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Student subjected to racist abuse at Nottingham Trent University

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Original post by PQ
The woman concerned didn't tell the university - she told her hall reception/security team who did nothing. It was only after a couple of days of nothing happening that she went public (and helpfully a number of people advised her then to call 101 to report it - including the local police on twitter).

You would hope that hall reception/security staff would know to redirect a student instead of just brushing it off and doing nothing for days.
http://www.upp-ltd.com/ have been very quiet about their involvement in this - considering they sell themselves as "Our partnerships are about creating safe and secure homes and learning environments designed to help students succeed." (http://www.upp-ltd.com/students-and-parents.php ) and boast about how great their staff are http://www.upp-ltd.com/our-people/?s=tracey-vallis-horn

http://www.upp-ltd.com/management/?s=jon-wakeford this guy is not doing his job well - or maybe that's deliberate tactics to let NTU take the flack....works ok in the short term but is likely to destroy their commercial partnerships longterm if universities know they're likely to get the blame for UPPs incompetence.



Completely agree. They will need to review their relationship with UPP and make sure it never happens again. Fortunately someone took the video which is self explanatory. I think I would have been so angry I would have taken it to NTU straight away and probably the SU to give it as wide an airing as possible. I'm not sure the police would have to be a better choice because the uni has the power to expel them. Police cna get hem a criminal record later.

I cant see how they wont get expelled, assuming she knows who they are. I expect its a group and not just the one on the video who can be heard. they still need evidence for due process.

I expect UPP need NTU a lot more than NTU needs them.
Original post by Good bloke
This appears to be yet another case where someone reported a crime to the wrong people. Why tell the university who do nothing for hours when the police service is right place to make the report (and who treat hate crime as a priority), preferably while the crime is still being committed?


Maybe because she expected nothing from police(probably quite likely as she is a black woman)and thought uni might give a toss about her?

I do find it interesting how more and more people seem to react to stuff like this now, blaming the victim ...never bought the official line on Brexit- but now I think there is an element of truth with what's happening and cross fertilizing with the USA.

Ironic also that we provide safe spaces for the most minor offences but seemingly are slow to offence about this.
(edited 6 years ago)
Original post by Fruli
To me speaks to a wider issue around the calibre of people entering university these days.

As someone already mentioned, people are entering university with DDD these days. That speaks a lot.

A degree these days is not even worth the paper it’s not on. Recruiters talk about poor quality hires when it comes to graduates. Then we wonder why graduates struggle to get good jobs upon graduating.

Letting all and sundry into university is devaluing university honours.

It’s interesting how the racist thugs always come from these lower ranked universities. The former UKIP member who said horrible things about Meghan Markle and black people happened to have attended Canterbury Christ Church University. There’s an interesting trend.


Firstly. I do agree with you. People achieving low par grades should not be attending universities. Nor should they be accepted on an technicality. Like you said degrees are far too common and too popularised to be of much worth anymore.
HOWEVER. Tarnishing a universities reputation is another thing. I attend said university, however I achieved ABB at A Level. I am not on the same level as those who managed to get into university with CCC or whatever else they accept people on nowadays. Going there does not make me dumb.
Universities (all universities) should increase their grade requirements because I think it lowers the calibre for students like myself who attend non RG and have achieved good grades. My personal opinion but I don’t measure myself against such people, I got good grades and deserved them but I hate that I’m also subject to knowing people believe I’m on the same scale as someone accepted with CCD or something of that nature. And yes, these are bad a level grades, I wish people would stop sugar coating it for those who need a pick me up.
Original post by PQ
The woman concerned didn't tell the university - she told her hall reception/security team who did nothing.


I missed the significance of that. Cut out the middleman, is my advice - call the police direct.


Original post by chelseadagg3r
who are supposed to deal with things of this severity immediately and help get the student to the right people, including the police


It is a pity they didn't then. It would have been simpler to call 999 during the incident than to wait until the following morning and report it to someone who caused a further delay.
Original post by 999tigger
Completely agree. They will need to review their relationship with UPP and make sure it never happens again. Fortunately someone took the video which is self explanatory. I think I would have been so angry I would have taken it to NTU straight away and probably the SU to give it as wide an airing as possible. I'm not sure the police would have to be a better choice because the uni has the power to expel them. Police cna get hem a criminal record later.

I cant see how they wont get expelled, assuming she knows who they are. I expect its a group and not just the one on the video who can be heard. they still need evidence for due process.

I expect UPP need NTU a lot more than NTU needs them.


I agree that UPP as her landlord had a duty of care to sort out the fact that her flatmates were behaving threateningly towards her. Regardless of NTUs response UPP should evict tenants who threaten other tenants....not sit on complaints for days leaving a victim living with the people who threatened her.
Original post by SaucissonSecCy
Maybe because she expected nothing from police(probably quite likely as she is a black woman)and thought uni might give a toss about her?


Well, had that been true, and it obviously wasn't, she could have complained about a poor police response. As things turned out, she could potentially have had the nasties caught red-handed.
Reply 26
Avatar for Fruli
Fruli
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21
Original post by Good bloke
Well, had that been true, and it obviously wasn't, she could have complained about a poor police response. As things turned out, she could potentially have had the nasties caught red-handed.


You’re blissfully ignorant if you don’t mind me saying.

Your theoretical models may fail in practice. The police don't always deal with racist incidents.

If people started reporting racist incidents on 999, they would be ridiculed.
(edited 6 years ago)
Original post by Good bloke
Well, had that been true, and it obviously wasn't, she could have complained about a poor police response. As things turned out, she could potentially have had the nasties caught red-handed.


Well, hardly weird to report them to the uni that you are a part of and expect them to do something.

It's entirely normal.

I find this detour you are going on a bit suspect.

And re the police I was talking nationally, and historically- she would have good basis for thinking she would be ignored.
Reply 28
Avatar for Fruli
Fruli
OP
21
Original post by SaucissonSecCy
Well, hardly weird to report them to the uni that you are a part of and expect them to do something.

It's entirely normal.

I find this detour you are going on a bit suspect.

And re the police I was talking nationally, and historically- she would have good basis for thinking she would be ignored.


Very suspicious indeed.
Original post by Fruli
Very suspicious indeed.


It's weird how more and more people seem to think like this now, there is a weird denial and justification going on that has the seeds of something quite dark- and it is quite often in previously pretty balanced, fair people, which makes it more concerning.
Original post by PQ
I agree that UPP as her landlord had a duty of care to sort out the fact that her flatmates were behaving threateningly towards her. Regardless of NTUs response UPP should evict tenants who threaten other tenants....not sit on complaints for days leaving a victim living with the people who threatened her.


Course they do and it will be in the licence agreement.
It may be the min wage staff member just sat on it. Incompetent or worse didnt care. Poor training or worse.

I imagine most students will be outraged at UPP, but it remains to be seen whether this was a one off. Both of them are going t need more training and resources to make sure complaints are handled quickly and professionally. Sounds to me like they were just morons.

Wonder if their parents will be shocked?

Can SFE refuse finance if yoube been expelled?
Original post by SaucissonSecCy
Well, hardly weird to report them to the uni that you are a part of and expect them to do something.

It's entirely normal.


As has been pointed out, that is not what happened. She waited until the next morning. She reported it to the hall, not the university. There were two middlemen between the victim and the police. There need not have been any.

It may be normal, but it is wrong. Crimes should be reported to the police, who can be assumed to have no reason to brush them under the carpet to protect their reputation - unlike charities, universities, schools and any other organisation you might care to mention..
Original post by Fruli
The police always deal with racist incidents.

If people started reporting racist incidents on 999, they would be ridiculed.


Can you not see the contradiction in what you write? How can they deal with what is not reported? 999 is the most appropriate place to report a violent incident while it is happening.
Original post by SaucissonSecCy

I find this detour you are going on a bit suspect.


Original post by Fruli
Very suspicious indeed.


Then you are a pair of clowns. There is nothing suspicious about my stance. You seem to want to imply that I support the perpetrators, which is ridiculous. I have condemned the perpetrators of this incident as nasty people. They should be arrested and punished. This could have happened sooner if the victim had called the police as I have said.
Original post by Good bloke
As has been pointed out, that is not what happened. She waited until the next morning. She reported it to the hall, not the university. There were two middlemen between the victim and the police. There need not have been any.

It may be normal, but it is wrong. Crimes should be reported to the police, who can be assumed to have no reason to brush them under the carpet to protect their reputation - unlike charities, universities, schools and any other organisation you might care to mention..


Are you oblivious to their record on cover ups and corruption, infiltration, politicization? UK police are corrupt amd have huge problems with institutional racism.

Anyone would trust a Uni first.

But regardless, I still find your insistence on this detour very creepy and suspect, it's like you're trying to do something Kafkaesque and insidious to her and taking the focus from where it should be.
(edited 6 years ago)
Original post by Good bloke
As has been pointed out, that is not what happened. She waited until the next morning.

No she didn't - she reported it to the hall reception in the early hours of Tuesday morning when it happened (which she described as Monday night).
Original post by SaucissonSecCy
Are you oblivious to their record on cover ups and corruption, infiltration, politicization? UK police are corrupt amd have huge problems with institutional racism.


Don't be silly. What happened here proves that she would have been better served by going to the police on the night.
Reply 37
Avatar for akr123
akr123
7
Welcome to Brexit Britain ladies and gentlemen.....
Original post by PQ
No she didn't - she reported it to the hall reception in the early hours of Tuesday morning when it happened (which she described as Monday night).


Ah! I read Tuesday morning as Tuesday morning and Monday night as Monday night. My mistake. She would still have been better calling 999 though.
Original post by akr123
Welcome to Brexit Britain ladies and gentlemen.....


I always thought this was nonsense, but this is where I understand...

I mean, this is just giving me the creeps, it's literally causing physical revulsion.

I find overt racists who just state their positions much less sinister. Indeed, some of these even reform and reform honestly.

It's the insidious, mass complicity in the respectable, tide turning in ordinary mainstream people and looking the other way, diversions, denial- all have the hallmarks of the 1930's.

Not saying it's reached that but the echoes are creepy.

Even the BBC supposedly wildly 'left' (It isn't it's 'liberal' , completely different thing) and their anchorwoman this morning framed this as; (aggressive tone) to the girl- 'What did you expect them to do?'. Not what did you think they would do? Or what do you think the should do?

And recall Amber Rudd and the proposed foreign worker 'lists'?

This country only ever loved 'diversity' when it was part of a large mass of exploitable Labour it seems.
(edited 6 years ago)

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