Eight billionaires 'as rich as world's poorest half'
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Original post by Fullofsurprises
Oh here we go. "Politics of envy" - the standard war cry of right wing Tories down the ages. Yawn.
It has **** all to do with envy. I don't even fancy a small yacht, let alone one the size of Belgium. It's to do with FAIRNESS.
Sorry for the shouting, but really, this old swansong of envy as if you can use the threat of people accepting that they might be envious to distract attention from the massive injustice of our biggest wealth owners and earners paying effectively zero tax rates.
The real issue is not envy, but why on earth we allow them to get away with it. Part of the answer lies in the deep confusions that posts like yours illustrate - driven no doubt by too much reading of the Daily Mail.
It has **** all to do with envy. I don't even fancy a small yacht, let alone one the size of Belgium. It's to do with FAIRNESS.
Sorry for the shouting, but really, this old swansong of envy as if you can use the threat of people accepting that they might be envious to distract attention from the massive injustice of our biggest wealth owners and earners paying effectively zero tax rates.
The real issue is not envy, but why on earth we allow them to get away with it. Part of the answer lies in the deep confusions that posts like yours illustrate - driven no doubt by too much reading of the Daily Mail.
Life isn't fair! Haven't you worked that one out yet?
Your point about the rich not paying tax is misplaced. Yes, the mega rich can structure their affairs in the most tax effective way, what else is new?
But a tiny proportion of the wealthiest take most of the tax burden on society's behalf.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/04/26/nearly-half-of-britons-pay-no-income-tax-as-burden-on-rich-incre/
I'm so sick of seeing this everywhere. The two are UNRELATED and its not up for debate.
Its almost as if people who have worked their asses off day and night inventing and having a vision for their passions are being blamed for being successful lmao how dumb.
Its almost as if people who have worked their asses off day and night inventing and having a vision for their passions are being blamed for being successful lmao how dumb.
Original post by Fullofsurprises
Oh here we go. "Politics of envy" - the standard war cry of right wing Tories down the ages. Yawn.
Maybe it rings down the ages because it has some truth in it?
Original post by Fullofsurprises
It has **** all to do with envy. I don't even fancy a small yacht, let alone one the size of Belgium. It's to do with FAIRNESS.
It has **** all to do with envy. I don't even fancy a small yacht, let alone one the size of Belgium. It's to do with FAIRNESS.
It has everything to do with envy. You are a bright, talented girl. When you see others no cleverer, or more talented than you, possessing more, the green sickness takes over. Especially if they inherited the great wealth.
You may not want a yacht, that is out of reach, but you want a better house than you have, a better car, a bigger collection of nicer shoes, better holidays and more of them..
Original post by Fullofsurprises
The real issue is not envy, but why on earth we allow them to get away with it. Part of the answer lies in the deep confusions that posts like yours illustrate - driven no doubt by too much reading of the Daily Mail.
The real issue is not envy, but why on earth we allow them to get away with it. Part of the answer lies in the deep confusions that posts like yours illustrate - driven no doubt by too much reading of the Daily Mail.
That is fine, you are entitled to that view. I find the Daily Mail a wonderful paper, as it happens, and am honoured that you feel I may have formed some opinions from reading it.
But where is the confusion? Please elucidate. Then, as Mrs Merton put it. "Lets have a lively debate!"
It's not like Bill Gates went around knocking on millions of doors selling CDs he had made at $100 a pop. Gates' fortune derives from the value of his stock, and the value of his stock derives from the productivity of his business, which derives from the workers doing the producing. Furthermore, it is simply not true that you can only get rich by providing value. For example, if I buy stock in a company, I have produced precisely nothing and provided zero value, and yet if the workers at that company go on to produce a world-changing product, I get to reap the rewards of that innovation.
lol wage slaves worshiping the oppressors again. "Inequality is not a problem" and they say socialists are deluded. Stockholm syndrome is rife in these forums.
Original post by Captain Haddock
It's not like Bill Gates went around knocking on millions of doors selling CDs he had made at $100 a pop. Gates' fortune derives from the value of his stock, and the value of his stock derives from the productivity of his business, which derives from the workers doing the producing. Furthermore, it is simply not true that you can only get rich by providing value. For example, if I buy stock in a company, I have produced precisely nothing and provided zero value, and yet if the workers at that company go on to produce a world-changing product, I get to reap the rewards of that innovation.
How quaint, some variation of the surplus theory of value!
It is nonsense. A diamond is worth the same if it is found on the street, or if it was the product of the labour of tens of miners.
.
Capitalism breaks down when there is a lack of redistribution of wealth.
Money tends to move in only one direction, from the bottom to the top, where it stays, because those at the top can't possibly ever spend the money that they have... unfortunately, greed usually gets in the way of them doing anything useful with their riches like, giving it back to the poor. So it sits there in a pot, getting bigger and bigger, and the value of the remaining cash in the economy reduces and reduces. The economic system started by trading goods (pigs for potatoes, clothes for soap etc), people also liked shiny things and gold was found to be a great standard commodity to trade between other goods, so gold (and other precious metals) became a common item to use for trade when you lacked whatever it was that the other trader wished for. Then, when all the gold had been horded by the best traders and there wasn't enough to keep the bank vaults full, the banks created IOU's in the form of bank notes (notice that even today, bank notes still bear the words "I promise to pay the bearer on demand the sum of £X"... although as there is no freely moving gold left, this statement no longer includes a reference to the value being an amount of gold, now it's just your little piece of the national debt). Then of course bank notes were found to continually devalue, and the production of more banknotes only compounded the issue... so now we have this plastic method of payment, which moves floating point numbers between one computer and another.
At some point we're going to have to find another way to trade, but until that day comes, we'll just find ever more inventive ways to reduce the implicit value of the tradable tokens we use, and the richest in the world will keep sitting on their mountains of worthless bank notes, and the poorest will continue wishing they had just a little bit of the mountain.
Money tends to move in only one direction, from the bottom to the top, where it stays, because those at the top can't possibly ever spend the money that they have... unfortunately, greed usually gets in the way of them doing anything useful with their riches like, giving it back to the poor. So it sits there in a pot, getting bigger and bigger, and the value of the remaining cash in the economy reduces and reduces. The economic system started by trading goods (pigs for potatoes, clothes for soap etc), people also liked shiny things and gold was found to be a great standard commodity to trade between other goods, so gold (and other precious metals) became a common item to use for trade when you lacked whatever it was that the other trader wished for. Then, when all the gold had been horded by the best traders and there wasn't enough to keep the bank vaults full, the banks created IOU's in the form of bank notes (notice that even today, bank notes still bear the words "I promise to pay the bearer on demand the sum of £X"... although as there is no freely moving gold left, this statement no longer includes a reference to the value being an amount of gold, now it's just your little piece of the national debt). Then of course bank notes were found to continually devalue, and the production of more banknotes only compounded the issue... so now we have this plastic method of payment, which moves floating point numbers between one computer and another.
At some point we're going to have to find another way to trade, but until that day comes, we'll just find ever more inventive ways to reduce the implicit value of the tradable tokens we use, and the richest in the world will keep sitting on their mountains of worthless bank notes, and the poorest will continue wishing they had just a little bit of the mountain.
That is exactly right.
The left, the Oxfam idiots, who should be helping the poor rather than wasting their donors' money on pointless political posturing, don't get that, and the naive, wet behind the ears students and ex students on here don't get that either.
The rich don't cause the poor to be poor.
The left, the Oxfam idiots, who should be helping the poor rather than wasting their donors' money on pointless political posturing, don't get that, and the naive, wet behind the ears students and ex students on here don't get that either.
The rich don't cause the poor to be poor.
Original post by Captain Haddock
It's not like Bill Gates went around knocking on millions of doors selling CDs he had made at $100 a pop. Gates' fortune derives from the value of his stock, and the value of his stock derives from the productivity of his business, which derives from the workers doing the producing.
And the monopolies copyright and patent laws give.
Original post by yudothis
And funny all your other examples are tech.
And funny all your other examples are tech.
Funny how most of the Oxfam examples were tech founders also.
Leaving aside all the money these guys have given back (Gates himself will give it all back to good causes on his death) these billionaires have transformed our entire planet.
Yet because they are rich, this charity's cretins, single them out as evil.
Like I said earlier there is a crisis in the charity sector. Pubic trust in it is at record lows.
Oxfam has just provided a perfect example of why that is. I used to donate to it, back in the past, but I won't any more. There are other good causes that are more responsible and deserving. It is the same with the Red Cross who said that the fact that people are waiting a few minutes longer in A+E was a "humanitarian crisis."
I had a standing order to donate to them. I stopped it the same day.
I won't pay the salaries of the morons who produce these piles of $hit.
Original post by astutehirstute
Funny how most of the Oxfam examples were tech founders also.
Leaving aside all the money these guys have given back (Gates himself will give it all back to good causes on his death) these billionaires have transformed our entire planet.
Yet because they are rich, this charity's cretins, single them out as evil.
Like I said earlier there is a crisis in the charity sector. Pubic trust in it is at record lows.
Oxfam has just provided a perfect example of why that is. I used to donate to it, back in the past, but I won't any more. There are other good causes that are more responsible and deserving. It is the same with the Red Cross who said that the fact that people are waiting a few minutes longer in A+E was a "humanitarian crisis."
I had a standing order to donate to them. I stopped it the same day.
I won't pay the salaries of the morons who produce these piles of $hit.
Leaving aside all the money these guys have given back (Gates himself will give it all back to good causes on his death) these billionaires have transformed our entire planet.
Yet because they are rich, this charity's cretins, single them out as evil.
Like I said earlier there is a crisis in the charity sector. Pubic trust in it is at record lows.
Oxfam has just provided a perfect example of why that is. I used to donate to it, back in the past, but I won't any more. There are other good causes that are more responsible and deserving. It is the same with the Red Cross who said that the fact that people are waiting a few minutes longer in A+E was a "humanitarian crisis."
I had a standing order to donate to them. I stopped it the same day.
I won't pay the salaries of the morons who produce these piles of $hit.
Aren't you a good human, donating to charities.
Original post by kassinopious
Capitalism breaks down when there is a lack of redistribution of wealth.
Don't you dare bash capitalism! Don't you read? All these capitalist make the world such a better place and their money just reflects how valuable a contribution they have made towards humanity!
How dare you!
I always wonder why people need that much money...there's only so much you can buy and what these 8 people have is surely enough to make all their (financial) dreams come true.
Having said that, its their money and, although its more than anyone needs, you can't just take it away from them.
Having said that, its their money and, although its more than anyone needs, you can't just take it away from them.
I totally agree. Nice to read someone sensible rather than the hordes of virtue signallers emoting and banging on about how "unfair" it is that there are rich people and poor people. And to point out tha obvious truth that a lot more people are poor than hyper rich because only a handful of individuals in every generation have the drive and brilliance to found and run companies like Apple and Microsoft.
The public are turning against the left's failing ideology on matters like these as well as everything else. The charity sector is in crisis as we say, and the scandal of the UK's ludicrously high and corrupt foreign aid budget is cutting through big time also.
And we seem to have shut them up at last on this thread even! Everywhere our ideas are triumphant.
'
The public are turning against the left's failing ideology on matters like these as well as everything else. The charity sector is in crisis as we say, and the scandal of the UK's ludicrously high and corrupt foreign aid budget is cutting through big time also.
And we seem to have shut them up at last on this thread even! Everywhere our ideas are triumphant.
'
Why are people always so pessimistic towards the success of other people?
These people got rich through their own hard work and effort. They made huge sacrifices to get to where they are, and have pretty much shaped the world through their inventions and companies. They deserve to be as rich as they are. Mark Zuckerberg has transformed the world through Facebook, which has billions of users across the world. Plus, most of these billionaire CEOs have created millions of jobs through their own inventions. The market rewards people based on their economic impact on society.
Why should someone who sits on their arse, or does not have the same ambition be paid the same as someone who has higher ambition and drive? It's like in college, the students that work the hardest and those that are the smartest get the best grades.
Sure, poverty is also a big issue. And it's good to see that these billionaires are contributing towards alleviating poverty. But, it's shortsighted to blame poverty on these eight billionaires. Poverty is also influenced by political corruption, bribery, and lack of natural resources as well. I agree that as a society we should do more to help the poorer in society, particularly those that lack the basic resources and infrastructure to move up. But, it is ridiculous to blame wealthy billionaires who have made their money legally, and are using it to improve peoples lives.
These people got rich through their own hard work and effort. They made huge sacrifices to get to where they are, and have pretty much shaped the world through their inventions and companies. They deserve to be as rich as they are. Mark Zuckerberg has transformed the world through Facebook, which has billions of users across the world. Plus, most of these billionaire CEOs have created millions of jobs through their own inventions. The market rewards people based on their economic impact on society.
Why should someone who sits on their arse, or does not have the same ambition be paid the same as someone who has higher ambition and drive? It's like in college, the students that work the hardest and those that are the smartest get the best grades.
Sure, poverty is also a big issue. And it's good to see that these billionaires are contributing towards alleviating poverty. But, it's shortsighted to blame poverty on these eight billionaires. Poverty is also influenced by political corruption, bribery, and lack of natural resources as well. I agree that as a society we should do more to help the poorer in society, particularly those that lack the basic resources and infrastructure to move up. But, it is ridiculous to blame wealthy billionaires who have made their money legally, and are using it to improve peoples lives.
Agreed. It isn't just the hard left, examples of whom we have on this thread. Most people are just wage slave sheep, too frightened of losing the security of the monthly pay packet to branch out and take the risk of setting up a business. Giving them the freedom that entails, the satisfaction of achieving something tangible, and of course the financial rewards that go with it if it is successful.
Agreed too. I find this website diverting, addictively so even, but must move on from it soon. This thread has really demonstrated how childish almost all the posters are. They are not stupid, I am not saying that, but they have haven't got a clue, if we are being brutally honest. They'll grow up eventually, I guess.
Funny you should ask, actually. At the moment I have some residential property which I let out and I trade stocks and commodities. But the market is looking very toppy in the Thames Valley, where I am based (it has already slowed in London obviously) and I am thinking of cashing out, and doing something else with the capital.
Not sure how much help I can be, although I have done many different things over the years and lost a lot of money in my time as well as making it. So you are welcome to PM me. I can tell you what not to do, at the very least!
Top of my list would be, don't buy fixer uppers in an historic area of New Orleans, next door to a crime ridden black housing project that was being knocked down, with the bright idea of making money from the gentrification of the neighbourhood that would entail, once the drug gangs leave, a few months before the whole city gets wiped out by a hurricane.
I laugh but that one still hurts.
What are you currently working on, or are you planning?
Agreed too. I find this website diverting, addictively so even, but must move on from it soon. This thread has really demonstrated how childish almost all the posters are. They are not stupid, I am not saying that, but they have haven't got a clue, if we are being brutally honest. They'll grow up eventually, I guess.
Funny you should ask, actually. At the moment I have some residential property which I let out and I trade stocks and commodities. But the market is looking very toppy in the Thames Valley, where I am based (it has already slowed in London obviously) and I am thinking of cashing out, and doing something else with the capital.
Not sure how much help I can be, although I have done many different things over the years and lost a lot of money in my time as well as making it. So you are welcome to PM me. I can tell you what not to do, at the very least!
Top of my list would be, don't buy fixer uppers in an historic area of New Orleans, next door to a crime ridden black housing project that was being knocked down, with the bright idea of making money from the gentrification of the neighbourhood that would entail, once the drug gangs leave, a few months before the whole city gets wiped out by a hurricane.
I laugh but that one still hurts.
What are you currently working on, or are you planning?
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