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People who revise excessive amounts

I have been thinking : to what extent can you get away with being not particularly talented at a subject but really hard working. Ive always thought that kids who get by solely on working extremely hard will hit a banana skin eventually, like they will at some point no longer be able to just revise really hard and still get the grades. As you go higher in some subjects, the concepts become more difficult to understand and apply so just memorising and rote learning is no longer sufficient. In some ways i think its more harmful for kids to get by just on hard work because it can lead them down a path that theyre not cut out for. I think it depends on the subject though

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Most 'excessively' hard-working people hit a point where they can no longer reach the top grades no matter how hard they work. From what I've observed that point is often A-Level (where they are unable to get straight A*s), but it varies from person to person of course. I don't think there's anything wrong with the approach of always putting in as much effort as you can but in that case you need to accept that you have limits, especially when the subjects get more deep/specialised and 'general' intelligence/hard work alone don't cut it anymore.
Original post by Nihilisticb*tch
I have been thinking : to what extent can you get away with being not particularly talented at a subject but really hard working. Ive always thought that kids who get by solely on working extremely hard will hit a banana skin eventually, like they will at some point no longer be able to just revise really hard and still get the grades. As you go higher in some subjects, the concepts become more difficult to understand and apply so just memorising and rote learning is no longer sufficient. In some ways i think its more harmful for kids to get by just on hard work because it can lead them down a path that theyre not cut out for. I think it depends on the subject though


How much revision is excessive?
It’s not all about hard work it’s about exam technique and working smart. Not really any need to study 10hours a day in a level... exam season about 5 hours is good
(edited 5 years ago)
Original post by Nihilisticb*tch
I have been thinking : to what extent can you get away with being not particularly talented at a subject but really hard working. Ive always thought that kids who get by solely on working extremely hard will hit a banana skin eventually, like they will at some point no longer be able to just revise really hard and still get the grades. As you go higher in some subjects, the concepts become more difficult to understand and apply so just memorising and rote learning is no longer sufficient. In some ways i think its more harmful for kids to get by just on hard work because it can lead them down a path that theyre not cut out for. I think it depends on the subject though


I think it varies from person to person, and also from subject to subject. Some subjects at A Level mirror a sophisticated memory test tbh, and with these types of subjects I feel as though hard work pays off. However, in other subjects, I feel natural skill is needed otherwise you’re kinda “capped” at a certain grade (which sounds kinda fatalistic tbh) e.g. I currently do Biology A Level, and I feel as though I’m limited in the highest grade I can get because I can’t interpret the questions for example.
When you compare people, who do not have learning difficulties or special conditions (such as savant syndrome), I think natural talent is insignificant. Although still existing, I think it's overly exagerated.
Original post by romansholiday
I think it varies from person to person, and also from subject to subject. Some subjects at A Level mirror a sophisticated memory test tbh, and with these types of subjects I feel as though hard work pays off. However, in other subjects, I feel natural skill is needed otherwise you’re kinda “capped” at a certain grade (which sounds kinda fatalistic tbh) e.g. I currently do Biology A Level, and I feel as though I’m limited in the highest grade I can get because I can’t interpret the questions for example.


I agree. I think in a practical sense, you cant rote learn real life. Like if you were a doctor, you couldnt just memorise every single possible situation and their solutions. Its the same in other professions : you have to apply it.
Original post by runtime-error
When you compare people, who do not have learning difficulties or special conditions (such as savant syndrome), I think natural talent is insignificant. Although still existing, I think it's overly exagerated.


What makes you think this?
Original post by IrrationalRoot
Most 'excessively' hard-working people hit a point where they can no longer reach the top grades no matter how hard they work. From what I've observed that point is often A-Level (where they are unable to get straight A*s), but it varies from person to person of course. I don't think there's anything wrong with the approach of always putting in as much effort as you can but in that case you need to accept that you have limits, especially when the subjects get more deep/specialised and 'general' intelligence/hard work alone don't cut it anymore.

I should clarify, i dont work very hard at all but i know a lot of people who do. I only do GCSEs at the moment and i think even for some people GCSEs are already the wall really. I know people who revise loads and loads but dont do well. I know one girl who revised every day the week before the end of unit geography test and ended up getting a grade 2 (equivalent to an E grade). So yeah i think there are two factors. I think the point where you hit the wall is dependent on natural ability.
Original post by Kakemono
How much revision is excessive?


Well thats completely subjective. I would say revising more than 6 hours a day is excessive.
Reply 10
Avatar for gjd800
gjd800
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Well, through hard work you can become good at a subject. I started out being crap at loads of things and through hard work (which includes application etc as mentioned above), I've got dead good at them.

Sure we might have natural limits etc, but this discussion is all pretty arbitrary.
Academic intelligence is 99% from nurture, not from genetics. If you have worked hard for a long time you will become adept at picking up and understanding concepts, regardless of your underlying natural intelligence. It is a myth that people with some higher level intelligence are automatically better than everyone else. True, people are born with varying intelligence quotas, but with enough training (studying, practice etc) a less than average intelligence individual can perform more efficiently and quickly than someone with a reasonably high IQ. The idea that people can just completely wing it and smash it out the park is one promoted by the film industry (I.e Good will hunting, Interstellar, Theory of everything) and by the fact that people lie about how much work they are actually doing.
Original post by Nihilisticb*tch
What makes you think this?


How exactly do you measure natural talent, excluding people who have learning difficulties and special conditions? Natural talent is based on biological factors solely. When you think about the environmental factors, such as early exposure, either indirectly or directly to certain subjects, pressure from parents to do well, chip on the shoulder ... How do you measure it?
(edited 5 years ago)
depends on the subject

for stem: effort = good grades
Original post by Nihilisticb*tch
I should clarify, i dont work very hard at all but i know a lot of people who do. I only do GCSEs at the moment and i think even for some people GCSEs are already the wall really. I know people who revise loads and loads but dont do well. I know one girl who revised every day the week before the end of unit geography test and ended up getting a grade 2 (equivalent to an E grade). So yeah i think there are two factors. I think the point where you hit the wall is dependent on natural ability.


I should also clarify that when I say 'you', I'm referring to the third person. But yeah natural ability is a key factor, as well as working efficiently and revising in effective ways.
What is the effective way of revising?
I'll just chuck this in 'ere https://www.mindsetworks.com/science/

Intelligence not fixed kids

Original post by Astrainlinat
What is the effective way of revising?

Varies by person, but for almost everybody trying to teach somebody else what you've learned is highly effective.
Original post by runtime-error
How exactly do you measure natural talent, excluding people who have learning difficulties and special conditions? Natural talent is based on biological factors solely. When you think about the environmental factors, such as early exposure, either indirectly or directly to certain subjects, pressure from parents to do well, chip on the shoulder ... How do you measure it?

Just because it cant be measured doesnt mean it doesnt exist. Thats a complete fallacy. Yes it cant be measured but there is some truth in that i know people who revise all day every day and struggle to pass while i know people who revise only the night before ans get A*s.
Original post by IrrationalRoot
Most 'excessively' hard-working people hit a point where they can no longer reach the top grades no matter how hard they work. From what I've observed that point is often A-Level (where they are unable to get straight A*s), but it varies from person to person of course. I don't think there's anything wrong with the approach of always putting in as much effort as you can but in that case you need to accept that you have limits, especially when the subjects get more deep/specialised and 'general' intelligence/hard work alone don't cut it anymore.


for me it started with Gcse physics and then A-Levels. i revised excessively but what shocked me was that i was still getting Ds. i had never experienced somethig like that before. usually when i get bad, ik its becuase i havent worked hard enough but for this it was idfferent. its a bit of a shock at first, you learn techniques of revision e.g. past paers instead of just memorisation.
Reply 19
Avatar for gjd800
gjd800
20
Original post by Nihilisticb*tch
Just because it cant be measured doesnt mean it doesnt exist. Thats a complete fallacy. Yes it cant be measured but there is some truth in that i know people who revise all day every day and struggle to pass while i know people who revise only the night before ans get A*s.


I barely 'revised' at all (at least not in the sense that you lot seem to) for exams, including at degree level. I just spent a lot of time reading around stuff during the term and making sure I knew stuff at the time. If you keep on top of that, there's no need for this heavy handed 'revision' shite that schools filly our head with.

I hasten to add that I still 'worked hard' and it wasn't down to talent. It was down to keeping my nose in books for an hour an evening when my mates were sat off on their xboxes.

I think a lot fo you use 'hard work' in a peculiar sense, actually.

Also, your man didn't say it didn't exist - he said putting too much emphasis on it when you can't even measure it is unwise. And that's likely right.

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