneducated you are about the topic (and probably academically too), so do stfu before I need to embarrass you any more.
Yeah, we took in (close to) a million Muslims, and will take in more. Because we're good people, not cynical nationalists. And because our country can actually take the load, unlike yours.
The fact that you bring up rape shows how uneducated you are about the topic (and probably academically too), so do stfu before I need to embarrass you any more.
Yes you took in a million Muslim men. That in itself was about a 25% increase in your Muslim population. OK, maybe not quite that big an increase, but still of that order.
And when the women and children come to join them too that will be another million won't it? Or are you such Islamophobes as to prevent them?
Say another million come over the next few months when the Turkish deal breaks down.. And they bring a million dependants too.
Your Muslim population will have almost doubled in a couple of years.
Is it "Islamophobic" to mention that Muslims are driving trucks into shoppers at Christmas markets in Berlin?
Yeah, stay in the EU, with its freedom of movement a core value. It will make help make Germany more and more Muslim.
We are all laughing at your wilkommenkultur to the whole Muslm world.
Danke und Inshallah!
Did you know that the UK is the only country in the world to have a 'banter' culture? All you're doing is putting each other down 'for fun'.
Most languages don't even have an equivalent of 'banter'. Why would you want to tease and put down others, let alone your friends, for no reason?
Most languages don't even have an equivalent of 'banter'. Why would you want to tease and put down others, let alone your friends, for no reason?
Oh come on... A German without a sense of humour? You're just playing stereotypes now!
Original post by astutehirstute
Yes you took in a million Muslim men. That in itself was about a 25% increase in your Muslim population. OK, maybe not quite that big an increase, but still of that order.
And when the women and children come to join them too that will be another million won't it? Or are you such Islamophobes as to prevent them?
Say another million come over the next few months when the Turkish deal breaks down.. And they bring a million dependants too.
Your Muslim population will have almost doubled in a couple of years.
And when the women and children come to join them too that will be another million won't it? Or are you such Islamophobes as to prevent them?
Say another million come over the next few months when the Turkish deal breaks down.. And they bring a million dependants too.
Your Muslim population will have almost doubled in a couple of years.
Original post by astutehirstute
Is it "Islamophobic" to mention that Muslims are driving trucks into shoppers at Christmas markets in Berlin?
No, it's just wrong. It was one Muslim. A regrettable incident, like any act of violence or terror committed by anyone. That doesn't mean you should close your door to Muslim refugees like you cowards are doing.
Original post by astutehirstute
Yeah, stay in the EU, with its freedom of movement a core value. It will make help make Germany more and more Muslim.
Again, why is that a problem? Diversity is good.
Original post by astutehirstute
We are all laughing at your wilkommenkultur to the whole Muslm world.
Good on ya. Meanwhile, we're laughing at your GDP collapsing.
Original post by TitanicTeutonicPhil
Yes, so? Why is that an issue? Oh right, you're a xenophobic, islamophobic sack of **** who refuses to give shelter to people fleeing from war and terror! I do hope you get knifed by a Muslim or anyone really.
Why is your Muslim population doubling in two years an issue?
Original post by TitanicTeutonicPhil
No, it's just wrong. It was one Muslim. A regrettable incident, like any act of violence or terror committed by anyone. That doesn't mean you should close your door to Muslim refugees like you cowards are doing.
No, it's just wrong. It was one Muslim. A regrettable incident, like any act of violence or terror committed by anyone. That doesn't mean you should close your door to Muslim refugees like you cowards are doing.
Yes it does.
But it is great that you are having to take them, pay for them, be culturally transformed by them. It takes the pressure off us, and speeds up the disintegration of the EU.
Original post by TitanicTeutonicPhil
Good on ya. Meanwhile, we're laughing at your GDP collapsing.
Good on ya. Meanwhile, we're laughing at your GDP collapsing.
Laughing at the fastest growing economy in the G7 last year, (according to the IMF) after the Brexit vote?
Who said the Germans had no sense of humour!
Original post by Snufkin
You did? O to be Norwegian... I wish. 
Why did you think that?
You did? O to be Norwegian... I wish. Why did you think that?Hear hear
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Original post by nulli tertius
It won't be that easy to spin.
Labour and the Liberals will predictably say "its a failure". Big Nige will say he could have got a deal. Sources close to various cabinet ministers will explain the "mistakes" that May made which means she was unable to secure a deal. European politicians will set out the terms of the very generous offer which May rejected. If they are well crafted May will have difficulty saying what is wrong with those proposals. What is generally wrong with diplomatic offers is not what is written on the paper, but what is not written and criticising the omissions often involves what can't be said, because it implies a lack of good faith on the part of the other side.
Labour and the Liberals will predictably say "its a failure". Big Nige will say he could have got a deal. Sources close to various cabinet ministers will explain the "mistakes" that May made which means she was unable to secure a deal. European politicians will set out the terms of the very generous offer which May rejected. If they are well crafted May will have difficulty saying what is wrong with those proposals. What is generally wrong with diplomatic offers is not what is written on the paper, but what is not written and criticising the omissions often involves what can't be said, because it implies a lack of good faith on the part of the other side.
Most of what has been set out as goals can be achieved by simply walking away. Of the 12 points only 2 are clearly affected and maybe 2 or 3 collaterally so.
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