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If slavery was so bad...

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Original post by Arran90
If slavery was so bad then why do descendants of slaves continue to embrace the languages, names, and even cultural practices of the country of origin of their slave drivers?

For example, most Jamaicans have British surnames, which were originally the surname of the slave driver of their ancestors, rather than African surnames. Very few of them have changed them back to African surnames. Even their first names are often British inspired or Biblical. Jamaicans overwhelmingly follow Protestant Christianity which was the religion of their slave drivers. They also continue to admire the Queen.

In Mauritius the descendants of African slaves speak Creole as their language which is a mixture of 18th century French and some African languages. Mauritius became a British colony in 1810 and experienced a large influx of south Asians in the late 19th and early 20th century, but the African community made no efforts to change their language to English or a south Asian language. In fact the south Asians switched from their native languages to Creole. Even today the African community overwhelmingly prefers French to English as a formal and international language. They are Catholic by religion - the same as the French slave drivers - and the most common first names are Jacques and Marie with African names uncommon.

Logically the descendants of slaves would outright reject linguistic and cultural practices of their slave drivers on principle if slavery was really as bad as those in power and influence in the 'civilised' world claim it to be, but they don't. It's a strange anomaly.


if you go to North Africa you find people of Europe descent who were taken as slave by Arab Muslim slave traders because they were Christian and light skin.

They were forced to become Muslim by there Arab slave masters and today still live in North Africa and are still Muslims.
Reply 21
Original post by petalsunrise
do you know freed slaves went back to places they had worked as slaves to ask for work, as they had no other options i.e being released from cotton field only to go back and ask for work on it again.


Yes, I know about this.

I still think that Stockholm syndrome is a major factor within slavery and is overlooked by people of a liberal disposition in more recent times.

It intrigues my why descendants of slaves rarely make any efforts to rediscover and return to their roots. DNA testing can be used to identify whether they have distant cousins in the countries of their origin.
Reply 22
Original post by Arran90
Yes, I know about this.

I still think that Stockholm syndrome is a major factor within slavery and is overlooked by people of a liberal disposition in more recent times.

It intrigues my why descendants of slaves rarely make any efforts to rediscover and return to their roots. DNA testing can be used to identify whether they have distant cousins in the countries of their origin.


It intrigues me why you think people would want to ignore a massive part of their heritage.
Reply 23
Original post by Dheorl
It intrigues me why you think people would want to ignore a massive part of their heritage.


If that's your argument then it raises a question as to how far back their heritage goes and whether it's the culture of their ancestors from before or after they were taken as slaves.

I'm not sure how good an analogy this is but if the descendant of a slave decides to return to his roots by embracing the culture and identity of his ancestors from before they were taken slaves then it's like the owner of an elegant Victorian house removing the 1960s renovation efforts with its hardboard and woodchip wallpaper then restoring the original Victorian architectural features that were ripped out by the previous owners.
Reply 24
xxx nvm
(edited 5 years ago)
Reply 25
Original post by Arran90
If that's your argument then it raises a question as to how far back their heritage goes and whether it's the culture of their ancestors from before or after they were taken as slaves.

I'm not sure how good an analogy this is but if the descendant of a slave decides to return to his roots by embracing the culture and identity of his ancestors from before they were taken slaves then it's like the owner of an elegant Victorian house removing the 1960s renovation efforts with its hardboard and woodchip wallpaper then restoring the original Victorian architectural features that were ripped out by the previous owners.


But every part of that heritage is a part of their story. As I say, why are there so many Irish people who have kept the "O'" in front of their names. Why are there Jewish people who have kept the names given to them by the Germans? It's far from just the descendants of victims of slavery who do this.

And the architectural example is a really terrible one to use with me. I hate listing rules and the fact everything is deemed to be at it's best the moment it was built. Buildings should be allowed to evolve with time as their usage changes. Trying to freeze it at one point in time, to me, is borderline moronic.
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Reply 27
Original post by Dheorl
But every part of that heritage is a part of their story. As I say, why are there so many Irish people who have kept the "O'" in front of their names. Why are there Jewish people who have kept the names given to them by the Germans? It's far from just the descendants of victims of slavery who do this.


There are people who turn their back on some or part of their heritage for a variety of good reasons.

And the architectural example is a really terrible one to use with me. I hate listing rules and the fact everything is deemed to be at it's best the moment it was built. Buildings should be allowed to evolve with time as their usage changes. Trying to freeze it at one point in time, to me, is borderline moronic.


It's not a case of freezing it at one point in time. An elegant Victorian house can have up to date electrics and central heating along with the latest security systems and internet routers side by side with its original architectural features. What has been removed from it was the outdated modernising effort from the 1960s where the owner ripped out the cast iron fireplaces and the woodwork only to replace them with hardboard and MFI fitted wardrobes then covered the walls with woodchip wallpaper. Are you saying than an owner of such a house today should have to live with 1960s woodchip wallpaper and not restore the original Victorian skirting boards because the modernising efforts of the 1960s are part of the heritage of the house? Should the owner also live with the 1960s electrical wiring and boiler which are also now obsolete?
Reply 28
Original post by Arran90
There are people who turn their back on some or part of their heritage for a variety of good reasons.


Can you give an example of what you mean.

Original post by Arran90
It's not a case of freezing it at one point in time. An elegant Victorian house can have up to date electrics and central heating along with the latest security systems and internet routers side by side with its original architectural features. What has been removed from it was the outdated modernising effort from the 1960s where the owner ripped out the cast iron fireplaces and the woodwork only to replace them with hardboard and MFI fitted wardrobes then covered the walls with woodchip wallpaper. Are you saying than an owner of such a house today should have to live with 1960s woodchip wallpaper and not restore the original Victorian skirting boards because the modernising efforts of the 1960s are part of the heritage of the house? Should the owner also live with the 1960s electrical wiring and boiler which are also now obsolete?


But why does it have to be the original architectural features? Why can't they take out some of the 60's stuff and put in what they want, knock through a few walls, add some fancy glass features, a steel kitchen, whatever. People whose ancestors suffered due to slavery are still building on their culture, it's not like they haven't created anything new for themselves and it's not like they haven't retained any of the original. It's all part of an evolving story. The use of language example that you state clearly isn't "outdated" as much of the world speaks a similar language, so why would you remove it?
The fact that traditional language, religion, customs and so on were able to survive in creolised form despite the brutalities of the slave trade, mass displacement of people, and the often violent legal repression of traditional cultures is, if anything, testament to the endurance of those cultures.
1. I am Nigerian, born in Britain
2. My great great great grandfather was persecuted
3. I despise the topic
4. I wish to forget it
5. The above (my relative) only narrowly survived to have a child and died of untreated Pneumonia.
6. I wouldn't be here if he wasn't freed when he was.
7. I get the stares when we learn about this in class, I march out in fury with tears in my eyes.

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