Why are people supporting Erdogan and AKP?

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Reply 80

KimKallstrom

Original post by swiss_cheese

But Erdogan isn't exactly a dictator, he was democratically elected.

So was Mussolini.............

Reply 81

swiss_cheese

Original post by KimKallstrom

So was Mussolini.............

So? There are still many more things Erdogan would have to do that would class him as a dictator

Reply 82

JabaDaba12

Original post by M14B

Turkey has nuclear weapons????

It has a nuclear weapons base containing about 60 warheads, they belong to the US but they're on Turkish territory.

Reply 83

welshiee

Original post by KimKallstrom

So was Mussolini.............

So was Hitler. Its as if democratically elected totalitarians cannot be in power.
These people are clueless.

Original post by welshiee

So was Hitler. Its as if democratically elected totalitarians cannot be in power.
These people are clueless.

I don't support Erdogan. I was just answering your question as to why people support him.

Reply 86

AlifunArnab

Original post by welshiee

Why are there idiots supporting this vile and evil human being?

a) He is an Islamist who wants to erode the secularism in Turkey
b) He has contempt for democracy and has openly admitted it
c) Turkey under him has turned into a nation of chaos and civil war
d) He wants to establish a dictatorship and its becoming more apparent
e) He's purging all opposition - military, judges, anyone that is not with him
f) He had a pre-prepared list of people to purge - are you seriously trying to tell me that hours after the coup attempt he and the police had identified thousands of people involved? Get real.

The entire situation currently reminds me of The Night of the Long Knives and is incredibly worrying. Look at how similar the situations are and you'll see why it is worrying.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_the_Long_Knives

We are seeing the rise of a dictator in Turkey and people are celebrating like its a good thing.

Why?

Because he's Sultan Erdogan.

Reply 87

M14B

Original post by JabaDaba12

It has a nuclear weapons base containing about 60 warheads, they belong to the US but they're on Turkish territory.

Then they are Nato warheads

Reply 88

username3454974

Original post by JabaDaba12

I'm glad the army lost, the coup was so poorly planned could you imagine those idiots in charge of nuclear weapons and containing ISIS?

Yeah let's just put a bunch of soldiers in the street at 7pm who don't even want to use force, that'll really scare them off.

In Turkey, once boys finish school, they have to be sent to the army for 18 months and they go to war. Those soldiers on the street where boys, mostly around 21 years old, who were forced to be there. They didn't know what there were doing. They were told to hurt civilians, can you blame them for not wanting to use force? Some of them were killed in horrific ways. One of the boys were beheaded. It wasn't their fault.

Reply 89

The Epicurean

Original post by Gora The Xplorer

OP is a nice guy, but he should respect the choices other people make in the same way that brexit should be respected. Not everyone wants to be European.

Just because something was chosen by a majority democratically, does not mean one should necessarily respect it. If for example you believe Brexit will harm the economy, why then should you respect Brexit? In fact, I think it important that minority opinions and criticisms are heard and that they play a vital role in a democratic nation. To take an extreme example; if the majority of people in the UK voted to relegalise slavery, would you respect that?

Original post by Gora The Xplorer

Across the entire globe, most people hate the West and they hate Western culture.

Do you have any sources for this?

Reply 90

PTMalewski

Original post by swiss_cheese

Because a military coup would turn Turkey into the next Syria, do you really want something like that next to Greece? Europe would collapse.

The Army had overthrew Turkish governments several times in the past, and it didn't turn Turkey into Syria. It was army's job, to protect the country from rules of democratically elected Islamist governments, and they were doing it well in the past.

Original post by welshiee

Because the post-Ataturk Turkey was pretty corrupted and mismanaged, people had enough of that. You see the effects of corruption, bad management and weak economy everyday, but it's difficult to realise how important the rule of law, pluralism and secular state are.
Ataturk managed to reform Turkey instantly, but he did not manage to remove religious sentiments, that is simply not possible within decades. Since the post-Ataturk governments had some obvious flaws, a politician who is better and more efficient in terms of economy and administration and labels himself with "nice" traditional, religious approach, can very simply get support of people, especially those poorer and without political education.

That is, lets be honest, a flaw of democracy, it is a rule of people who have no education of brains to decide how country should develop, what system it should have etc.

Original post by Rakas21

When will people accept that not all cultures are equal. You can't apply our institutional values in an Arab State, they are similar too culturally inferior. :angry:

I think that after another 100 years of democracy, European culture may also downgrade itself to something too inferior for democracy.
Take any complex system, governed by people, and replace specialists with random people without proper education or experience. It's very likely the system will continue to work for some time, but sooner or later it'll fail.

(edited 6 years ago)

Reply 91

Happy97

President Erdogan is the democratically elected leader of Turkey. Some people don't like him because he doesn't grovel to the West, is unashamedly proud of his Muslim heritage and serves the interests of Turkey before the interests of NATO. Well, they can keep on hating. Erdogan will continue to rule Turkey until he is voted out. And if the Turks want a more Islamic country, that is their democratic right.

Democracy shouldn't be selective, where it is only encouraged if the populace will vote for a Western lackey.

Reply 92

PTMalewski

Original post by Happy97

And if the Turks want a more Islamic country, that is their democratic right.

Yes. When they vote they want want to destroy their country, that will also be their democratic right.

Original post by Happy97

Democracy shouldn't be selective, where it is only encouraged if the populace will vote for a Western lackey.

You're wrong. Democracy should be selective, otherwise two wolves can democratically decide to eat one sheep.
Erdogan effectively removes the separation of powers, which leads to totalitarian democracy.

Reply 93

Happy97

Original post by PTMalewski

That is a straw-man argument.
People have problem with Erdogan because he locked up in prisons more journalists than Vladymir Putin in Russia.
No to mention university professors loosing their job for expressing opinion- that is absolutely disgraceful and unacceptable in the modern world.

Yes. When they vote they want want to destroy their country, that will also be their democratic right.

You're wrong. Democracy should be selective, otherwise two wolves can democratically decide to eat one sheep.
Erdogan effectively removes the separation of powers, which leads to totalitarian democracy.

I disagree. It is undemocratic to ignore the will of the people when you don't like who is being elected. A bit of double-standards there mate, a lot of people would prefer if Theresa May wasn't re-elected but, and this is the important but, no one has called for a coup because of their dislike towards her.

Furthermore, the so called 'journalists' who are in prison have been found guilty of many crimes including treason. Good on Erdogan for for locking them up, the UK would've done the same if they had been in Turkey's situation. The same goes for the professors who were a part of a fifth column, 'Gulenists' who for decades were planning a state takeover.

All these crocodile tears coming from Western countries regarding the alleged 'descend into dictatorship' are fake. The truth is, they are angry and anxious because the coup failed and their stooges (Gulenists) were unsuccessful. The Wests is now bit**ing and complaining because their plan to turn Turkey into the next Syria/Libya/Iraq have failed, so spare me the fake outrage.

Reply 94

PTMalewski

Original post by Happy97

It is undemocratic to ignore the will of the people when you don't like who is being elected.

Yes, it is undemocratic, but absolute democracy is pathological. Every form of power must be limited, otherwise it will create a group of people who persecute other groups.

Original post by Happy97

A bit of double-standards there mate, a lot of people would prefer if Theresa May wasn't re-elected but, and this is the important but, no one has called for a coup because of their dislike towards her.

It is not a matter of dislike, it is a matter of making sure that harmful ideas and authoritarian or private interests don't rule a whole country.
Just read works of Montesquieu, deToqcueville, and the Defense of Socrates by Plato, then you'll see that every government must have limited power, and that unlimited democracy is as bad as dictatorship.

Original post by Happy97

Furthermore, the so called 'journalists' who are in prison have been found guilty

Says who? On what evidence?
And this is totally b*****. You can have some journalists guilty of some crimes, sure, but not more than in Russia. The numbers are unlikely too big for a real crime issue.

Original post by Happy97

of many crimes including treason.

Sure, a journalist guilty of treason.- What have they done, they've sold publicly avaible info to the Kurds?

Original post by Happy97

Good on Erdogan for for locking them up, the UK would've done the same if they had been in Turkey's situation. The same goes for the professors who were a part of a fifth column, 'Gulenists' who for decades were planning a state takeover.

And they were so stupid to wait untill they lost control over everything, right?
If they were planning a takeover, then why they are allowed to walk freely on streets, while journalists got locked up in prisons?
Such dangerous people, should be locked up in prisons, if there is any evidence of their crimes.

Original post by Happy97

All these crocodile tears coming from Western countries regarding the alleged 'descend into dictatorship' are fake. The truth is, they are angry and anxious because the coup failed and their stooges (Gulenists) were unsuccessful. The Wests is now bit**ing and complaining because their plan to turn Turkey into the next Syria/Libya/Iraq have failed, so spare me the fake outrage.

Sounds like a statement of Turkish public propaganda fan.
The west has absolutely no interest in turning Turkey into another Syria. You should listen more to the opposite site, and read more about political history.

Reply 95

uberteknik

"Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely."
-Lord John Dalberg-Acton

Erdogan may be democratically elected in the first instance, but he has used the failed coup as an ideal opportunity to ride on popular opinion and silence any and all opposition or critical thought against his regime. In other words democracy is of no further use to him, indeed, democracy is seen as a threat and so he is systematically dismantling the very thing that brought him to power. Democracy is the Trojan Horse that hides his true intent.

The Turkish proletariate have made a rod for their own backs.

(edited 6 years ago)

Reply 96

Assadullah1214

Original post by welshiee

There country , there choice.

Reply 97

SMEGGGY

He's a dictator but Turks Are **** scared to rise up like Middle East did a few uears ago.

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Reply 98

PTMalewski

Original post by Assadullah1214

There country , there choice.

Negative. If this was the case, of Nowhere, at the end of the world, we would have ignored it. But Turkey is vital for security of the European continent. The problem is, that nobody seems to have a good idea of what should actually be done.

Of course, if they want to chop their own heads off, that is their problem, but I wouldn't like to see a home war in Turkey, or Turkey turning very much towards Islam. Both would be very dangerous for the European continent. Also, if Turkey falls out from the NATO, which may happen if they keep going towards their current attitude, the Russians are more likely try to go for Transsinistria, and this would create a situation in the first place very bad for economies both of EU and Russia, and the generally nervous situation may cause a bigger war by accident.
Moreover, we really need some years of peace and calm in Europe, because nationalism and xenophobia are rising their heads, and it's not a problem for any migrants. It's a problem for internal policy of the states, and the migrant crisis only fuels up, these fear-based sentiments.