Government rejects call to make mandatory high heels illegal

Yes, and in those cases it is actually an unavoidable and fundamental part of the job. Things like working on farms, building sites, etc. High heels and the problems they can cause for some people are totally unnecessary and avoidable if the employer is sensible.

I have brought it up before but I seem to need to keep mentioning it because people dismiss how uncomfortable wearing a tie is for some people.

Wrong. It was a contractor, not PwC as you'll see in this link: www.pwc.co.uk/who-we-are/annual-report/annual-report-2016--governance-and-transparency/annual-report-2016-pair-of-heels-transcript.html - It's worth researching your claims. Besides this was a receptionist, not someone who spends hours on end of their feet.

I'm relating it to feminism because the media attention and petition are feminist campaigns.

We learnt the hard way that it’s critical for the employment policies and values of our supply chain to reflect our own. And we also learnt that in changing times the risk to our reputation can be quickly multiplied by the influence that social media has. Following the incident, we have reviewed our supplier contracts, particularly around diversity and inclusion.

If ties truly are that uncomfortable for some people and cause choking to the point of receiving physical pain then sure, ties should not be allowed under those circumstances either. Given that you can design a tie how you like I can't see this being a major problem. You can't prevent your feet from being lifted when you wear heels.

Who knows what came out of that review but one can hope it's made a positive change. You may shun media attention and feminist petitions/campaigns but if they get companies moving in a better direction then so be it.

The recount of the job roles of the employee mentioned that she would be standing on her feet and escorting customers. A receptionist doesn't necessarily sit at a front desk.

2. High heels, in my opinion, looks more presentable. If my girlfriend puts heels on I think she looks more dressed up than just wearing flat shoes. While I don't have any actual figures I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks that. In a professional setting looking more dressed up is what employers want particularly from front of house staff. On that basis I would argue that heels could be seen as a necessary part of the job.


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What do you mean you can design a tie how you like?

That's surely the best way to go about this situation? Rather than making the government step in use people power, if enough people aren't happy with a company policy they'll look elsewhere which will encourage companies to change. We don't need the state stepping in on everything.

1. Usually a receptionist is not a job that requires someone to stand on their feet all day, some standing may well be required but I'm sure this woman will have sat down at points throughout the day.
2. High heels, in my opinion, looks more presentable. If my girlfriend puts heels on I think she looks more dressed up than just wearing flat shoes. While I don't have any actual figures I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks that. In a professional setting looking more dressed up is what employers want particularly from front of house staff. On that basis I would argue that heels could be seen as a necessary part of the job.

Using your footballers logic that part of their pay reflects their risk to physical health, then maybe women who are forced to wear heels should have their pay reflect that increased risk to health to? Would you endorse women earning more than man on that basis?
If one group of individuals is forced to put their health at risk and to experience discomfort then surely their pay should reflect that, like footballers?

But there are plenty of women's shoes out there that are smart that are also low heel.

When you put on a tie you can normally adjust how tight you want it around the neck. You can tie the knot loosely at your chest and move it upwards.

It's not necessarily the best way to go about this, or about similar problems, as it doesn't always gain media attention. Some companies may not decide to act upon social media pressure either.

A receptionist is simply someone who works at the entrance to a company and greets visitors/clients/whoever enters. It may be that receptionists generally get to sit down but in this case the woman was required to stand, at least for some extended periods of time.

You can't tie a tie properly and it not be tight. If it's loose you're not wearing it properly.

Well then that tells you everything; if a company gets far fewer applications they'll change a policy that people don't like, if they aren't seeing applications drop clearly it's not a big deal.

The debate over the duties of a receptionist is a bit pointless but I think when most people think of a receptionist they think of a person sat behind a desk, of course some do other things.

The person wearing the tie (assuming they do it themselves) has complete control over how far up it goes and, thus, control over how tight it is around the neck.

Check this video, skip to around 1:22. The knot is tied and it can be moved further up by pulling the shorter end. The person wearing the tie (assuming they do it themselves) has complete control over how far up it goes and, thus, control over how tight it is around the neck. I've done ties like this ever since I started wearing them and have not had any problems with choking.

It's not a matter of how 'big of a deal' it is. It's about what employees are asked to do as part of their job.

You told me to "do the research" so it was worth mentioning that not all receptionists sit down.

Aside from the fact that that tie looks terrible and I can tell it's too short it doesn't really show much. If your shirt doesn't fit properly (for any of the aforementioned reasons or any other) doing the top button up will feel uncomfortable and then tightening a die around the collar will add to that.

It's entirely about how much of a big deal it is. If people care that much about wearing heels to work they won't apply to work for companies who enforce that policy.

I didn't say that all do.

If we're going to nit pick about how it looks: I've never seen ties done any other way, even in very professional environments. What does a good looking tie look like to you? You've brought up shirts before and I've already answered this, I don't see the need for ping pong.

In principle I don't believe a company should be allowed to require employees do things that are directly painful and not necessary to perform their role. I don't see it as being important how prevalent this is.

You said "Besides this was a receptionist, not someone who spends hours on end of their feet.", so yes it was worth pointing out that not all receptionists sit down.

A company should be allowed to do anything within the law. If a company requires its employees to wear certain attire, the employee has a clear choice. If he/she doesn't agree with it, they can leave and look for work elsewhere.

This is not discrimination and the law does not view it as such.

If we're going to nit pick about how it looks: I've never seen ties done any other way, even in very professional environments. What does a good looking tie look like to you? You've brought up shirts before and I've already answered this, I don't see the need for ping pong.

In principle I don't believe a company should be allowed to require employees do things that are directly painful and not necessary to perform their role. I don't see it as being important how prevalent this is.

But why? If you don't like it there are thousands of others companies to go and work for. Clearly most women don't care otherwise people pressure would have made companies change.

The knot is too big and the tie is too short. I seem to need to keep repeating myself because every time I say ties can be uncomfortable people don't seem to get it.

But why? If you don't like it there are thousands of others companies to go and work for. Clearly most women don't care otherwise people pressure would have made companies change. I'd also say appearance for front of house staff is important so on that basis high heels can be argued to be a necessary part of their job.

That's kind of a circular point.

I'm more interested in what they law allows/should allow.