Teach First or PCGE?
Hi, just finishing my second year of my English Literature degree and would love to go into teaching, but I'm quite unaware of the schemes available to get into teaching. I know Teach First offer about a 20K starting salary whilst learning/teaching, but the PCGE comes with a £9000 bursary (considering I get a 2:1 in my course!). I feel quite in the dark here, so if somebody that has gone through these courses could let me know how they got on that'd be much appreciated! Is one particularly harder or better than the other? Does one lead on to better job opportunities (outside teaching too?), and which works out with a better salary?
Thanks!
Thanks!
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Hiya, I'm in my third year and just about to start the Teach First programme 
Objectively you would be financially better off with Teach first (your fees will be paid for by TF and you'll be on a salary for the two years training whereas with a PGCE you're not going to be paid even if you have a bursary). After the training's over though, I'd expect a PGCE and TF teacher to have the same salary as long as no one was promoted etc (you might have a higher chance of being promoted faster as a Teach Firster as you'd have already been part of the school for two years).
Teach First is widely understood to be extremely difficult (of course, so is a PGCE but with Teach First you're thrown in the 'deep end' so to speak) but if you do get accepted on you're virtually guaranteed to be good enough to complete it. There is a third option you may want to explore which is Schools Direct, and is quite comparable to Teach First. There's a salaried and non-salaried version - I believe you'll only be eligible for non-salaried as you don't have 3 years work experience, but this is to my knowledge a bit of a middle ground between PGCEs and Teach First, as you'll be spending a lot more time in the classroom.
Finally, Teach First has a lot of links to companies such as Accenture and PwC, which was something that swayed the decision for me. I wanted a teaching qualification but I also really didn't want to close myself off to other options. You can definitely change careers after a PGCE of course, but TF literally helps you do this through paid summer internships and so on.
Hope this helped and wasn't too much of a wall of text If only I was so enthusiastic with writing my dissertation... Let me know if you have any questions but as I say, I've not actually started yet! There's definitely some people around here though who have already completed TF or PGCEs that can answer better!
Objectively you would be financially better off with Teach first (your fees will be paid for by TF and you'll be on a salary for the two years training whereas with a PGCE you're not going to be paid even if you have a bursary). After the training's over though, I'd expect a PGCE and TF teacher to have the same salary as long as no one was promoted etc (you might have a higher chance of being promoted faster as a Teach Firster as you'd have already been part of the school for two years). Teach First is widely understood to be extremely difficult (of course, so is a PGCE but with Teach First you're thrown in the 'deep end' so to speak) but if you do get accepted on you're virtually guaranteed to be good enough to complete it. There is a third option you may want to explore which is Schools Direct, and is quite comparable to Teach First. There's a salaried and non-salaried version - I believe you'll only be eligible for non-salaried as you don't have 3 years work experience, but this is to my knowledge a bit of a middle ground between PGCEs and Teach First, as you'll be spending a lot more time in the classroom.
Finally, Teach First has a lot of links to companies such as Accenture and PwC, which was something that swayed the decision for me. I wanted a teaching qualification but I also really didn't want to close myself off to other options. You can definitely change careers after a PGCE of course, but TF literally helps you do this through paid summer internships and so on.
Hope this helped and wasn't too much of a wall of text
If only I was so enthusiastic with writing my dissertation... Let me know if you have any questions but as I say, I've not actually started yet! There's definitely some people around here though who have already completed TF or PGCEs that can answer better!I'd go with TF. Tough, but worth it imo.
Many of the in school benefits of Teach First can be had with a SCITT, as you are in school also. It would also be a 1 year course, rather than 2. That does have advantages with career progression - after 2 years you have finished you NQT year and can start building a career, rather than just starting your NQT year.
Jobswise, all providers are keen for their students to get jobs, it is in their interest.
I wouldnt do teach first because of the 2 year nature of it, and the dropping in at the deep end at the start.
With a SCITT it is a more managed introduction.
However as a Geography Graduate, I get a bigger bursary which removes the financial pressure of the course.
But, yes, you have to pay fees etc.
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Jobswise, all providers are keen for their students to get jobs, it is in their interest.
I wouldnt do teach first because of the 2 year nature of it, and the dropping in at the deep end at the start.
With a SCITT it is a more managed introduction.
However as a Geography Graduate, I get a bigger bursary which removes the financial pressure of the course.
But, yes, you have to pay fees etc.
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by CantsBants
Hi, just finishing my second year of my English Literature degree and would love to go into teaching, but I'm quite unaware of the schemes available to get into teaching. I know Teach First offer about a 20K starting salary whilst learning/teaching, but the PCGE comes with a £9000 bursary (considering I get a 2:1 in my course!). I feel quite in the dark here, so if somebody that has gone through these courses could let me know how they got on that'd be much appreciated! Is one particularly harder or better than the other? Does one lead on to better job opportunities (outside teaching too?), and which works out with a better salary?
Thanks!
Thanks!
There is another option. It is called Premier Pathways. It is 2 years like Teach First. The difference is that you start off working as a Teaching Assistant and then work your way up to a teacher. You end up with a PGCE from University of Buckingham. I think this programme is a good option if you don't want to immediately be given the responsibility of handling a whole class that Teach First gives you. You can also apply any time in the year whereas Teach First has a deadline
Original post by Jenfu
Teach First is widely understood to be extremely difficult (of course, so is a PGCE but with Teach First you're thrown in the 'deep end' so to speak) but if you do get accepted on you're virtually guaranteed to be good enough to complete it. There is a third option you may want to explore which is Schools Direct, and is quite comparable to Teach First. There's a salaried and non-salaried version - I believe you'll only be eligible for non-salaried as you don't have 3 years work experience, but this is to my knowledge a bit of a middle ground between PGCEs and Teach First, as you'll be spending a lot more time in the classroom.
Teach First is widely understood to be extremely difficult (of course, so is a PGCE but with Teach First you're thrown in the 'deep end' so to speak) but if you do get accepted on you're virtually guaranteed to be good enough to complete it. There is a third option you may want to explore which is Schools Direct, and is quite comparable to Teach First. There's a salaried and non-salaried version - I believe you'll only be eligible for non-salaried as you don't have 3 years work experience, but this is to my knowledge a bit of a middle ground between PGCEs and Teach First, as you'll be spending a lot more time in the classroom.
The only difference between a standard university led PGCE and School Direct course is that you apply to a school for school direct and therefore know where your first placement will be before you start. The school direct salaried places are few and far between but to all intents, my School Direct course is the same as the university one. I share lectures and university days with the core people.
As for teach first. I went to their sales pitch and didn't buy it. I have absolutely no idea why becoming a teacher has to be linked with big business. It felt to me that Teach First was a proxy for getting people into business having done their management apprenticeship in a school. Teaching is after all just management.
Having met a TF student this year I was amazed at how little support he had been given. He literally turned up on day one and was thrown in. He didn't seem to be getting much training or support. By contrast, university and school led courses have intense training sessions on everything from behaviour management to pedagogical ideologies, assessment techniques and planning.
Each to their own I guess, but I wasn't impressed by TF at all.
Good luck!
Original post by CantsBants
Hi, just finishing my second year of my English Literature degree and would love to go into teaching, but I'm quite unaware of the schemes available to get into teaching. I know Teach First offer about a 20K starting salary whilst learning/teaching, but the PCGE comes with a £9000 bursary (considering I get a 2:1 in my course!). I feel quite in the dark here, so if somebody that has gone through these courses could let me know how they got on that'd be much appreciated! Is one particularly harder or better than the other? Does one lead on to better job opportunities (outside teaching too?), and which works out with a better salary?
Thanks!
Thanks!
PLEASE don't do Teach First - it's a great idea but most people are failed by it.
I'm a teacher and several times I've been asked to go and help someone in another school who is being failed by TF. Much of the time schools are taking on people but they aren't supernumerary and they end up teaching too many lessons. You need experience and to understand pedagogy to be a good teacher and you don't learn this in a few weeks.
If you are serious about teacher then avoid TF.
I really don't understand the negative attitude towards TF. They have a proven track record. The biggest problem is the luck of the draw of what school you will be placed in. So long as it isn't some schools in London which come to mind for me, you'll most likely be a successful teacher should you pass their assessment centre.
Hey,
Take a Look at Teach in Qualified. It's two year but salaried and trains you through both years, unlike premier pathways it actually trains you over both years, when I met premier pathways they said you just work as a TA for a year then do a PGCE while teaching a full schedule (Like teach first but worse, because a PGCE is like doing a degree while teaching mostly a full schedule). It depends what you want though, I wanted a gradual and salaried intro to teaching, where I didn't pay any fees, which is what the course im about to start (Teach in qualified) is. I looked at teach first but they have a really high dropout rate for teaching, and I didn't feel confident enough for it.
that's what I decided anyway.
Take a Look at Teach in Qualified. It's two year but salaried and trains you through both years, unlike premier pathways it actually trains you over both years, when I met premier pathways they said you just work as a TA for a year then do a PGCE while teaching a full schedule (Like teach first but worse, because a PGCE is like doing a degree while teaching mostly a full schedule). It depends what you want though, I wanted a gradual and salaried intro to teaching, where I didn't pay any fees, which is what the course im about to start (Teach in qualified) is. I looked at teach first but they have a really high dropout rate for teaching, and I didn't feel confident enough for it.
that's what I decided anyway.
Original post by Sarahxxkeane
Hey,
Take a Look at Teach in Qualified. It's two year but salaried and trains you through both years, unlike premier pathways it actually trains you over both years, when I met premier pathways they said you just work as a TA for a year then do a PGCE while teaching a full schedule (Like teach first but worse, because a PGCE is like doing a degree while teaching mostly a full schedule). It depends what you want though, I wanted a gradual and salaried intro to teaching, where I didn't pay any fees, which is what the course im about to start (Teach in qualified) is. I looked at teach first but they have a really high dropout rate for teaching, and I didn't feel confident enough for it.
that's what I decided anyway.
Take a Look at Teach in Qualified. It's two year but salaried and trains you through both years, unlike premier pathways it actually trains you over both years, when I met premier pathways they said you just work as a TA for a year then do a PGCE while teaching a full schedule (Like teach first but worse, because a PGCE is like doing a degree while teaching mostly a full schedule). It depends what you want though, I wanted a gradual and salaried intro to teaching, where I didn't pay any fees, which is what the course im about to start (Teach in qualified) is. I looked at teach first but they have a really high dropout rate for teaching, and I didn't feel confident enough for it.
that's what I decided anyway.
I've heard good things about them too, as a school based route.
Who from? TiQ only launched in October last year, so if you allow some time for recruitment and usual checks etc, then at best someone has 7/8 months done from a 2 year placement?
If your going down this route, be prepared to be a guinea pig and ask them to state what happens if they go bust (they are a recruitment company, not an education provider) and what happens if the stop doing the scheme or the SCITT provider you are supposed to work with in year 2 pulls out.
On paper it looks great, but you have to ask the question is it too good? If it works, why arent more people doing this?
Posted from TSR Mobile
If your going down this route, be prepared to be a guinea pig and ask them to state what happens if they go bust (they are a recruitment company, not an education provider) and what happens if the stop doing the scheme or the SCITT provider you are supposed to work with in year 2 pulls out.
On paper it looks great, but you have to ask the question is it too good? If it works, why arent more people doing this?
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by bob0079
Who from? TiQ only launched in October last year, so if you allow some time for recruitment and usual checks etc, then at best someone has 7/8 months done from a 2 year placement?
If your going down this route, be prepared to be a guinea pig and ask them to state what happens if they go bust (they are a recruitment company, not an education provider) and what happens if the stop doing the scheme or the SCITT provider you are supposed to work with in year 2 pulls out.
On paper it looks great, but you have to ask the question is it too good? If it works, why arent more people doing this?
Posted from TSR Mobile
If your going down this route, be prepared to be a guinea pig and ask them to state what happens if they go bust (they are a recruitment company, not an education provider) and what happens if the stop doing the scheme or the SCITT provider you are supposed to work with in year 2 pulls out.
On paper it looks great, but you have to ask the question is it too good? If it works, why arent more people doing this?
Posted from TSR Mobile
you work with the provider over both years on tiq, and surely you could transfer to another provider or agency? although i'd say it's fairly unlikley, it didn't seem as though the provider or company was brand new, just the course itself.
You may assume lots things regarding transfer of courses, but if they are the only people running this type of course, who is there to transfer or fecognise what you have done.
Yes the company may well have been around a while, but it could still go under. Or simply decide that the scheme is not making them money so pull it. They may fall out with the SCITT provider. As far as I can tell, the school you are in pay TIQ for you to be there, which then pays your wage, the wages for the support staff and also your £9k course fee. Thats a lot of cash for a cash strapped school to pay for. What if they decide they cant afford you anymore?
The course may well run smoothly and people come out with the qualifications they want, but to go into it without your eyes fully open to what may happen is just naive.
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Yes the company may well have been around a while, but it could still go under. Or simply decide that the scheme is not making them money so pull it. They may fall out with the SCITT provider. As far as I can tell, the school you are in pay TIQ for you to be there, which then pays your wage, the wages for the support staff and also your £9k course fee. Thats a lot of cash for a cash strapped school to pay for. What if they decide they cant afford you anymore?
The course may well run smoothly and people come out with the qualifications they want, but to go into it without your eyes fully open to what may happen is just naive.
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For sure I think it's harder on the TF course, you get 6 weeks training prior to going into a school, and yes, they're tough schools! If you want an easier start in teaching, I would go with the PGCE and go into a Good school. If you want to really try and make a difference to some of the hardest to reach kids, I would go TF. Also on TFyou get a PGDE which is worth more credits and you can go on to do the MA
Good luck with what you choose.
Good luck with what you choose.
My niece did PGCE and there's a lot of misconception about it being easier. In the PGCE very little time is spent at university. Students work at between 3 and 4 different placement schools, on a full-time basis covering classes allocated to the PGCE students. Only the odd week was spent at university, all other time was spent in class and assignments had to be completed in evenings and weekends. My niece had a bursary of about £400 per month which just covered her travel and expenses, students basically work for free and the school where she worked had 10 PGCE students covering classes (which saved the school a great deal of money). After completion it is a nightmare to find a Primary NQT contract. Even though there are plenty of vacancies, especially in primary with the higher number of female teachers going on maternity leave, universities, School Direct, SCITT and other organisations are churning out many more graduates each year. My niece was one of the luckier graduates as she is just about to complete her NQT year, although she still hasn't found a job for September. About 40% of her PGCE cohort haven't even been able to find an NQT job and so their teaching careers have hardly started. My niece is now in the unenviable position of competing for primary jobs against new graduates who are cheaper to employ. Even if you are lucky enough to be offered a primary job, contracts are mostly for one year only because Head Teachers cannot be certain about future budgets. My niece has been shortlisted for every job she has applied for, in some cases she was up against male graduates who are usually the preferred candidate (even against stronger female candidates) due to the low numbers of male primary teachers. At other interviews she was advised that she didn't have enough experience teaching older years, this was evident on her CV but she was invited for interview only to make up the numbers and meet Local Authority shortlisting requirements. Most of the teachers she is working with now have been teaching for 6 years of more, but on yearly contracts. It is impossible for them to apply for a mortgage in their name only. Considering the debt students take on to become teachers, the system treats them as fodder with many left on the scrap heap, or they take jobs outside of teaching where graduates are better paid and more valued. Think very carefully before going into teaching, whichever method of training you chose.
Original post by Sarahxxkeane
Hey,
Take a Look at Teach in Qualified. It's two year but salaried and trains you through both years, unlike premier pathways it actually trains you over both years, when I met premier pathways they said you just work as a TA for a year then do a PGCE while teaching a full schedule (Like teach first but worse, because a PGCE is like doing a degree while teaching mostly a full schedule). It depends what you want though, I wanted a gradual and salaried intro to teaching, where I didn't pay any fees, which is what the course im about to start (Teach in qualified) is. I looked at teach first but they have a really high dropout rate for teaching, and I didn't feel confident enough for it.
that's what I decided anyway.
Take a Look at Teach in Qualified. It's two year but salaried and trains you through both years, unlike premier pathways it actually trains you over both years, when I met premier pathways they said you just work as a TA for a year then do a PGCE while teaching a full schedule (Like teach first but worse, because a PGCE is like doing a degree while teaching mostly a full schedule). It depends what you want though, I wanted a gradual and salaried intro to teaching, where I didn't pay any fees, which is what the course im about to start (Teach in qualified) is. I looked at teach first but they have a really high dropout rate for teaching, and I didn't feel confident enough for it.
that's what I decided anyway.
Hey could you please let me know how your experience with TIQ has gone? I am debating on which path to go on.. wither TIQ or Premier Pathways! TIA xx
Original post by Lucy39
Hey could you please let me know how your experience with TIQ has gone? I am debating on which path to go on.. wither TIQ or Premier Pathways! TIA xx
I don't know about TIQ but I would avoid Premier Pathways. There are colleagues at my school who did PP and have negative things to say about it. Premier Pathways seems like Teach First in the sense that they just dump you straight into a teacher's timetable within the first week.
Original post by thetolkienist
I don't know about TIQ but I would avoid Premier Pathways. There are colleagues at my school who did PP and have negative things to say about it. Premier Pathways seems like Teach First in the sense that they just dump you straight into a teacher's timetable within the first week.
Ohh really? During their first year? Can you find out a little bit more for me as I want to make sure that I can start with a teaching assistant role and then move onto the full time role.
I have some school experience already, but didn't complete my last placement due to injury/illness. I feel the a university PGCE route would be too intense and expensive.. and a paid SCITT would be just as difficult and expensive.
Too many decisions to make!
Teach First
Learning through practical experience instead of theory
Experience from day 1. You'll have more experience and knowledge by the end your NQT year compared to your university peers
Build relationship with your students and see they grown throughout the year
Get the PGDE (advanced PGCE) completely paid for
No need to do apply for or do university interviews, you get automatically accepted
Working alongside someone of the brightest and most driven graduates from top uni's
Keep career options open and let's you develop a large network in and out of teaching
Being part of the largest graduate employer and the prestige that comes with it
Subsidised masters in education leadership with a guaranteed place
Accelerated career progression by completing the Teach First programme
University route
Eases you in to teaching with a gradual build up of teaching hours
More support and contact hours of tutors
Develop a better understanding of pedagogy and the theories behind it
Get to choose where in the UK you are based and what subject you will teach
Better work life balance
Regular visits to the university which breaks up the week
Experience of visiting a number of different schools
More time spent observing senior teachers and getting new ideas
Less pressure of delivering results off the bat
Financially
Unless you are getting the maximum possible bursary for your course, you are financially better off with Teach First
Teach First: First year salary is Unqualified Level 2 pay: £18367 - PGCE cost (£0) - Tax = £15870
University route: Bursary: £26000 - PGCE cost (£9000) = £17000
Bursary: £15000 - PGCE cost (£9000) = £6000
Bursary: £9000 - PGCE cost (£9000) = £0
Conclusion
Having done my teacher training I can honestly say that the best route really depends on the person. Both have their positives which I have tried to outline above. They suit different types of people, so ask yourself what way do you learn best and whether you are sure about being a career long teacher to pick the one the suits you.
Learning through practical experience instead of theory
Experience from day 1. You'll have more experience and knowledge by the end your NQT year compared to your university peers
Build relationship with your students and see they grown throughout the year
Get the PGDE (advanced PGCE) completely paid for
No need to do apply for or do university interviews, you get automatically accepted
Working alongside someone of the brightest and most driven graduates from top uni's
Keep career options open and let's you develop a large network in and out of teaching
Being part of the largest graduate employer and the prestige that comes with it
Subsidised masters in education leadership with a guaranteed place
Accelerated career progression by completing the Teach First programme
University route
Eases you in to teaching with a gradual build up of teaching hours
More support and contact hours of tutors
Develop a better understanding of pedagogy and the theories behind it
Get to choose where in the UK you are based and what subject you will teach
Better work life balance
Regular visits to the university which breaks up the week
Experience of visiting a number of different schools
More time spent observing senior teachers and getting new ideas
Less pressure of delivering results off the bat
Financially
Unless you are getting the maximum possible bursary for your course, you are financially better off with Teach First
Teach First: First year salary is Unqualified Level 2 pay: £18367 - PGCE cost (£0) - Tax = £15870
University route: Bursary: £26000 - PGCE cost (£9000) = £17000
Bursary: £15000 - PGCE cost (£9000) = £6000
Bursary: £9000 - PGCE cost (£9000) = £0
Conclusion
Having done my teacher training I can honestly say that the best route really depends on the person. Both have their positives which I have tried to outline above. They suit different types of people, so ask yourself what way do you learn best and whether you are sure about being a career long teacher to pick the one the suits you.
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