Liberals seem to be incapable of comprehending what the "Muslim Ban" is about
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You have got to love this from Trump's point of view.
He implements this "muslim ban" by executive decree. He just signs a bit of paper.
The worldwide mainstream media goes absolutely nuts. Into utter and complete meltdown.
His base see that, and for them he is a politician with balls, different from all others,willing to confront the PC appeasers, EXACTLY what they elected.
Will it make any difference to the US's safety? No. Will it be possible to adminster efficiently? No. But so what from his point of view?
It is a totally new politics. Celebrity Presidency by tweet and a stroke of the pen. A campaign promise that was impossible to deliver, ticked off. Just like that.
The more the mainstream media screams with outrage the more popular he becomes. They have been played like puppets all along and they STILL don't get it.
He implements this "muslim ban" by executive decree. He just signs a bit of paper.
The worldwide mainstream media goes absolutely nuts. Into utter and complete meltdown.
His base see that, and for them he is a politician with balls, different from all others,willing to confront the PC appeasers, EXACTLY what they elected.
Will it make any difference to the US's safety? No. Will it be possible to adminster efficiently? No. But so what from his point of view?
It is a totally new politics. Celebrity Presidency by tweet and a stroke of the pen. A campaign promise that was impossible to deliver, ticked off. Just like that.
The more the mainstream media screams with outrage the more popular he becomes. They have been played like puppets all along and they STILL don't get it.
Original post by VV Cephei A
6 out of 7 countries on the ban list are active war zones. Which means they have unstable governments, poor infrastructure, and consequently poor documentation of their citizens, undermining any vetting process that might be employed during their immigration to the US.
For the most part, we have no idea who the people coming over from these countries are. Sure, most may be good people fleeing a conflict, but until there is a reliable way to evaluate the background of these individuals, it's anyone's guess.
That's what this ban is about. Temporarily limiting immigration from countries where it is difficult to assess citizens prior to granting them legal entry to the US, until measures have been implemented to do this.
It has nothing to do with "Muslims". Out of the 10 countries with the highest Muslim populations in the world, only one is on this list.
For the most part, we have no idea who the people coming over from these countries are. Sure, most may be good people fleeing a conflict, but until there is a reliable way to evaluate the background of these individuals, it's anyone's guess.
That's what this ban is about. Temporarily limiting immigration from countries where it is difficult to assess citizens prior to granting them legal entry to the US, until measures have been implemented to do this.
It has nothing to do with "Muslims". Out of the 10 countries with the highest Muslim populations in the world, only one is on this list.
And here is why I disagree
1) The vetting process for getting green cards from those country is already extremely robust. Syrian refugees are taking 18-24 months to get them. That is extremely thorough.There haven't been any attacks at any point int he last 20 years from anyone from these countries.
2) The explanation supplied does not clarify why they would immediately ban those who have dual nationality (and still are continuing to do so)
3) It also does not explain the exemptions for minority groups within those (muslim) countries which trump himself has stated is to aid Christians who are being 'slaughtered'.
4) The other excuse not used by you but used by some is 'but this was a list created by Obama'. The analogy I would suggest for this argument is Obama creates speed limits on highways where before there was none and Trump then overnight changes that speed limit to 10mph. For buses only.
5) This whole liberal : Conservative dichotomy is tiresome. Its not black and white. You can be a bit right of centre and still see the stupidity in this.
Original post by fleky6910
Can you link me with evidence.
If this is the case I disagree the way with which the ban is being carried out. It's so dumb if this is the case!
If this is the case I disagree the way with which the ban is being carried out. It's so dumb if this is the case!
Original post by Bornblue
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jan/27/donald-trump-executive-order-immigration-full-text
Here's the full text. The ban applies to people with dual nationality. Hence our Iraqi MP, Nadem Zahawi, the conservative, is not allowed to go and see his sons in America.
Iraqi interpreters, who worked FOR the USA army will now not be allowed into the USA...
Here's the full text. The ban applies to people with dual nationality. Hence our Iraqi MP, Nadem Zahawi, the conservative, is not allowed to go and see his sons in America.
Iraqi interpreters, who worked FOR the USA army will now not be allowed into the USA...
And from the FCO instead of the Guardian: https://www.gov.uk/government/news/presidential-executive-order-on-inbound-migration-to-us
I like this thread. I repped almost every post on the first page 
Original post by Jammy Duel
And from the FCO instead of the Guardian: https://www.gov.uk/government/news/presidential-executive-order-on-inbound-migration-to-us
Thanks for the truth Jammy!
@Bornblue I could've guessed you'd be biased and give me a left wing article to prove it
!(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by fleky6910
Thanks for the truth Jammy!
IT is entirely believable that there were issues, especially given the immigration officials probably weren't properly brief in all likelihood, but now we are getting foreign governments contracting State to clarify matters the details of the implementation of the order are being ironed out and cleared up. I doubt the BBC are going to say much about this statement other than, perhaps, that it exists.
Original post by joe cooley
I am not bothered what their origins are.
If they are not prepared to commit to Britain 100% they should go home, obviously they do not consider Britain as home.
US citizens are in danger in Muslim countries now.
US Muslims are being radicalised now.
Thanks to Obama and the left the US southern border has been open to terrorists for the last 8 years.
If they are not prepared to commit to Britain 100% they should go home, obviously they do not consider Britain as home.
US citizens are in danger in Muslim countries now.
US Muslims are being radicalised now.
Thanks to Obama and the left the US southern border has been open to terrorists for the last 8 years.
Are you American, Joe? If not what nationality are you? I'm British btw.
That makes no sense at all. I would think having a UK passport, representing the country and being knighted is commitment enough. Similarly becoming an MP and being a UK citizen is commitment enough.
They will be in greater danger.
You say you arent interested in their origin nation, but its certainly what the US is using as the deciding factor.
They will have more more ammunition to use in propaganda terms.
Why are you insistent its just on Obama? I thought terrorists who have actually perpetrated crimes were radicalised or flew into the US?
How many islamic terrorist deaths have there been during Obamas period in office?
Original post by fleky6910
Thanks for the truth Jammy!
@Bornblue I could've guessed you'd be biased and give me a left wing article to prove it!
@Bornblue I could've guessed you'd be biased and give me a left wing article to prove it
!It was an exact copy of the Executive order, not an opinion piece you little, immature child.
Original post by Jammy Duel
And from the FCO instead of the Guardian: https://www.gov.uk/government/news/presidential-executive-order-on-inbound-migration-to-us
HAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHH
It was an exact copy of the executive order, not an opinion piece.
Idiot.
Original post by 999tigger
Are you American, Joe? If not what nationality are you? I'm British btw.
That makes no sense at all. I would think having a UK passport, representing the country and being knighted is commitment enough. Similarly becoming an MP and being a UK citizen is commitment enough.
They will be in greater danger.
You say you arent interested in their origin nation, but its certainly what the US is using as the deciding factor.
They will have more more ammunition to use in propaganda terms.
Why are you insistent its just on Obama? I thought terrorists who have actually perpetrated crimes were radicalised or flew into the US?
How many islamic terrorist deaths have there been during Obamas period in office?
That makes no sense at all. I would think having a UK passport, representing the country and being knighted is commitment enough. Similarly becoming an MP and being a UK citizen is commitment enough.
They will be in greater danger.
You say you arent interested in their origin nation, but its certainly what the US is using as the deciding factor.
They will have more more ammunition to use in propaganda terms.
Why are you insistent its just on Obama? I thought terrorists who have actually perpetrated crimes were radicalised or flew into the US?
How many islamic terrorist deaths have there been during Obamas period in office?
I'm British.
If the two Muslims in question are so proud to be British, why dual nationality?
Who in their right mind would want to retain Somali nationality????
Wrong, if they had renounced their former nationality there would be no issue.
San Bernardino-14 killed 22 seriously injured.
Orlando Pulse nightclub-49 wounded 53 injured
Fort Hood-13 killed 30+ injured
Chattanooga-5 killed 2 injured
Yet Obama couldn't bring himself to utter the words "islamic terrorism"
Original post by Bornblue
HAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHH
It was an exact copy of the executive order, not an opinion piece.
Idiot.
It was an exact copy of the executive order, not an opinion piece.
Idiot.
So, what does it actually say then, and I don't mean copy and paste what it says, I mean explain what it means, in particular section 3, and it's up to you whether you consider statements put out, such as by the FCO, from government bodies that clarify what it actually means, or Preibus earlier today making clarifying remarks about its implementation?
In fact, it turns out a grand total of 0 green card holders have had access blocked.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by joe cooley
Western culture IS superior to Islamic culture.
"The Islamization of Iran was to yield deep transformations within the cultural, scientific, and political structure of Iran's society: The blossoming of Persian literature, philosophy, medicine and art became major elements of the newly forming Muslim civilization. Inheriting a heritage of thousands of years of civilization, and being at the "crossroads of the major cultural highways",[76] contributed to Persia emerging as what culminated into the "Islamic Golden Age". During this period, hundreds of scholars and scientists vastly contributed to technology, science and medicine, later influencing the rise of European science during the Renaissance.[77]"
...
Original post by Profesh
"The Islamization of Iran was to yield deep transformations within the cultural, scientific, and political structure of Iran's society: The blossoming of Persian literature, philosophy, medicine and art became major elements of the newly forming Muslim civilization. Inheriting a heritage of thousands of years of civilization, and being at the "crossroads of the major cultural highways",[76] contributed to Persia emerging as what culminated into the "Islamic Golden Age". During this period, hundreds of scholars and scientists vastly contributed to technology, science and medicine, later influencing the rise of European science during the Renaissance.[77]"
...
...
Pray tell what bearing that actually has on the statement, I mean, it's not like that is a quote from Wikipedia about modern Iran.
You don't have to be a liberal to see the "ban" is stupid and ineffective.
Original post by joe cooley
I'm British.
If the two Muslims in question are so proud to be British, why dual nationality?
Who in their right mind would want to retain Somali nationality????
Wrong, if they had renounced their former nationality there would be no issue.
San Bernardino-14 killed 22 seriously injured.
Orlando Pulse nightclub-49 wounded 53 injured
Fort Hood-13 killed 30+ injured
Chattanooga-5 killed 2 injured
Yet Obama couldn't bring himself to utter the words "islamic terrorism"
If the two Muslims in question are so proud to be British, why dual nationality?
Who in their right mind would want to retain Somali nationality????
Wrong, if they had renounced their former nationality there would be no issue.
San Bernardino-14 killed 22 seriously injured.
Orlando Pulse nightclub-49 wounded 53 injured
Fort Hood-13 killed 30+ injured
Chattanooga-5 killed 2 injured
Yet Obama couldn't bring himself to utter the words "islamic terrorism"
Why cant you have dual nationality. the MP does not have dual nationality.
Plenty of people work in the US or over herewith dual nationality. Is this somehow an identified threat? how many terrorists have used dual natiionals?
Update following the UK contacting the US for what they call clarification it has now been decied Mo Farah can travel.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/29/donald-trumps-ban-refugees-us-president-insists-policy-not-against/
•
Fort Lauderdale airport shooting (January 2017): A US citizen
•
Orlando nightclub shooting (June 2016): A US citizen with Afghan parents
•
San Bernardino shooting (December 2015): A US citizen with Pakistani parents, and a Pakistani citizen
•
Chattanooga shootings (July 2015): A Kuwait-born US citizen
•
Charleston church shooting (June 2015): A US citizen
•
Boston marathon bombing (April 2013): Two Russian citizens with Chechen ethnicity
In the same period there will have been 80,000 gun homicides alone, so terrorists shootings are a small part of a very violent society.
Notwithstanding that they were US citizens- all of them were from countries that are not on the ban list, so had it been in force and even if they had not been born in the US it would have had zero effect.
Why arent palestine, Afghanistan. Pakistan, Kuwait, Egypt, Saudi and the UAE on the list?
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by LisaNikita
Obama banned Cubans from entering the US. No one complained about that
No he didn't... He banned Cubans who had entered the US illegally from acquiring citizenship.
Not that it it surprising that a Trump fan cannot tell the difference between the two scenarios.
Does anybody know of any countries where it is required, in accordance with the constitution, to be of a specific non-Islamic religion and failure to be a Muslim means you cannot vote, become a citizen, or hold public office?
Posted from TSR Mobile
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by joe cooley
Stay and rebuild it like the Germans did after WW2, maybe?
Out of curiosity, when are you moving back to the culturally superior Islamic world, it must be hell on earth for you, living in such an inferior culture?
Out of curiosity, when are you moving back to the culturally superior Islamic world, it must be hell on earth for you, living in such an inferior culture?
Yeah just act like nothing's happened.
InshAllah soon
Original post by Ladbants
So would you say that Islamic culture is better than Western culture?
Yes. It's a shame no Muslim country follows it properly.
And please don't bring up Saudi Arabia.
Posted from TSR Mobile
I'm usually a big league supporter of The Donald, but he has gone too far this time!
Banning immigration from any country solves nothing - should instead focus on homegrown radicalism, access to firearms and Wahabbi mosques.
Banning immigration from any country solves nothing - should instead focus on homegrown radicalism, access to firearms and Wahabbi mosques.
Spoiler
Original post by 999tigger
Why cant you have dual nationality. the MP does not have dual nationality.
Plenty of people work in the US or over herewith dual nationality. Is this somehow an identified threat? how many terrorists have used dual natiionals?
Update following the UK contacting the US for what they call clarification it has now been decied Mo Farah can travel.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/29/donald-trumps-ban-refugees-us-president-insists-policy-not-against/
In the same period there will have been 80,000 gun homicides alone, so terrorists shootings are a small part of a very violent society.
Notwithstanding that they were US citizens- all of them were from countries that are not on the ban list, so had it been in force and even if they had not been born in the US it would have had zero effect.
Why arent palestine, Afghanistan. Pakistan, Kuwait, Egypt, Saudi and the UAE on the list?
Plenty of people work in the US or over herewith dual nationality. Is this somehow an identified threat? how many terrorists have used dual natiionals?
Update following the UK contacting the US for what they call clarification it has now been decied Mo Farah can travel.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/29/donald-trumps-ban-refugees-us-president-insists-policy-not-against/
•
Fort Lauderdale airport shooting (January 2017): A US citizen
•
Orlando nightclub shooting (June 2016): A US citizen with Afghan parents
•
San Bernardino shooting (December 2015): A US citizen with Pakistani parents, and a Pakistani citizen
•
Chattanooga shootings (July 2015): A Kuwait-born US citizen
•
Charleston church shooting (June 2015): A US citizen
•
Boston marathon bombing (April 2013): Two Russian citizens with Chechen ethnicity
In the same period there will have been 80,000 gun homicides alone, so terrorists shootings are a small part of a very violent society.
Notwithstanding that they were US citizens- all of them were from countries that are not on the ban list, so had it been in force and even if they had not been born in the US it would have had zero effect.
Why arent palestine, Afghanistan. Pakistan, Kuwait, Egypt, Saudi and the UAE on the list?
You said the MP had dual nationality, not me.
You asked for a list of terrorist attacks during Obamas 2 terms, you didn't ask for terror attacks carried out by citizens of nations on the list.
Standard left wing reason for open borders:
We have native murderers, rapist etc. so no harm letting more in.
You want more countries on the list?
At last something we can agree on.
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