Original post by a_m15
Is it possible to go from doing an undergraduate pharmacy course to an undergraduate medicine course???
Yes, finish the pharmacy degree and apply for graduate entry medicine during your pre-reg year.
Original post by Democracy
Yes, finish the pharmacy degree and apply for graduate entry medicine during your pre-reg year.
With graduate entry Medicine, are past A’ levels taken into account or is a 2:1 in Pharmacy or a Bsc hons science degree sufficient for entry?
Original post by Ambitious1999
With graduate entry Medicine, are past A’ levels taken into account or is a 2:1 in Pharmacy or a Bsc hons science degree sufficient for entry?
I'm sorry, a 2:1 is probably not good enough. A Levels will be considered by the vast majority of institutions. Offer rates for graduate medicine are about 10%. So I would imagine those who are offered places are very highly qualified.
I edited the post because Volibear rightfully noted that although chances are slim, they're not zero.
(edited 6 years ago)
Original post by Volibear
Some take A-levels into consideration, such as Liverpool, others just care about your degree and nothing before that, such as St George's.
Did you look at any GEM entry requirements before posting this?
Did you look at any GEM entry requirements before posting this?
Yes. Just because they state 2:1, doesn't mean a 2:1 will get you in. Some course websites specifically reference A Levels, but I am sure that everywhere will consider them.
I was also looking at this:
http://puu.sh/zuXch/3787dd3ca7.jpg
Do you really think any significant proportion of those 6% receiving offers hold 2:1s?
Original post by Volibear
Some medical schools make it clear if they prefer those with a first or high 2:1 (Birmingham), whilst others don't. You just have to look at the admissions threads each year to see that plenty of people get offers with 2:1. King's will even consider (and give offers to) people who have a 2:2 if they have a higher qualification. GEM is sometimes a last resort for people with terrible A-level grades and they get offers and do you know why that is? Because they apply to medical schools that don't consider A-levels. I went to the St George's open day and asked if they even distinguish between a high 2:1 and a low 2:1 and they don't. Once you have a 2:1, you're guaranteed an interview if your GAMSAT score is good enough. I'd rather believe them that somebody like you.
A 2:1 is the most common degree classification so I would say a large proportion of GEM offer holders have that, especially if they applied to medical schools that ask for a 2:1 minimum. Once again, look at the entry threads on TSR.
Also, maybe you should actually look at the entry requirements for each GEM medical school since you're so 'sure' that you know what they do, before telling people that a '2:1 isn't good enough' and 'A-levels will definitely be considered'.
A 2:1 is the most common degree classification so I would say a large proportion of GEM offer holders have that, especially if they applied to medical schools that ask for a 2:1 minimum. Once again, look at the entry threads on TSR.
Also, maybe you should actually look at the entry requirements for each GEM medical school since you're so 'sure' that you know what they do, before telling people that a '2:1 isn't good enough' and 'A-levels will definitely be considered'.
Kings? You mean the place that makes 1 offer per 25 applicants? Fine, I retract the statement in that what I said sounded too definitive. However, the point I was making that it is very competitive, and mediocre A Levels and a 2:1 will not put you in a good position to be offered a place.
Original post by Volibear
Mediocre A-levels will not put you in the position to be offered a place if the medical school considers A-levels and yours aren't good enough. Do you understand this?
A 2:1 will not put you in a good position if the medical school has a preference for first class degrees or high 2:1s (and the applicant doesn't have this). Do you understand this?
I just had a look at the Swansea GEM course. Their typical offer is a 2:1.
Newvastle's GEM course: "Please note: A Level and GCSE results for graduate applicants will have no direct bearing on the decision to interview or offer a place. This also applies for Masters qualifications."
Warwick's GEM course: "We do not consider your A-level or GCSE examination results. Please note that any pending postgraduate qualifications must be fully completed prior to the course start date, with no exceptions."
It is competitive but all the stuff you are saying is nonsense. The best way to boost your chances of getting a medical school offer is to apply strategically. People who clearly don't fit into what you think is a good enough application, get offers each year. Once again, if you look at the past application threads, 'perfect' applicants (PhD, first, hight UKCAT etc) to the ultra competitive King's GEP course get rejected, and people that aren't as 'perfect' get offers. If OP has a 2:1 and mediocre A-levels, they still have as good a chance as anybody else if they apply strategically.
I would suggest that anybody pays more attention to the course entry requirements than somebody who clearly thinks the universities are lying about what they are looking for.
A 2:1 will not put you in a good position if the medical school has a preference for first class degrees or high 2:1s (and the applicant doesn't have this). Do you understand this?
I just had a look at the Swansea GEM course. Their typical offer is a 2:1.
Newvastle's GEM course: "Please note: A Level and GCSE results for graduate applicants will have no direct bearing on the decision to interview or offer a place. This also applies for Masters qualifications."
Warwick's GEM course: "We do not consider your A-level or GCSE examination results. Please note that any pending postgraduate qualifications must be fully completed prior to the course start date, with no exceptions."
It is competitive but all the stuff you are saying is nonsense. The best way to boost your chances of getting a medical school offer is to apply strategically. People who clearly don't fit into what you think is a good enough application, get offers each year. Once again, if you look at the past application threads, 'perfect' applicants (PhD, first, hight UKCAT etc) to the ultra competitive King's GEP course get rejected, and people that aren't as 'perfect' get offers. If OP has a 2:1 and mediocre A-levels, they still have as good a chance as anybody else if they apply strategically.
I would suggest that anybody pays more attention to the course entry requirements than somebody who clearly thinks the universities are lying about what they are looking for.
"as good a chance as anybody else" Yup, but that chance isn't very good. I admitted that I got some things wrong; you're clearly more informed than me. I may have been too harsh, but you seem like you're suggesting that you can rock up with a middling upper second class degree and have a good chance of getting in. Yes, there are exceptions and anecdotes, but the reality is that most people with the qualifications you described won't get in, and a First would increase their chances.
As regards the thinking "universities are lying about what they are looking for". Cambridge medicine has a standard offer of A*A*A. What percentage of accepted applicants do you think achieved A*A*A?
Wait for it...
Wait for it...
1%!!! (The other 99% did better)
So yeah, meeting the minimum requirements does not mean you have a good change of acceptance for competitive courses. Here's the link in case you don't believe me: https://unistats.ac.uk/subjects/entry/10007788FT-UG_MDBX_KIS/ReturnTo/Search
Also, your second paragraph is just silly. "if the medical school has a preference for first class degrees or high 2:1s." There are no medical schools that would prefer a 2:2 or would be ambivalent to one's degree class.
Original post by Volibear
I'm glad to see you're backtracking on everything you're saying. Hopefully OP will realise to not give anything you've said any attention.
Ah yes, Cambridge medicine. I thought we were discussing GEM entry, not school leaver entry. Anyway, people do get in with A*A*A though, don't they? You seem to think that somebody with a great overall application but lacking that crucial extra A* shouldn't even bother. People will apply and even if the odds are against them, some of them will get offers, and I repeat, if it is a strategic place to apply for them, who's to stop them? If they've done the research they will be very aware of the stats and don't need quality advice like yours. 60% of applicants are going to get four rejections in their first application cycle to medicine (even if they meet all the entry requirements and more) but you aren't telling them they have no chance, are you?
I never said that any prefered a 2:2. I said that medical schools, such as Birmingham and Barts, that have a preference for first class degrees, wouldn't be the most strategic place for somebody with a 2:1 or low 2:1 to apply to. Apply to St George's with 62% and a high GAMSAT score and you're as likely to get an interview as somebody with 69%. A first will only increase chances if the medical school distinguishes between that and a 2:1 and it's the deciding factor when considering the rest of the application. If the medical school considers everyone with a 2:1 and above equal, then it's not an issue. And once again, I suggest that applicants go by what the medical schools themselves say, than what people off TSR 'think' .I'm sorry I couldn't make this any clearer.
Ah yes, Cambridge medicine. I thought we were discussing GEM entry, not school leaver entry. Anyway, people do get in with A*A*A though, don't they? You seem to think that somebody with a great overall application but lacking that crucial extra A* shouldn't even bother. People will apply and even if the odds are against them, some of them will get offers, and I repeat, if it is a strategic place to apply for them, who's to stop them? If they've done the research they will be very aware of the stats and don't need quality advice like yours. 60% of applicants are going to get four rejections in their first application cycle to medicine (even if they meet all the entry requirements and more) but you aren't telling them they have no chance, are you?
I never said that any prefered a 2:2. I said that medical schools, such as Birmingham and Barts, that have a preference for first class degrees, wouldn't be the most strategic place for somebody with a 2:1 or low 2:1 to apply to. Apply to St George's with 62% and a high GAMSAT score and you're as likely to get an interview as somebody with 69%. A first will only increase chances if the medical school distinguishes between that and a 2:1 and it's the deciding factor when considering the rest of the application. If the medical school considers everyone with a 2:1 and above equal, then it's not an issue. And once again, I suggest that applicants go by what the medical schools themselves say, than what people off TSR 'think' .I'm sorry I couldn't make this any clearer.
But "Birmingham... ...have a preference for first class". Yeah, I'm pretty sure every institution would prefer first class. I know we were talking about GEM, but that doesn't invalidate my argument, unless you're suggesting that the example I gave is completely isolated. I had to use that because there aren't data available for GEM.
I get what you're saying, truly. If you can find me a few respectable medical school that say they do not differentiate between 2:1 and First, I will concede that you're right.
I really think you ought to take this into consideration. Just as background, I have a 2.2 in biomedicine from UEA and am on course for a distinction in my St. George’s MSc.
What Nagromicous is saying is completely logically and probably true, to a degree. A lot of GEM universities prefer higher grades, understandably. As stated, Birmingham are BIG on your BSc grade- this is explicitly stated by them. However, many universities do not give much indication to how heavily they weight it. Swansea, St. George’s, Plymouth, Nottingham, Warwick are all far more concerned with their relevant aptitude test scores, personal statement and interview scores etc. This is also true for graduates to applying to some 5 year standard entry courses.
This isn’t to say that degree classification isn’t a factor, but it most certainly isn’t as definitive as Nagro is suggesting - GEM is competitive, but nowhere near as competitive as people think. I think it’s right that about 5-10% of people applying get offers, but when you consider that for GAMSAT universities (a graduate aptitude test) interviews only go to the top 10-20% GAMSAT scorers. This, again, isn’t hugely off-putting as many people who do the GAMSAT haven’t revised/ haven’t revised properly/ are just trying their luck/ simply aren’t good enough. If you are doing well at uni and are able to think logically, and you prepare effectively you will do well in the GAMSAT. Those who meet the GAMSAT cut-offs get an interview, simply as, your degree classification is only considered as part of their entry requirements - there is no preference to higher grades, that’s what the GAMSAT is for. Interviews offers are based on GAMSAT score distribution.
Sure, many GEM offers go to people with a 1st, but that could be for a number of reasons other than “the universities prefer it”. Firstly, 1st class students are usually just that, first class - the best in other important aspects, too- better at lateral thinking, better preparation and organisational skills, better at writing, better at doing interviews, perhaps - equally, by the time you get to the interview stage they will likely make up a greater proportion of the pool. Because, again, they are quite likely to be the best of the original applicants. I don’t have evidence for this, but it’s an equally logical assumption to make, maybe more so, than “because universities prefer it”. If you think you’re on par with 1st class students in this respect, the it shouldn’t be a concern.
For most universities 2:1 is the average offer - is this because 2:1s are the best? Probably not, it’s the most common grade and just the result of standard distribution - if anything, the fact that the average offers goes to the average results is evidence that your grade has very little bearing once you get to the interview - and believe me, if your capable of doing the GAMSAT, it’s very easy to get interviews, so please don’t be discouraged.
As I said, I have a 2:2 and I don’t have an offer (yet, hopefully), but I have 4 interviews at St. George’s, Notts, Swansea and Kings(5 year). I will report back when I get responses, although, this will obviously be anecdotal. I got a 2.2 because I didn’t try hard enough in my BSc - however, I know I’d be capable of doing perfectly well in GEM - if you honestly think you are good enough, and have the entry requirements, then go for it. Simple as. Be smart when applying (ie avoid the Birmingham’s), but do not be discouraged overall. A lot of universities are very holistic (Swansea have actually said they are holistic), as you would hope for from this type of degree.
You are in a very good position to go for GEM - good luck.
What Nagromicous is saying is completely logically and probably true, to a degree. A lot of GEM universities prefer higher grades, understandably. As stated, Birmingham are BIG on your BSc grade- this is explicitly stated by them. However, many universities do not give much indication to how heavily they weight it. Swansea, St. George’s, Plymouth, Nottingham, Warwick are all far more concerned with their relevant aptitude test scores, personal statement and interview scores etc. This is also true for graduates to applying to some 5 year standard entry courses.
This isn’t to say that degree classification isn’t a factor, but it most certainly isn’t as definitive as Nagro is suggesting - GEM is competitive, but nowhere near as competitive as people think. I think it’s right that about 5-10% of people applying get offers, but when you consider that for GAMSAT universities (a graduate aptitude test) interviews only go to the top 10-20% GAMSAT scorers. This, again, isn’t hugely off-putting as many people who do the GAMSAT haven’t revised/ haven’t revised properly/ are just trying their luck/ simply aren’t good enough. If you are doing well at uni and are able to think logically, and you prepare effectively you will do well in the GAMSAT. Those who meet the GAMSAT cut-offs get an interview, simply as, your degree classification is only considered as part of their entry requirements - there is no preference to higher grades, that’s what the GAMSAT is for. Interviews offers are based on GAMSAT score distribution.
Sure, many GEM offers go to people with a 1st, but that could be for a number of reasons other than “the universities prefer it”. Firstly, 1st class students are usually just that, first class - the best in other important aspects, too- better at lateral thinking, better preparation and organisational skills, better at writing, better at doing interviews, perhaps - equally, by the time you get to the interview stage they will likely make up a greater proportion of the pool. Because, again, they are quite likely to be the best of the original applicants. I don’t have evidence for this, but it’s an equally logical assumption to make, maybe more so, than “because universities prefer it”. If you think you’re on par with 1st class students in this respect, the it shouldn’t be a concern.
For most universities 2:1 is the average offer - is this because 2:1s are the best? Probably not, it’s the most common grade and just the result of standard distribution - if anything, the fact that the average offers goes to the average results is evidence that your grade has very little bearing once you get to the interview - and believe me, if your capable of doing the GAMSAT, it’s very easy to get interviews, so please don’t be discouraged.
As I said, I have a 2:2 and I don’t have an offer (yet, hopefully), but I have 4 interviews at St. George’s, Notts, Swansea and Kings(5 year). I will report back when I get responses, although, this will obviously be anecdotal. I got a 2.2 because I didn’t try hard enough in my BSc - however, I know I’d be capable of doing perfectly well in GEM - if you honestly think you are good enough, and have the entry requirements, then go for it. Simple as. Be smart when applying (ie avoid the Birmingham’s), but do not be discouraged overall. A lot of universities are very holistic (Swansea have actually said they are holistic), as you would hope for from this type of degree.
You are in a very good position to go for GEM - good luck.
(edited 6 years ago)
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